Re-Roof Issues

3338 Views 19 Replies 10 Participants Last post by Tom M, Dec 10, 2013

fishdawg93

Discussion Starter · Dec 2, 2013

Hey fellas,

I've been reading the blog for a long time now but first time posting a question/issue on here.

I recently did a 23 square tear off re-roof that had three leaks occurring. Roof was over 20 years old so it was due to be replaced. Replaced the roof with new IW 6' on pitch over 5 and everything on pitch less than 5, roof boots, new chimney flashing, ridge vent, IKO lifetimes, UDL-30 synthetic underlayment the works. Step flashing around dormers stayed as the siding was a$be$to$ and the step was nailed behind it and pretty good shape. Found no evidence of water staining or rot on the roof deck anywhere. This was done at the end of Oct. and first of Nov. Temps were averaging around 45 during day and 30 at night. IKO rep said shouldn't be a problem.

One side of dormer never quite laid down right as it was completely shaded. Sent pictures to rep they said if it was there house they wouldn't be concerned. A month goes by and I get a call the day before Thanksgiving that they had a leak. I have already been back twice to check and see if the shingles had finally laid down and they had started to but still were not stuck down well. The leaks are all in exactly the same spots as before. The weather was cold 34 degrees or so, 40+ MPH winds and heavy rain. The roof had been rained on several times before with no issues. My concern is the roof is leaking under siding since I noticed several cracks and chips in a$be$to$. It could also have driven up under the shingles but everywhere it is leaking has 6' of IW or more. It is to cold to do a hose test now and will be until March probably. Any thoughts?

First picture is where the porch leaks, its in the center after the pitch change, this is a before picture. Second is where the shingles didn't lay flat. Getting a leak just to right of stink boot at bottom.
Thanks in advance.

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madrina

· #2 · Dec 2, 2013 (Edited)

is the leak in area 1 or 2
and what is behind the gutter on the inside of the house? is that a bathroom? how bad is the leak? id check the boot first, then the edge where the siding meets, if theres a bathroom there id check plumbing and then check for rats. does their house stink? rats always piss in the same spot (so i hear) eventually it comes thru the ceiling. Youll be able to smell it the second you open the attic door.. other than that?? I dont see anything that looks faulty.

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fishdawg93

Discussion Starter · #3 · Dec 2, 2013

Hard to say, since that closet is an add on. The old leak used to happen I guess when they got ice damns around stink pipe and inside it leaks just inside the closet by the door jam header. There is an identical leak on the other side of the same dormer in the back as well. Inside it is right where the wall meets the ceiling on the other side. Nothing on the front inside (same size dormer there), just the porch issue but the wind was blowing from back.

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madrina

· #4 · Dec 2, 2013 (Edited)

i dont understand. i dont know where the closet is. but if they had leaks in the same spot before and still have them after. id say it aint your problem. you know if you did the roof right and you say you did... soooo, look elsewhere to identify the prob.

PatChap

· #5 · Dec 2, 2013

The problem with reusing steps is that modern shingles are larger, especially IKO' at 6" to the weather. So you and I both know the steps arent lined up right in a few spots, they are most likely set to 5" exposure. I would start looking at the wall, and outwards.
Is the apron flashing installed properly, Could be coming in the corner if its not tied into the steps properly.

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jlsconstruction

· #6 · Dec 2, 2013

I'm going through the same thing, as far as shingles not laying flat just go trim them back a little, but it's probably the pipe leaking, not the roof. Pick up 2 3" 90s and put them on the pipe

fishdawg93

Discussion Starter · #7 · Dec 2, 2013 (Edited)

I had my concerns with the step and apron flashing. Its hard to tell what it looks like behind the a$be$to$ because I didn't take it off obviously. I did caulk the heck out of that corner on both sides because I thought it might be an issue. I also cut small pieces of IW to overlap step and shingle to IW run up side to account for mis-sized step. Any suggestions to fix it other than caulk without tearing into siding to fix it properly. I strongly suggested residing both dormers when I did the roof but HO didn't want to spend money and then not have it match rest of house. I would have known the flashing was done right then at least.

I've ruled out a pipe problem I think, you can see the pipe coming into the closet (closet is the little roof below). The dormer is a bedroom, no plumbing up there besides baseboard.

To much moisture to be mice, rats are very uncommon in residential up here. Plus HO is extremely type A.

I'm thinking same issue is causing all three leaks. I'm also thinking its a siding issue especially with it only leaking during ice dams and heavy winds and not in just regular old rain.

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madrina

· #8 · Dec 2, 2013

oohhhhhh ok.. i see it now. the closet add on is the red part right?.. at first i thought you were saying that whole side was the closet because i couldnt see the shading. so, what the heck is a pipe doing in the closet anyway? Blame it on the siding and be done with it. I hate when customers wont listen to us about what needs to be repaired and then they have a leak and want us to run in circles second guessing our work, when we know the issue isnt our fault. :wallbash:

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PrmrHomeRmdl

· #9 · Dec 2, 2013

If it only leaks when its a driving rain on that side of the house, id go with step flashing not being correctly exposed for the shingles. When we run into this problem, we usually tell the HO about the siding that it has to be taken off to properly do the step flashing/IW along the walls. Explain to them the problem and that the only way to fix it is tear down siding and get it done properly. Also, is the seal on the boot tight with the pipe itself? no tar or anything on it that could cause it to not have a nice tight seal?

