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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
I have a comment with regard to liability insurance. I checked with my insurance carrier and they exclude all lead, asbestos and mold. When I checked around it seems to be a common theme. The only way to cover a lead job is to buy a policy for that specific job. If we go into a house with the current rules, give all the information to the homeowner without testing the occupants and the entire work area for lead prior to starting work that could be the end of the company. After the job if the owner tests the carpet and there is lead they can sue you saying that you must have contaminated that even though you used lead safe procedures and your insurance company will just highlight the exclusion in your policy. Can't even imagine what would happen if some kids lead levels were high after a remodel without a test showing they were high when you started. This is a lose lose situation since nobody will be able to afford to hire somebody to legally work on a pre 78 house and the contractor won't be able to afford everything to protect their business to work on those homes. Can't wait for the tv ads about "did you have a renovation done on your pre 78 home - call Law Office to find out how you were harmed and get the money you deserve" I think my companies new specialty will be "anything newer than 1978"

Does anybody know if their insurance covers anything to do with lead??
 

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Joseph A. Capece
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I'm starting an RRP job next week. I contacted my insurance company but wasn't able to touch base with my agent (the owner stated that I need to talk to my agent). I'll let you know what I find out.
 

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Carpe Diem
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I would make sure they know the difference between lead remediation and RRP. They might assume you are remediating when it's only RRP. Some might consider the 2 the same, but I'd make 100% sure you're both on the same page.
 

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Project Manager
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Good point by Angus.

Unfortunately, most brokers DO NOT know the difference between lead remediation and RRP.

They will however, try and sell you a lead rider to the tune of $3k and up a year.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Not sure if the attorneys would care either way if lead contamination occured. They tell us enough in the class that there would be no out. I need to look at some insurance coverage so as long as I am following the rules they will be helping me fight a potential battle. Still the paperwork burden is incredible.
 

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Joseph A. Capece
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I heard back from my agent

Apparently, my insurance company treats any interaction with lead paint the same regardless if it's remediation or not. My liability premium nearly doubles (from $1,200 a yr. for a 1 million dollar policy to $2,200 a yr.). Since this is the only RRP job I have in the near future, I asked if I could take out a policy for a single job. To no avail, they are unable to provide coverage for a single job. How do you RRP compliant guys deal with all of this?
 

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Project Manager
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Apparently, my insurance company treats any interaction with lead paint the same regardless if it's remediation or not. My liability premium nearly doubles (from $1,200 a yr. for a 1 million dollar policy to $2,200 a yr.). Since this is the only RRP job I have in the near future, I asked if I could take out a policy for a single job. To no avail, they are unable to provide coverage for a single job. How do you RRP compliant guys deal with all of this?
Sub out the lead remediation work to a certified company, thus releasing you from any reliability and any increase in insurance premiums.
 

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@Cooke - I agree with you and for one job, this is what I would do. As I've mentioned before, you will want to make sure you have a sub-contractor agreement between you, the gc, and the sub, the lead renovator.

You may also want to have a 3rd party verifier come in and check the work.

It sounds like extra work, but it is a lot less than doing the RRP compliance on your own.
 

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I believe that the company doing the contract work with the owner will have to be the Certified company. I doubt you will get by passing the burden onto a sub and they shouldn't pass it onto you.
I wouldn't put my neck on the line for another contractor with the EPA involved.
 

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Joseph A. Capece
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Some good points, BUT, I didn't drop the near $1,000 to get my Lead-Safe license just to have another contractor come in to do the work that I am licensed & qualified to do. Because my insurance increases by $1,000 I have to "guestimate" how many RRP jobs I'll expect to get in an average year and spread the extra insurance cost over that time & add it in to my overhead for each RRP job (i.e. if I expect 2 RRP jobs a year, each job will pay an additional $500 for my increased insurance costs) I advertise the crap out of the fact that I am a licensed firm so the more jobs I get, the less each HO has to pay. I like to keep my RRP overhead separate so that I can keep my prices down for the majority of projects that don't involve any of this silliness to begin with.
 

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Capra Aegagrus
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I like to keep my RRP overhead separate so that I can keep my prices down for the majority of projects that don't involve any of this silliness to begin with.
That sounds somewhat logical on the face of it, but I don't think it's the best plan.

Overhead for the business is overhead, period. With the above plan, you aren't going to be competitive on the RRP work. Spread your cost of doing business equally among all jobs, and though that will raise the price of non-RRP work a bit, no job will be outlandishly expensive.

Do you figure the cost of your table saw into only those jobs on which you use it?
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Don't forget all the costs of blood tests for employees, employee monitoring until you prove your systems are safe, air test lab fees, etc. Almost need to have a full time person to just keep up with the paperwork requirements for the customer and employees.
 

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Joseph A. Capece
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That sounds somewhat logical on the face of it, but I don't think it's the best plan.

Overhead for the business is overhead, period. With the above plan, you aren't going to be competitive on the RRP work. Spread your cost of doing business equally among all jobs, and though that will raise the price of non-RRP work a bit, no job will be outlandishly expensive.

Do you figure the cost of your table saw into only those jobs on which you use it?
Good point--can't argue with reason. It'll be spread so thin throughout each job, it'd barely be noticeable anyways--don't know what I was thinking.:stupid::laughing:
 

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Don't forget all the costs of blood tests for employees, employee monitoring until you prove your systems are safe, air test lab fees, etc. Almost need to have a full time person to just keep up with the paperwork requirements for the customer and employees.
It sounds as if you're blaming these costs on RRP, or did I miss your point? The paperwork requirement for the customer is the only part that's new in almost 20 years, and it's trivial compared to the rest.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
I guess my point was don't just figure the additional cost of insurance into the increase in overhead. There will be a lot more expense involved away from the job site that needs to be accounted for or it will drive your profit margin the wrong way. If you do not have a HR person on staff or a dedicated staff to do this extra work that will fall into the owners hands which I would guess are pretty busy already.

I am impressed that you have been doing blood tests for lead and all the monitoring for 20 years! Way to be ahead of the game.
 

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I just called my agent, and there is no change in premiums for me as it's included in my painting premium. If your insurance is going to go up, I would shop around for another agency.
 

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The insurance co's know as much about RRP as 90 % of contractors do.....and that's not much.

What makes it even worse 90 % of the contractors get some giggly - goo girl or green horn fellow at the ins co on the phone to discuss it and it just goes down hill from there.

All the more reason to have your ins at a broker that has an ins exec that has been doing const / contractors for several years. These folks are hard to find. You won't find them at captive agents. If you've never dealt with a broker in the know about const, you have no idea what you're missing.
 
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