Contractor Talk - Professional Construction and Remodeling Forum banner

1 - 17 of 17 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
533 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
i`m going to frame up a partition on a finish marble floor.
but they don`t want me to screw the wall down.
I`m trying to find out if I caulk it with layex ,, or silicone caulk , , or maybe use heavy duty Velcro tape, or double stich-tape ,if , over time , will it bleed into the tiles and stain them.
its in a high end ,14,000 sq. ft water front home.
its actually being rented out to a consulate.

the owner/landlord is pretty concerned about this.

apparently its a pretty expensive marble , its in 24 inch squares , and is pure white.its got a high polish finish on it .
they want to close the kitchen off from the living room.
its aprox , 16 ft, x 10 ft. high,
iy will be screwed into an existing wall , and the ceiling.
it`ll also return and go 8 ft, into another wall.

any input?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,245 Posts
Some sort of rubber, either feet or sheet is what i would try to come up with. I'd be concerned whatever method is used that it will stain.
 

·
Thom
Joined
·
4,137 Posts
Marble is soft as butter. I would be concerned with cracking the tile with the concentrated weight of the wall.
 
  • Like
Reactions: MarkJames

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,523 Posts
Not all silicones are neutral cure. Some use an acid formula which will eat into the marble. Latisil from Laticrete is neutral cure.

I think I would silicone the wall plate onto small squares of Corian or similar product that was finished nailed in the grout joint.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
662 Posts
Does it matter? The wall weight will crack the stuff in time, then replace it all then!

AND why or what are they doing this for??? Save the MARBLE??

Some things just don't make sense to me!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,245 Posts
Does it matter? The wall weight will crack the stuff in time, then replace it all then!

AND why or what are they doing this for??? Save the MARBLE??

Some things just don't make sense to me!
If you read what the OP stated it's a very high end property being rented out to possibly a person from a foreign country. They may not like the open concept and want the kitchen separated. The owner wants to be able to remove the wall with no damage to what might be very expensive marble.

If it's a 14,000 sq. ft. home you could imagine that could be a lot of tile to replace. I also wouldn't assume that the weight of the wall would crack the tile, the only way I see that happening would be from too much pressure from possible movement.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,819 Posts
Maybe use light gauge steel studs and ultralight sheetrock to lessen weight of wall?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
146 Posts
I'm not picturing the layout well. Any way to run a header just off the floor to act as bottom plate keep the bottom straight & fairly rigid & point load the walls own weight on to existing?

Sounds like maybe it's 2 new walls with a corner. IF the bottom "plates" are made stiff enough, and the tie ins to the existing and the corner itself are locked in solid, it seems like it would be fine with no floor anchors in new walls. Think of it like a triangle where the leg between the ties into existing is implied but not actually present. (That leg doesn't actually have to be there, the exist points just cant move in order to keep the new point (new corner) in position.) The 2 new legs of the triangle need to be continuous and rigid (maybe real heavy gauge track w/additional reinforcement, box header, or horizontal LVL as bottom plates). Might feel a bit springy if actually pushed, but should stay in place. No door openings allowed with this idea of course.

Weight bearing issue is different consideration. Could be hung perhaps. I think the marble would probably bear the actual weight of just the wall itself as long as the thinset bed is well done underneath. Seems live load deflection of floor and ceiling would be the forces that could cause it to crack.

Could point hang a post at the new corner to just off existing floor. You could go so far as to make mini lvl strongback "bottom plates" to deal with both lateral rigidity of bottom plates, and weight bearing issues. At a glance it seems excessive, but could be workable.

There is obviously huge money in the owners pockets. If they want a good solution to an odd problem in a very high end setting, don't skimp on the solution or your compensation for it. It's not your problem if it is ridiculously expensive to run 24' of wall while meeting their desired parameters.

I actually like JAH's idea of a couple minimal floor pins into grout lines. Extremely minimal visual impact if well patched (if ever). But maybe that's just thinking too normal, with normal reasonable budget mentality.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
146 Posts
For some reason I just pictured the owner standing in this giant gazillion dollar oceanfront mansion, in his 950k kitchen, fiddling with his cabinet door opener remote control, saying- "What! You want almost $1600 just to do that! Pepe, the pool boy's assistant's assistant, said he could easily do it for less than $700. I can't afford to be scammed like that by people like you!"
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
747 Posts
Analysis Paralysis....
If weight is a issue build the wall 1/4 short and screw it to the header. Then use the finish nail to lock the bottom in place.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,385 Posts
I'm not picturing the layout well. Any way to run a header just off the floor to act as bottom plate keep the bottom straight & fairly rigid & point load the walls own weight on to existing?

