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Soft finish on water based poly. HELP!

19K views 24 replies 10 participants last post by  CarpenterSFO 
#1 ·
My flooring guy did a great job for me on my floors but the finish is still soft. You can scratch it with your finger nails and furniture destroys it. He used three coats of water based polyurethane and sanded in between. Any ideas?

I apologize if this has been addressed in another post but I can't find anything. Thanks.
 
#2 ·
Need more than that. What was the name brand and name of the finish? What were the conditions like when it was applied?
 
#7 ·
My guy used Varathane Water Based Poly, Satin Finish, Heavy Use Formula from Lowes. We did have the heat on in this house (electric heat pump, dry heat, probably 65 degrees on average). The soft finish is ONLY over the stained floors. The unstained floors are fine. I did watch him apply all three coats and they were thin.

Here is what he used:

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Varathan...ane-2-Pack-200241H/202057137?N=5yc1vZaqstZ641

Thanks so much guys! My flooring guy is good but he is too busy right now to get out and look at it.
 
#10 ·
there is no bond then..if the stain was tacky then it was a no go for waterbase. the job needs to be sanded.

you may be able to pull that off with an oil finish, but no way water.

Minwax stains need at least 2 day dry time before attempting a strait water application over it..we have actually given 3 and stopped using it due to this.

Now only use Dura seal fast dry formula.

we allow it to dry over night and no issue.

If we feel a little antsy about it, we will seal with universal sealer first then apply the finishes.

1) you are never too busy to to address a customers concern. that Is BS. if there is an issue you go assess and discuss it and offer remedy.

2) the finish is garbage..no pro uses this crap
Varathane now has a pro finish line but really haven't heard anything good about it.
 
#12 ·
Stain needs to completely dried before applying the poly coat. If you apply poly over tacky stain.........it will never lock into the wood. The poly cooked off before the stain dried..........hence the lack of adhesion.


Resand and start over.
YUP! ^^^What they all said^^^

Stain wasn't dry and the waterbased isn't allowing the oils to evaporate. It ain't Rocket Surgery - Oil and water don't mix. Sucks for you. It MIGHT dry out over time, but I doubt it.

That's why I don't use Minwax if I'm doing a water finish. Use DuraSeal next time.
 
#15 ·
its not a matter of seeing problems as much as realizing its less than a professional application and if you can stop at a local paint store to by finish for your floor job, its quite hackish.

the finish is not durable enough to offer a reasonable quality job by professional standards/

none of our floor houses here in NJ carry a "varathane " product.,

the guys i first started in the biz with would do this..pick up varathane or carver tripp water base finishes and give a customer garbage

granted back in the day when water base was fresh and new and not a popular choice with the selection of quality available today..it was still an amateur decision.
 
#16 ·
That is quite the illogical reasoning you are using there. The source of purchase does not have a logical impact on the product itself. I was curious, so I looked up the solids % of a few water-borne products:

Varathane - 28.6%
Bona Mega - 30%
Bona Traffic - 34%
Basic Hydroline Plus - 28%

So, there may be better coatings, but Varathane is in there as far as solids.
 
#20 ·
its not illogical.

amateur products are sold at box , hardware and paint stores.
professional floor finishes can not be purchased like that..its either through a distributor or online floor supply.

solids do not the finish make.

i haven't used their new nano shield pro finish line, but I did get a call a while back from someone who recently had it done and he complaint wa sit scratched so easily.

that was the first I heard of the finish..
 
#17 ·
I used Varathane when I was a kid, would buy it at Ernst and use it on furniture. I never thought it worked very good but it was the only thing I knew existed, I always thought it looked like a thick goop and not real professional. I haven't used Varathane in about 25 years so I'm sure it's changed since then. But if you're going to purchase stuff at Home Depot or Lowes then you better know exactly what you're looking for so you don't end up buying crap. Home Depot or Lowes will do their purchasing from anywhere regardless of quality, where as a specialized building supply store will take their time and select stuff that works.

But it sounds like your flooring guy didn't know how to read the directions on the label, drying time is listed on every paint, stain, and varnish. I know it's hard to find competent flooring guys that's why I usually do it myself. If I'm going to hire someone, I'm real particular, ask lots of questions, look at references, preferably someone I've used before. Have you tried calling the tech support to Varathane about the problem?
 
#18 ·
I used Varathane when I was a kid, would buy it at Ernst and use it on furniture. I never thought it worked very good but it was the only thing I knew existed, I always thought it looked like a thick goop and not real professional. I haven't used Varathane in about 25 years so I'm sure it's changed since then. But if you're going to purchase stuff at Home Depot or Lowes then you better know exactly what you're looking for so you don't end up buying crap. Home Depot or Lowes will do their purchasing from anywhere regardless of quality, where as a specialized building supply store will take their time and select stuff that works.

But it sounds like your flooring guy didn't know how to read the directions on the label, drying time is listed on every paint, stain, and varnish. I know it's hard to find competent flooring guys that's why I usually do it myself. If I'm going to hire someone, I'm real particular, ask lots of questions, look at references, preferably someone I've used before. Have you tried calling the tech support to Varathane about the problem?
Is this a fact, or something you pulled out of your



hat?
 
#21 · (Edited)
I talked to the manager of a local hardware store about the varathane about 2 years ago. He had used it on his own floors. He was figuring out how to remove it and said the store had gotten nothing but complaints about it not being hard enough for floors. Aren't all the pro-level water-based finishes all catalyzed? The varathane isn't. Why? It's a trade-off - the standard big-box trade of ease of application for lower quality.

As for the OP's situation? That tacky stain. Sand and redo.
 
#24 ·
Aren't all the pro-level water-based finishes all catalyzed?
No. For example - Bona Mega is a 1 part. It's not nearly as durable as Traffic (catalized), however. I've never used Varathane on a floor, but have on various other things over the years and it's a pretty damn strong finish. Not as good looking as oil, but dries fast.
 
#23 ·
Before I sanded it all off I would screen and recoat with traffic. If I was the refinisher any way. Two hours and a hundred bucks with the chance I could save myself three days and four hundred dollars.

The op never said the finish is delaminating or crackled so imo its not the stain underneath, its the home owner qualith finish on top.
 
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