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I haven't used these guys, but I can get full marine spec treated poles and lumber locally. If you look at their website, they offer treated poles that have been sealed to slow leaching of the CCA.

"Most dimensional pressure treated lumber is treated to .25 or .40 pcf in ACQ. Larger dimensional lumber (2x8 and above) can be treated to .60 pcf with CCA but only for use in certain commercial construction applications. We usually recommend .60 pcf (CCA or ACQ) for freshwater use, ground contact, or extreme weather conditions, .80 CCA for government specifications or brackish (salty fresh) water, and 2.5 pcf CCA for projects in saltwater."

http://www.americanpoleandtimber.com/prod_treatedlumber.shtml
 

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Out Door Kitchen- Thanks

I am probably posting this in the wrong place, I haven't learned the maze route quite yet.

About a month ago I was asking for recommendations for appliances, rock finish, countertops, and a few other questions for designing and building an outdoor kitchen. I was offered a lot of good ideas and put them in a design, as well as lights for the deck. Clemens helped me a lot, as usual.

I am up-loading the design that I gave the customer in a PDF slide show. He contacted me today and said he loves it, not I just have to come up with some pricing.

I just wanted to say thank you for your in-put. As an old codger I still try to learn from you young bucks.

Bob
 

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Be sure you buy treated lumber that is for "ground contact". Most of the treated 4x4s are not rated for this. If you don't believe me, ask at the lumber desk.

Also, using cement to hold the posts just makes a cement container to hold water/moisture. It does not allow the post to dry out. Instead, use crushed rock to set posts. Tamping down will make the post unmoveable and will allow water to drain.
 

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Discussion Starter #44
Thanks for all the responses and discussion. The job doesn't start until later this month, I'll do my best to get pics. I think I may apply more green to them before having them set, and maybe some tar too, but I don't want to get out of hand. Cheers.
 

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Capra Aegagrus
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Also, using cement to hold the posts just makes a cement container to hold water/moisture.
Wood doesn't rot underwater. A blob of concrete below the frost line will have a much more positive effect than negative in respect to rigidity and load-bearing capacity.

Having said that, in the context of fence posts, I think the most bulletproof install is a blob at the bottom, dirt fill, a concrete "collar" higher up but still below grade, and a final fill of 6-12" of dirt.

The critical point is the earth/air interface. That's where rot happens.
 

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Discussion Starter #48
Thanks to everyone that chipped in their advice.

To help preserve the 4x4's from rot I lined up the 4x4's on the stack and used a paint/stain pad and tray to apply copper green on the bottom 4' of the fence post. After the posts were concreted in I sprayed rubberized tar to the wood/concrete junction. Then we went ahead and built the fence.

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I will definitely consider steel posts in future projects...
 

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Radical Basement Dweller
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Good looking fence.
 

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Best Product on the market for wood posts

Hey Guys, I have been doing this a while. I have about 60 fence builders working for me now and we shut down one division. We all know when The EPA banned CCA in 2004 pt posts suck. As for the question we all know that posts rot at grade. We some dont know is rot os fungus and needs oxygen and fuel and the right temperature to exist.

Rot fungus eats the damp post(food) and the reason it only spreads a few inches below grade is the fungus- microbes use the post as a snorkel of sorts. Thast why we pull the plugs and the tags are still on the bottoms of the posts- rot does not happen there.

A few years back we started using The Post Collars and its a no brainier. We sell about 60% of all wood posts jobs with them. They work and people are stoked their fences are lasting. Here are my two fence companies.
http://www.losgatosfence.com/home.html
http://www.centralfences.com/

Here is the Product for the question. Or use steel posts.
http://thepostcollar.com/main_page.html
 

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How about just tightly wrapping the post with some 6" wide galvanized sheet metal where the post meets the soil? Or does it need a sticky membrane attaching it to the post?

Nice fence OP.
 

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Copper green does work. Stops bugs and rot from going on in any wood and stops rot that has already started.

Joe Wood, www.woodsshop.com taught me the copper flat stock trick. Fastening the metal with copper nails a few inches above and below the contact area. The idea is the more copper gets wet the more it leaches and the more protection the post gets.

That came from old Japan, sometimes I think Joe was brought up in a oriental family in another life. Most all his work has that...slant..to it.

JonMon www.deckmastersllc.com
Here is the Product for the question. Or use steel posts.
http://thepostcollar.com/main_page.html
Even using copper is cheaper than those collars.
 

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I think the problem is that moisture is trapped on 5 sides...BOTTOM + 4 sides.
The way I have always done it is to set a flat rock, bricks, or whatever on the bottom, tamp down, put a little gravel in the hole, & then concrete to near top.
 

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John Hyatt
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I go with the School of protection. Copper Green will stop rot and bugs.

Gravel will hold water. If the project merits the copper wrap a few inches above and below the dirt level, even more protection. The more water, the more the copper leaches, the more leaching of copper, the more protection.

DONE.

J.
 

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I love copper green/brown. It used to be better. I think it is now like 9-10% copper. It used to be 25 percent. I just use three times as much. The spray cans are awesome.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk
 

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The Post Collars work period!

Any contractor knows where posts rot, why and how to protect them...This is a funny thread. We have been using these and they work. Or crown the concrete. Concrete does NOT trap moisture and moisture is just what makes the posts edible for bacteria and fungus...Ridiculous that people do not get it because the dont care to understand the science.
 
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