Vinyl over OSB

12413 Views 21 Replies 9 Participants Last post by Tom Struble, Jan 9, 2010

BillD

Discussion Starter · Jan 7, 2010

How would you handle this?

I worked on two homes in different developments in the last year where the vinyl siding was installed directly over the OSB, no Tyvek or tar paper, nothing. At one home I did replacement windows and the other I re-built a garage wall the HO ran into. In both cases it was brought to the attention of the homeowner but they were not interested in making any repairs at the time.

Both developments are relatively young, one having 10-15 homes and the other having a fair amount more. Each development had one builder so I think it is likely they did the same thing on other homes.

I want to target the other homes in the developments with some marketing, but am not sure how to go about it. I thought about sending a letter to each home introducing myself and explaining what I found and the problems (mold, rot, etc.) it will cause, and offer an inspection (to see if they had the same problem) for a small fee which would be deducted from the contract if I was to do the repairs.

I feel this has good potential to produce some work. Is the assumption that other homes were done the same too big of one? Any thoughts would be appreciated.

Bill

1 - 20 of 22 Posts

SLSTech

· #2 · Jan 7, 2010

Bad assumption - Nope, probably right on the money

The letter would not work in my area, but it may in yours & there is only 1 way to find out

Is the builder still liable for damage / shoddy work / houses still under warranty - you might mention it if they are

Burns-Built

· #3 · Jan 8, 2010

Hey Bill. Just ran into the same thing myself. Installed some Suncast hose reels for a lady whose son was my best friend a long time ago. Anyhow they live in a very nice house built 16 years ago. Pulled some high end vinyl off to attach my mounting block, and wala....nothing just osb. You pay to have a custom house built thats suppose to be high end and you get a half a** siding job. Like you though, i don't think the people will go for tearing all there nice siding off for some stupid vapor barrier you say is important. Oh if they only knew......

MJW

· #4 · Jan 8, 2010

You can't blame the builder. This stuff was not code back then and wasn't trusted. People were under the impression that siding was completely waterproof.

Wait a few more years when we get to tear these houses completely apart because off all the poly trapping moisture and the OSB holding it in from the outside. That stuff does NOT breathe. Try pulling a nail behind the siding in the field where it missed a stud. It will be all rusty.

This energy crisis is going to cost everyone in the near future. Hopefully some Contractors can make a little money fixing this crap though.

BillD

Discussion Starter · #5 · Jan 8, 2010

Thanks for the response guys. I do not think they can go back to the builder because of the age of the homes. The best I can tell most were built in the 90's.

I know it was not code to install Tyvek but anyone that thought vinyl siding was water proof is not very smart.

Where I re-built the garage wall the OSB was completly deteriorated 16" away from the jamb, the bottom of the king and jack studs were rotten and there was mold inside the wall cavity.

SLSTech - I am curious as to why you feel it would not work in your area?

Bill

MJW

· #6 · Jan 8, 2010 (Edited)

I have to say, siding can be rather waterproof with proper flashing. When vinyl siding flooded the market, it was the same as roofing now......People think anyone can do it and it will be fine. Just like the roofing, "contractors" came out of the woodwork everywhere installing it.

This is especially on new homes. The contractor usually goes with the cheapest bid, then, well......we all know what you get then.

There are thousands of homes around here that have leaks, that probably won't be noticed by the homeowner for years.

Here is a pic of a simple mistake with flashing. The homeowner noticed ants in that room behind this wall. He got an exterminator to get rid of the ants, but never went any further until we resided the house for him. There was tarpaper there, but it wasn't done properly.

See less See more

Tom Struble

· #7 · Jan 8, 2010

MJW...get some mitts on that ladder:w00t:

MJW

· #8 · Jan 8, 2010

tomstruble said:
MJW...get some mitts on that ladder:w00t:

That's the old siding we were tearing off. :thumbsup:
You should've seen how bad that barn red vinyl faded! It was terrible. CT paid for all new siding and labor. Lucky for this guy, he got most of his other problems fixed also.

Reactions: 1

woodworkbykirk

· #9 · Jan 8, 2010

thats a pretty scary looking photo, they dont even have ice and water running up the wall where the roof line meets the wall behind the step flashing

Tom Struble

· #10 · Jan 8, 2010

MJW said:
That's the old siding we were tearing off. :thumbsup:
You should've seen how bad that barn red vinyl faded! It was terrible. CT paid for all new siding and labor. Lucky for this guy, he got most of his other problems fixed also.

i just like to bark orders ...don't mind me:thumbup:

Tom Struble

· #11 · Jan 8, 2010

ive also pulled old vinyl with no paper and the sheathing looked brand new and dry as a bone:blink:

MJW

· #12 · Jan 9, 2010

tomstruble said:
ive also pulled old vinyl with no paper and the sheathing looked brand new and dry as a bone:blink:

The rest of the house was fine and had very little paper on most of it. With proper flashing, it works out pretty good. These guys just got lucky.

MJW

· #13 · Jan 9, 2010

woodworkbykirk said:
thats a pretty scary looking photo, they dont even have ice and water running up the wall where the roof line meets the wall behind the step flashing

The I&W up the wall is not necessary. No water should even get to that point. I&W belongs on the roof under the step flashing. House wrap goes over the flashing and it taped.

This is if there isn't any ice dams that are created. Usually not present in the newer houses that are vented and insulated properly.

SLSTech

· #14 · Jan 9, 2010

Bill, based off my experience - until they see it, hear about it from a neighbor - they would ignore the letter (for most of the area's I work in). That is one reason why I stated, it might not work in my area, but it might in yours - the cost is minimal to find out.

Framer53

· #15 · Jan 9, 2010

tomstruble said:
ive also pulled old vinyl with no paper and the sheathing looked brand new and dry as a bone:blink:

I have done houses without tyvek and have had no problems to date. I have been back and tore out some siding on some of them.

Key is the flashing details!:thumbsup: ( little luck doesn't hurt either)

BamBamm5144

· #16 · Jan 9, 2010

MJW - Thank you for clarifying that. I was going to say the same thing about the I+W.

I am kinda surprised to see how many contractors depend on it to stop all of their water problems. If a roofing and siding system is done properly, there will be no leaks. All of these guys that are obsessed with using I+W are going to make it very difficult for the next contractor and very expensive for the homeowner. I+W DOES NOT remedy a poor installation. Remember, roofs did not leak when installed properly with only using good old 15# felt and 3-tab shingles.

That last tin shingle should have had a "kicker" for it to divert into a gutter. I run into that situation more than I would like.

Reactions: 1

MJW

· #17 · Jan 9, 2010

BamBamm5144 said:
That last tin shingle should have had a "kicker" for it to divert into a gutter. I run into that situation more than I would like.

Kick out flashing is now code....here anyways.

Tom Struble

· #18 · Jan 9, 2010 (Edited)

not code around here yet,some of the better siders now pull the back of the j onto the face of the siding atleast but that does nothing for the water on the step flashing

the effort must be made on resides too

BamBamm5144

· #19 · Jan 9, 2010

Tom - I assume you left the step flashing in and then covered that with the continuous flashing to make a more finished look. Thats looks good but the next guy to tear off the roof is going to be like "who was the ahole that did this!"

Did you go over the old stuff or tear it off?

oldfrt

· #20 · Jan 9, 2010

It always amuses me that a little common sense and a quarters worth of flashing can save a couple of thousand dollar repair down the line.
The last time I found this omission on an HO's home,the rot had entered the framing and door casing.
Three cheers for the professional siders that take the time to do it right.:clap:
Thumbs down to the weekend warriors that will forever create new work for the profession down the line.:furious:

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