Looking at that made my head hurt.

 

Lol.. not sure if you mean the shoddy 1930s framing or all the random off cuts to keep the cats from getting too curious.. but it's driving me crazy either way

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Reminds of a guy I know I call 2 nail Richard. Bust that gas valve open throw a match & run


Mike

 

Sometimes I wish I could. Just trying to keep this shack from falling apart for now.

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Is this your house and are you a contractor?

 

This is my house and I am in the trade

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Give us some background

Who are you? What are you doing? What are we looking at?

You a builder? This your house?

 

Building out an inlaw suite on the 2nd floor of my house. The area you're looking at is where the kitchen is planned, specifically the sink. The original floor is sloping due to the lack of structural support, and the beam/sill plate are sagging. About 1 1/2 inches out of level. I'll deal with that later. You might be able to make out the level line if you look at the photo close enough. Foundation was found to have no issues. Upon pulling up the subfloor I found what you're looking at here.

But more importantly, what are your thoughts short of cutting into the ceiling below? The way these joists are joined with no support below is a bigger problem than a sagging beam, at the moment. It's held up for 90 some years this way. Obviously don't wanna push it, that's why I came here. Especially considering added weight in this area. Currently, I do have someone locally I'm waiting to hear from tomorrow about custom hangers.

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Hi Richard, we just want to confirm that you are in the trades as this is a site for actual contractors to discuss topics and not a homeowner site to get free advice from.

What is it that you do in the trades?

Andy.

 

I understand. Currently just a draft jockey with a CAD cert, but I'm acting as general contractor to make this my first rental property and move my career from here.

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Any chance you have a picture for a little further away. Hard to see what’s going on so close up

 

Hope this helps. So you can see it's an exterior wall. The "beam" running above the joists is sagging. The joists are only nailed to each other as they cross the beam, and then into the beam/sill plate, with no support below as the bottom floor extends another 5 feet beyond the 2nd story exterior wall. I'm looking for a solution to the load integrity, or lack thereof, at this crossing. But I'm sure I answered my own question by now, and I'll have the custom hangers made up soon.

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So you are going to be adding more weight to a failing area without consulting a engineer.
I don’t believe that you have the experience to make a informed decision and should hire someone to make the right decision for you. I do not believe that a “hanger” is the proper way to fix your problem.


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There is so much going on there that is not even close to right. How abut stepping back a little to get more of a picture of the room.

 

Typical s^*t they did in the old days... As time went by anyone who was doing repairs kept cutting stuff up.
Finding something like this in dated homes is nothing new, you must be new to the trade or a homeowner.

 

This is how guys like you who try to play contractor and do rentals and “flips” get yourselves such a bad reputation.

Don’t half-ass and cover up an already half-assed disaster. Do it right.

And doing it right is bringing in someone with more experience than you at the least, and probably an engineer.

Real hard to tell all that’s going on from those pictures, but custom making some bracket when you have so little experience is not the right way to fix it.

 

You should probably hire someone with experience to come in and advise you.

 

There may or may not be a prescriptive fix for this. You need to learn about those, you can do them without an engineer.

Custom brackets are never a part of a prescriptive fix.

There isn't enough clear information to see what's going on. Load paths from above all the way to the foundation need to be looked at to make sure any fix is going to solve all the issues

 

Run!, Forest Run!

Even IF you do fix it, will it EVER pay you for the risks you took? I.e. the same amount of labor and cash could fix five other old buildings with out crappy framing......

That is catnip to the permit authorities, they could milk you like a porn star, then deny a occupancy permit, because it STILL doesn't meet today's or the code in effect when built......

Would You loan the owner money from YOUR pension fund?

Some old buildings need to torn down prior to killing their inhabitants.

 

This isn't accurate or good business. A contractor isn't responsible for hidden conditions.
Anyone who works on old homes is going to find things like this, they have to be repaired by someone, why not the guy who's already there? It's a valid extra. You determine a proper repair, if you can't then you get an engineer involved. Once you have an understanding of what needs to be done you write up a change order.
Simply saying "I can't do this" and walking away is bush league. You're a professional builder, and if you're remodeling you're also a problem solver. If you're neither of those you have no business starting the job to begin with.

 

Why hasn't this thread been closed?

 

Treat it like a clients or like you really care . If this was me -I need so much more info .This looks like I would be best to tear ,rip and open till I really have a handle on the problem .Your comment on the slopped floor on first floor and fixing it latter .that's scary. 1st floor gets fixed first . there is a tendency to cut corners - do not do it .

 

Lag bolts? Custom hangers? Leave em alone?

This is a second floor, back supporting wall above, no wall below. 1st floor goes another 5 feet back. Loosely 'sistered' joists span those 5 feet. 'Beam' and sill plate above and perpendicular to joists spans about 10 feet across. View attachment 516209

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It has lasted this long. LOL! I might use like Simpson A35 from the bottom plate to the side of the joists, then sheet the one side of the wall with 1/2 cdx to make it a box beam-ish. Then some common 20 penny nails though the lap joint. Really I would ask an engineer friend or something. Or solid block between the joist and then sheet vertical wall with 1/2 cdx. Just anything to help that wall act like a beam and then attach the joist to the "beam."

 

Lag bolts? Custom hangers? Leave em alone?

This is a second floor, back supporting wall above, no wall below. 1st floor goes another 5 feet back. Loosely 'sistered' joists span those 5 feet. 'Beam' and sill plate above and perpendicular to joists spans about 10 feet across. View attachment 516209

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#1 buy a good liability policy.
#2 take $ 500 out of you “profit” and buy a structural engineers time to help you with the structure
#3 repair according to the engineers design recommendations/sketch