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I had to use a spatula to slide the pies off the peel....
Using a little more bench flour when pressing out your dough ball will absorb surface moisture and prevent sticking.... or a touch more flour or (yuck) cornmeal on the peel might be the trick. Join the forum over at Pizzamaking.com...lots of good info. Or that other place......
 

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Discussion Starter · #202 ·
Btw, what are you doing for your dough, making it yourself?
It's i guess the same recipe that my wife has been doing for years. It's a quick dough, we use sugar to proof the yeast. Might try an overnight dough the next time. Might try making some cheese as well and doing one of those Margharites, I think my wife would really like them
 

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Discussion Starter · #203 ·
Using a little more bench flour when pressing out your dough ball will absorb surface moisture and prevent sticking.... or a touch more flour or (yuck) cornmeal on the peel might be the trick. Join the forum over at Pizzamaking.com...lots of good info. Or that other place......
There is nothing on gods green earth that would make me use corn meal...good for corn bread and con muffins and that's it.

It wasn't sticking, it just wasn't sliding off on it's own, a flick of the wrist and I could get it off but also lost 1/2 the toppings. Some of it could also be that the oven is pretty high since I haven't put the stone down for the patio yet. I'm sure practise will make perfect.

The other place is your site? I check in once a week or so but there haven't been any updates recently. I'll post up there tonight. Right now I've got to go out and do the outer arch
 

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There is nothing on gods green earth that would make me use corn meal...good for corn bread and con muffins and that's it.

It wasn't sticking, it just wasn't sliding off on it's own, a flick of the wrist and I could get it off but also lost 1/2 the toppings.
That's funny, I feel the same way about cornmeal. IMO, it completely ruins the pizza with all the grit and burnt bits...blahhh!

I think you need a touch more bench flour by the sounds of it. Practice makes perfect. :thumbsup:
 

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There is nothing on gods green earth that would make me use corn meal...good for corn bread and con muffins and that's it.

It wasn't sticking, it just wasn't sliding off on it's own, a flick of the wrist and I could get it off but also lost 1/2 the toppings. Some of it could also be that the oven is pretty high since I haven't put the stone down for the patio yet. I'm sure practise will make perfect.

The other place is your site? I check in once a week or so but there haven't been any updates recently. I'll post up there tonight. Right now I've got to go out and do the outer arch
50 50 mix of ap flour and semolina. Stuff is like ball bearings.
 

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Discussion Starter · #206 ·
We just have all purpose. It is fine, maybe I'll get some semolina at the health food store for the next time. That's pasta flour right? or is that durham?
 

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The other beauty of a slotted peel is that you can flour it with whatever flour you are using very heavily, then just a couple of jiggles back and forth and it all falls out, and the pizza launches with no issues.
 

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We just have all purpose. It is fine, maybe I'll get some semolina at the health food store for the next time. That's pasta flour right? or is that durham?
Semolina is from durham.

Some grocery stores have it, any Italian food stores stock it.

Adding a pinch of corn meal to some flour to help the pizza slide on the peel isn't a crime either.

If you build your pizza fast you can do it right on the peel, but if you are slow you risk sticking, I pull from the board onto the peel. If my pizza sticks to the board a bit pull up the edge and blow under it, that lifts it up gently and forces some flour in there. Be prepared for flour to become airborn and your wife get pissed off.
 
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It may sound strange to you all but Ive been making pizza on my BGE for years and I use parchment paper to make all my pies on. I also use it to slip the pie on to the grill . A few seconds of cooking and i can slip the paper right out from beneath the pie . Its become my permanent crutch from buying a peel .
 

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I have pizza screens which are great if you need to pump out a lot of pies.
 

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Parchment paper is great in a kitchen oven, it is ash above 550 degrees.

I use 25% semolina flour (Indian, very fine, not like the coarse available normally) in most of my doughs. It gives a very nice tooth to the dough, but I do not use it on the bench.

I also have screens and use them a lot for my preferred Neo-Neapolitan style. I make 14-16" pies, and they are too large to fit on the peel. I remove the screen after about a minute, and then cook them directly on the floor for another 2-3 minutes.

Here is a typical pizza, cooked at around 750-800 degrees for about 3 minutes, started on a screen, final diameter about 16", Italian sausage, mushroom, and onion. The dough is 75% AP, 25% semolina, maybe 1% salt, .25% ADY, cold fermented for 24-36 hours. Hydration is up around 62-63%.
 

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Not a stupid question at all. The problem with cooking a pizza is that you have to achieve a perfect balance between top heat and bottom heat. The floor will almost always be more conductive than the heat available from the top, so you have to design the oven such that it will equalize the heat into the pizza.

This does not matter much at lower temps, like those for bread baking, 400-500 degrees, but as you move up the scale to WFO pizza it becomes critical. Ideally, you want a fairly non-conductive floor (like low duty fire brick), and a higher rate of conductivity in the walls and ceiling.