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builditguy

· #10 · Dec 2, 2013

I would suspect the siding as well. Make sure the vent pipe isn't leaking. Putting 2 - 90s on it will let you know for sure. If you can't wait that long, run a garden hose into the pipe. You will find out fast. If you have no leak, run the garden hose along the siding. Start at the bottom and work your way up until it leaks. Keep in mind a garden hose doesn't always work. The water has to hit it just the right way. Won't leak for months and then all of a sudden there is a leak. I suspect siding though.
With the garden hose, hold it on the roof first. This way the customer can see it doesn't leak until the hose hits the siding.
Good luck.

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stombaugh85

· #11 · Dec 3, 2013 (Edited)

Maybe check the inside of the gutters for holes in them . Ive seen brackets placed too low causing leaks. Sometimes mimick roof leak depending how the water travels.. Looks like gutters are pitched the way way also
Awhile back I had an issue with a dormer. Turned out to be the window leaking and getting behind flashing.

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fishdawg93

Discussion Starter · #12 · Dec 3, 2013

Boot is tight, no tar. After speaking with HO we are going to see how it holds up this winter and possibly tackle the siding/flashing in the spring depending on if they have issues. I got three more calls today about roofs that had issues from that same storm (thankfully none of them roofs that I had done). 3" of rain and 40 mph+ winds did a number I guess.

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builditguy

· #13 · Dec 3, 2013

It's good the homeowner is willing to be patient.

jlsconstruction

· #14 · Dec 3, 2013

builditguy said:
It's good the homeowner is willing to be patient.

Sometimes they don't have a choice

Mr Latone

· #15 · Dec 4, 2013

The pitch change problem is related to the chimney or the siding. The chimney flashing looks pretty bad, but that doesn't mean it leaks.

The other issues are related to the siding itself or the flashing between the roof and siding.

You replaced the entire roof assembly and the problems returned (never left actually) in the same place as before. You would have had to install the problem the same way you took it off. Unlikely.

Look at something you did not do.

If you were able to weave the old step flashing into the new roof with confidence, then it should not be the issue. However, if the wall leaks, it will likely get behind the step flashing as many installations don't have the siding underlayment over the step flashing.

It is also possible that the corners at the step flashing to wall flashing were never done well and still leak. As the problem is mirrored on both sides, I would favor this as the problem. With care, you might be able to remove the couple pieces of siding that cover this joint, do the repair, and reinstall. Getting a couple pieces of siding off without damage will require some care.

Also, as JLS suggests, a couple elbows on the stink pipe will eliminate the possibility that the vent pipe itself doesn't leak at an internal joint.

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RandyB1986

· #16 · Dec 4, 2013

I would be willing to bet it is the step flashing. I have never had a problem using 5" step flashing with dimensional shingles...as long as it is stepping and flowing you will be fine. Some steps may be doubled at some points, but it works fine. Think about how many houses you have seen that don't even have step flashing....builders still use flat cheap aluminum coil and run down walls.

I see you have 2 options.

#1. You could caulk that siding to your new shingles...I know it is ugly and we don't like caulk....but it may prevent blown rain from getting into it this winter.

#2. You can tear that siding off, tear off them shingles along walls. Then run I&W up the wall a foot and out on the roof 2 feet. Re-shingle with new step flashing and new siding.

I would try to caulk it....since you know you will have to remove it come spring anyway. That way if it don't leak anymore.........you at least know where the problem is/was.

IKO is notorious for being slow sealers in cool weather. I have had them look terrible all winter when installed in November....come spring they will seal nice. In my opinion, Owens-Corning is only shingle to use in cold weather....that will seal quickly.

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PrmrHomeRmdl

· #17 · Dec 9, 2013

IMHO IKO is a horrible brand. I used them once and that was it. They seal horrible and just feel cheap overall. Owens Corning are the best shingles I think. That's all we use. I've heard nothing but bad things about IKO.

stombaugh85

· #18 · Dec 10, 2013

PrmrHomeRmdl said:
IMHO IKO is a horrible brand. I used them once and that was it. They seal horrible and just feel cheap overall. Owens Corning are the best shingles I think. That's all we use. I've heard nothing but bad things about IKO.

What are you talking about? I've recommended all my competitors to use IKO

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PrmrHomeRmdl

· #19 · Dec 10, 2013

stombaugh85 said:
What are you talking about? I've recommended all my competitors to use IKO

I went back to a house we used IKO on 3 times due to bad sealing that lead to blow offs. Competitors in my area also have had bad luck with IKO. It's either GAF or OC around here along with certanteed brand

Tom M

· #20 · Dec 10, 2013

Never, ever had a leak due to shingles laying down. I would make a habit of keeping a loose cut at the step flashing to allow water flow. I hate when the stick up because someone jammed it up against the wall.

With dormers the very first step flashing at the bottom and the very top one will be the problem most of the time. My bet is you didnt get that bottom shingle under the corner step or worse got over the top rather than under.

Also possible who ever ripped it was too rough with the flat bar and punctured the step. I also use the bar to reshape the steps as well.

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