Sounds like maybe it's 2 new walls with a corner. IF the bottom "plates" are made stiff enough, and the tie ins to the existing and the corner itself are locked in solid, it seems like it would be fine with no floor anchors in new walls. Think of it like a triangle where the leg between the ties into existing is implied but not actually present. (That leg doesn't actually have to be there, the exist points just cant move in order to keep the new point (new corner) in position.) The 2 new legs of the triangle need to be continuous and rigid (maybe real heavy gauge track w/additional reinforcement, box header, or horizontal LVL as bottom plates). Might feel a bit springy if actually pushed, but should stay in place. No door openings allowed with this idea of course.

Weight bearing issue is different consideration. Could be hung perhaps. I think the marble would probably bear the actual weight of just the wall itself as long as the thinset bed is well done underneath. Seems live load deflection of floor and ceiling would be the forces that could cause it to crack.

Could point hang a post at the new corner to just off existing floor. You could go so far as to make mini lvl strongback "bottom plates" to deal with both lateral rigidity of bottom plates, and weight bearing issues. At a glance it seems excessive, but could be workable.

There is obviously huge money in the owners pockets. If they want a good solution to an odd problem in a very high end setting, don't skimp on the solution or your compensation for it. It's not your problem if it is ridiculously expensive to run 24' of wall while meeting their desired parameters.

I actually like JAH's idea of a couple minimal floor pins into grout lines. Extremely minimal visual impact if well patched (if ever). But maybe that's just thinking too normal, with normal reasonable budget mentality.
I like this idea. Just make it like a suspended deck beam a few inches off the floor. Lam beam it at the bottom and hang the short wall off of it. Then build your wall on top of that. Trim it so it just sits off the floor and be done with it. Easy Peasy.

I would assume your budget is pretty much non existent up to a point. They are mostly concerned with not redoing a very expensive floor. If your solution solves that problem, you have done your job and they will be happy.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
533 Posts
Discussion Starter #15
Does it matter? The wall weight will crack the stuff in time, then replace it all then!

AND why or what are they doing this for??? Save the MARBLE??

Some things just don't make sense to me!
it doesn`t matter if it seems ridiculous or not. if you sign up for a job , you do it the best you can.

its a pretty unique floor.and it goes through all rooms , on both floors.
it`d be a shame if they had to try to replace it and couldn't`
the house is from the 40`s , and has been totally re-done and I is in pristine condition. its easily in the $15 million range.
I did use the pure silicone/ it went fine .
truly , no one won`t know if it stains or not , until it is removed
the consulate who is renting it , most likely will stay there over 10m years.
as for the weight, it isn`t that bad.
I used mostly metal studs.
I adheised a wood 2x4 to the floor, then put a metal track on that.
I did the same on the ceiling.
then I put wood studs every 4 feet, and made the rest with metal studs to keep weight down.
`
they`re great clients.
I`ve been maintaining the previous house they rented , for the last 7 years.
they
thanks for the input guys
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
533 Posts
Discussion Starter #16
Analysis Paralysis....
If weight is a issue build the wall 1/4 short and screw it to the header. Then use the finish nail to lock the bottom in place.
theres no room for finish nails . these tiles are tight together.
I asked about trying to hit the joints , they said absolutely not.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
533 Posts
Discussion Starter #17
If you read what the OP stated it's a very high end property being rented out to possibly a person from a foreign country. They may not like the open concept and want the kitchen separated. The owner wants to be able to remove the wall with no damage to what might be very expensive marble.

If it's a 14,000 sq. ft. home you could imagine that could be a lot of tile to replace. I also wouldn't assume that the weight of the wall would crack the tile, the only way I see that happening would be from too much pressure from possible movement.
they have a live in chef. he is almost as important as the general residing there.
they sometimes entertain as many as 300 political big wigs.
the chef wants the kitchen closed off . I have to sound-proof the wall too.
 
1 - 17 of 17 Posts
Top