[dhebert]

Hello y'all !

I have a heavy class 4 cedar shake roof that was totaled in a recent hailstorm. I have decided to replace it with a stone coated steel panel product, see pic. My roofer has explained that installing it over the existing shake is desireable because of the insulation characteristics and support to the steel panel that the shakes provide.

I am not completely convinced and looking for a second opinion.

Got one?

 

[Grumpy]

Blargh?

He wants to go OVER the cedar?! I do not see how the shakes will offer any support any better than the wood substrate (decking). INfact I think the cedar will provide an uneven surface for your new steel shingles.

Why would you want to insulate your roof deck, unless you have a vaulted ceiling? The insulation should be at the ceiling joist, not the roof deck. Your ventilation will let out all the attic air, so there should be no reason to insulate.

Has your roofer installed these before? What type of steel shingle is this? Check the manufacturer's recomendations.

Is this guy really a roofer? Where did you find him? I'm scared. Sounds fishy.

Contact Pgriz from this forum, he is an expert in metal shingles!

 

[dhebert]

The product is this: http://www.gerardusa.com/canyon-roofing.htm

The roofer is Needham out of Dallas.

I suspect the tear off is easy insurance money if he dosen't have to actually do it!

 

[jmorgan]

Gerard is a good name in stone coated shingles. I can't believe they would recommend going over old heavies.
Jim

 

[pgriz]

Blargh?

He wants to go OVER the cedar?! I do not see how the shakes will offer any support any better than the wood substrate (decking). INfact I think the cedar will provide an uneven surface for your new steel shingles.

Why would you want to insulate your roof deck, unless you have a vaulted ceiling? The insulation should be at the ceiling joist, not the roof deck. Your ventilation will let out all the attic air, so there should be no reason to insulate.

Has your roofer installed these before? What type of steel shingle is this? Check the manufacturer's recomendations.

Is this guy really a roofer? Where did you find him? I'm scared. Sounds fishy.

Contact Pgriz from this forum, he is an expert in metal shingles!

Thanks for the kind words, Grumpy! I'm thinking on the same lines as you. I'd strip down to the sheathing, then put on the new stuff. Of course, many metal shingle manufacturers claim you can leave the old roof on, but what they are doing is saving the cost of the tear-off and making the expensive metal roof a bit less expensive. In my book, however, it's a cheap shortcut that short-changes the customer. I also agree with your comments on the "insulation" of the deck and the ventilation.

Went to the Gerard site, and saw that they apparently don't use strapping below their shingles (unlike Decra). I'm trying to locate the Gerard installation instructions (none on the web site unless I'm blind...). But at the end, I would not feel comfortable with a "layover" - strip to the sheathing, repair any rot or damage, check that you have good ventilation, then put on the product.

 

[dhebert]

Thanks guys. I'm going to leave the old shake roof on. A couple of reasons:

I spoke with a neighbor down the street and he did what I'm planning a few years ago and swears his utility bills are lower.

The roof installation has a lifetime warranty.

The product has a lifetime warranty.

Tear off is $30 per sq plus $10 per sq for steep roof thats $1200 for 30 sq roof. I would have to pay this.

No money out of pocket for me.

Roofer has been around for 30+yrs with a good reputation.

Thats it. Thanks again for all your input.

Dhebert

 

[Specialist]

It makes economic sense, but should not help with the utility bills. Many of the reps I have heard speak have said their metal shingles can be installed over shakes. I have never done this. When we reroof, we tear it all off and repair the deck as needed. I have personally installed layovers, but we do not here.

 

[dhebert]

I think you are making a mistake that will decrease the longevity of your new roof.

I'm not to concerned as both the product and labor are warrantied for life.

P.P.S you can lead a horse to water but ya can't make him drink.

I do appreciate the input from everyone. :Thumbs:

 

[Teetorbilt]

Does anyone know where dehebert hails from? Here shakes are famous bug breeding grounds and prone to dry and wet rot. Enclosing them under humid conditions would be a serious mistake on all counts.
I'm not a roofer, but have done more shakes than anything else. Very popular in the 60's- mid 70's down here, I did some roofing back then.

 

[dhebert]

Money talks Grumpy and to that you have a point.

I currently have a ruined cedar shake roof due to hail. My third in 6 years. The previous two times I ponied up the deduct and moved on. This time I'm paying the deduct and putting the tear off money towards an upgraded metal roof. I cannot afford the metal roof upcharge without the tear off money.

Gerard warranties the roof over shakes. Needham warranties the labor. Both are LIFETIME warranties. My homeowners insurance drops $240 a year when I lose the shakes. The metal looks great and increases the resale value of my home. Sound deadening from the hail storms is better. How can I lose?

One thing I don't understand is why would would not want an insulated roof?

 

[Grumpy]

www.rollvent.com www.airvent.com www.lomanaco.com Search attic ventilation in this forum also try searching ice damn or ice dam

 

[dhebert]

www.rollvent.com www.airvent.com www.lomanaco.com Search attic ventilation in this forum also try searching ice damn or ice dam

Good links. Thanks.

 

[GunnCon]

$40.00 a Square to tear that roof off? That is so cheap. Are you sure he knows what he is doing and is Licensed and Insured? That is the FIRST question I would ask. Also the contractor that told you Not to tear off the roof does not know much about roofing or is just out to sell you a roof. Cedar shakes have VERY little R-Value and can't even be concidered insulation. As for and insulated roof you have insulation in your attic that is first and formost of all. Furthermore you need to know what your sheathing and flashing looks like before you install the new roofing so a tear off in my opinion is very important.