Since this is not really practical, the next best method is to shape the dome to both focus heat and be close to the floor. The higher the temp you plan to cook at, the lower the ceiling needs to be. This allows the material of the dome to cook via indirect heat, IR.

Typical general purpose Pompeii ovens will have a ceiling that is 40-50% of the diameter of the oven while a strict Neapolitan oven will be closer to 25-30%.

They are dome shaped in general because that is the most natural form that is self supporting.
 

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Discussion Starter · #214 ·
If you build your pizza fast you can do it right on the peel, but if you are slow you risk sticking, I pull from the board onto the peel. If my pizza sticks to the board a bit pull up the edge and blow under it, that lifts it up gently and forces some flour in there. Be prepared for flour to become airborn and your wife get pissed off.
That might be the issue. We stretched the dough out then built the pizzas on the peel, didn't take a crazy amount of time but a minute or 2 anyway. The plan is when i get the rest of the thing finished it will be almost like an assembly line. Make the pizzas on the counter and fire them in, one can be making their pizza while the other is cooking theirs. then by the time it's down to a 4 or 5 minute pizza we can be building a larger one to finish off for the adults...or something like that. I don;t want to be building the pizzas inside that's for sure
 

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Discussion Starter · #215 ·
I guess it's been a while since I updated. been making pies once a week or so since my last post, with varying degrees of success. All have been good, no fails, but I'm still trying to nail it.

The biggest thing has been the dough. My wife's dough is good but a little inconsistent, she doesnt measure anything and we're fine with that. Its also more of a bread dough and while good I want a more gluteny dough. I've also done Tscars dough that he has posted on his brokebrick site. I like it a lot but it is very wet and I find it very difficult to work with. The results are terrific though. I've been surfing and have found a few different recipes for neapolitan style dough, but no 2 seem even similar. One recipe had 1/3 tsp of yeast to 7.5 cups of flour and another had 1.5 tsp to 13 cups of flour (this recipe is from the same youtube channel that Stoncutter linked earlier to do with using the peel) (most recipes use weights, some use both grams and ozs making it difficult so I convert everything to fluid measurements).

Then there is water. A liter (4 cups) of water used in the recipe with 13 cups of flour, and Tscar uses 3.5 cups to 5 cups of flour...more water by weight than flour (although he uses a LOT of bench flour to make up for it). So in my reading it seems that the longer the ferment the less yeast you need for a decent rise (although in many recipes this doesn't always co-relate) and the more water the less kneading required. Also flour is obviously a big one as well. I use AP (Canadian AP has about 12% protein so is pretty good) but there are others who insist on semolina, or 00 only, it's so confusing

I'm going to try one from another youtube guy,Fidel Montoya, next week. he seems to take his pizza fairly seriously but is quite informative. Anyone else have any good recipes or food science they want to share? My fathers and my aunt and my grandmother were all bakers but my aunt is the only one still around and where she worked she had to follow recipes exactly so she never learned much about the science involved so she's not much help except with technique. It's too bad my dad was a bread guy and was always switching up styles, he knew the science quite well
 

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Pizza dough isn't bread dough, that is for sure. If you have a mixer, you do not need the very high hydration, I do not, so mine is wet to facilitate hand mixing, and also to provide the steam to blow up the rim.

Gluten is formed by time or by kneading, so do not do both.

Salt will kill yeast, but it also activates it, so getting that part correct is crucial. The easiest way to do it is by using dry yeast and dry salt directly into the dry flour and mixing that dry before adding water. Most Neapolitan guys add salt to the water, then flour and, if used, dry yeast. Sourdough is by far the best for flavor, but is too much work for me.

Recipes for dough do not really work, humidity and variance in flour make a big difference in the final dough. I always hold back about 25% of the water to add if needed.
 

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Discussion Starter · #217 · (Edited)
If you have a mixer, you do not need the very high hydration, I do not, so mine is wet to facilitate hand mixing, and also to provide the steam to blow up the rim.

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That's one of the things i like about your dough. Kneading isn;t something that i find particularly stimulating. Everyone wants you to knead for 8-15 ,minutes. I think I've been kneading for a solid 5 minutes and I look up and it's only been 2...ugggh

I should add though that the fist bake that we did was my wifes wing it dough and so far they've been the best pies. She got the basics from a cook with your kids cook book about 10 years ago and hasnt looked at it in probably 7...but it;s pretty much a bread dough
 

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I have made good bread from pizza dough, and vice versa, but really they are not the same. Bread normally has sugar and/or oils, and woodfired pizza dough should never have either, although kitchen oven pizza needs some sugar to facilitate maillard reactions.

WFO pizza cooks too fast and at too high a temp to be able to utilize the sugars and the oils are simply not needed.
 
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