[Mr_Stop]

I'm curious if the preference is to still use the side terminals with a wrapped wire, or just use the back connection with the screw clamp (not push to connect)?

Years ago, when I was trained in residential electric, my instructor said back stabbing was a big no-no. Because of this, I have always used the side screws. Since this time, I see more switches & outlets with a screwed back connection than the old "push to connect" style.

The back is certainly much easier and faster (especially with 12 AWG). I'm just having a hard time getting over my mental block...

 

[Inner10]

Back connections that use screw terminals are not the same as back stabbing. I'd use em all day long.

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[480sparky]

Back-stabs are perfectly legal and acceptable.

I love those who use 'em. They make me a ton of money every year. Myself, I never use 'em.

 

[tjbnwi]

The AHJ's I work in back stabbing is not allowed by code amendment. Can't use the push in type wire "nuts".

Back loading when the device has a screw tighten pressure plate is acceptable and my preferred method.

Tom

 

[Mr_Stop]

Thanks for giving me peace of mind to get over my mental block! I'll still never use the back stabs (sorry @480sparky), but I'm going to start using the screw type back connections for ease of use.

 

[480sparky]

The AHJ's I work in back stabbing is not allowed by code amendment. Can't use the push in type wire "nuts".............

Any AHJ that does not allow NRTL results for a device should be flogged, then forced to submit an proposal to the NEC (replete with documentation supporting their claim) to disallow them. This implies they have more knowledge, skill and testing resources than said NRTL, which obviously they do not.

Not allowing totally acceptable products or methods simply because 'they don't like it' is a tremendous dis-service.

 

[overanalyze]

Are those the little connectors Halo has on all their can lights?

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[480sparky]

Are those the little connectors Halo has on all their can lights?

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Wagos.

Perfectly acceptable.

 

[overanalyze]

I love those in cans lights. When we install cans in existing attics it is just one less thing I can lose in the blown insualtion...lol!

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[tjbnwi]

Any AHJ that does not allow NRTL results for a device should be flogged, then forced to submit an proposal to the NEC (replete with documentation supporting their claim) to disallow them. This implies they have more knowledge, skill and testing resources than said NRTL, which obviously they do not.

Not allowing totally acceptable products or methods simply because 'they don't like it' is a tremendous dis-service.

They delete their use the same as they delete back stabbing. Both work on the same principle of connection.

From a previous post of yours, you like the tension type connector because you make money off of them, but won't use them. Why wont you use that style of device connection.

Tom

 

[Irishslave]

Seems a straight stripped wire whether backstabbed or clamped seems better than looped around a screw.....I was always taught "bends" in the wire create heat.

 

[480sparky]

They delete their use the same as they delete back stabbing. Both work on the same principle of connection.

From a previous post of yours, you like the tension type connector because you make money off of them, but won't use them. Why wont you use that style of device connection.

Tom

I was taught to use screw connections. That doesn't make me the Supreme Overlord of Electrical Splices. Ergo, I do not have the authority to be forcing anyone to use one method over another.

And neither should an AHJ.


Truthfully, I don't use back-stabs because if there's more than one cable in the box, that means there's a whole truck-load of wires attached to the device. This makes it much harder to nestle the wires into the box, get the screws lined up, and get the device to lay 'flat' with the wall.

 

[tjbnwi]

I was taught to use screw connections. That doesn't make me the Supreme Overlord of Electrical Splices. Ergo, I do not have the authority to be forcing anyone to use one method over another.

And neither should an AHJ.


Truthfully, I don't use back-stabs because if there's more than one cable in the box, that means there's a whole truck-load of wires attached to the device. This makes it much harder to nestle the wires into the box, get the screws lined up, and get the device to lay 'flat' with the wall.

If that's the case---how or why do you make money off of those that back stab the devices?

Tom

 

[480sparky]

If that's the case---how or why do you make money off of those that back stab the devices?

Tom

From those who don't use them correctly. I also make money off those who don't use wire nuts correctly, and I make money off those who don't know how to use screw terminals correctly. I've also made money off those who don't know how to use pressure plates correctly.

 

[Mr_Stop]

If that's the case---how or why do you make money off of those that back stab the devices?

Tom

I'm guessing it's because the older outlets & switches with the backstab devices were known to loosen up over time necessitating repairs.

 

[FrankSmith]

I prefer the wire to be attached to the side screw because it allows me to see that the wire is well connected

 

[tjbnwi]

From those who don't use them correctly. I also make money off those who don't use wire nuts correctly, and I make money off those who don't know how to use screw terminals correctly. I've also made money off those who don't know how to use pressure plates correctly.

Which has the higher incidence of failure?

No NM here either, also a code amendment from various AHJ's around here.

I don't recall Chicago code ever allowed backstabbing (or NM), no NEC there.

Tom

 

[Tinstaafl]

I've run into crappy Wago connections more times than loose screw-downs. I'll take the screw for the win.

 

[480sparky]

Which has the higher incidence of failure?

I see slightly more back-stab failures, but emperical data from one person is not trustworty.

I don't recall Chicago code ever allowed ...... NM..

The Windy City has allowed NM in the past. I have a 1930 ChiTown codebook that says so.

Strangely, no one knows why they don't allow NM. I don't hear about all the suburbs burning down........... like Chicago once did.............

 

[tjbnwi]

I see slightly more back-stab failures, but emperical data from one person is not trustworty.



The Windy City has allowed NM in the past. I have a 1930 ChiTown codebook that says so.

Strangely, no one knows why they don't allow NM. I don't hear about all the suburbs burning down........... like Chicago once did.............

Thanks for the update on Chicago and NM.

Most of the suburbs also write NM out of the NEC. I can't think of one that allows it.

I'm just messing around about the back stabbing, it's just not a connection I have confidence in.

Tom