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some of my carpenters are after getting raises right now. I know kinda selfish with the way the economy is. I've been thinking for a long time about paying my subdivsion guys piecework to frame house. Does anybody do that? How does it work? Percentage? I've been trying to crunch the numbers. What if a crew member is off a day? How much should they make? Im thinking it will jump start them to work faster and harder with less dogf#$%ing. Bear in mind my guys frame them from foundation to roof. Any tips would be great>
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Is piece work legal in Canada? Do they have to be licensed contractors, fully bonded and insured, provide all necessary tools, task oriented - not time clock driven?

These are just questions I have.
 

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There are lots of companies that do pay piece work, Rogers Cable for instance subs all their runs to 4 major companies in then city, they pay the subs piece work and the subs then pay their employees piece work

...and because of that they do a horrible job as fast as they possibly can.

I don't think there would be any legal issues...but think about how the quality of work would change, how it would affect moral of the crew, it could both motivate or just aggrivate. Plus finding out how to pay for piecework could be a real learning expierience.
 

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I don't care for piece work in framing.
First, too many variables, second your pay can be dependent on someone elses.

Who is in business, you or your employees?:no:

Bonus for good work, or positive motivation!:thumbsup:
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Is piece work legal in Canada? Do they have to be licensed contractors, fully bonded and insured, provide all necessary tools, task oriented - not time clock driven?

These are just questions I have.
Yes it is legal. There wouldn't be any changes except for how they were payed. They would still be employees, we would still supply tools. Thats my goal though. To make them task oriented not time clock driven. There will be less standing around, everybody will want to work because its there buck now.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
...and because of that they do a horrible job as fast as they possibly can.

I don't think there would be any legal issues...but think about how the quality of work would change, how it would affect moral of the crew, it could both motivate or just aggrivate. Plus finding out how to pay for piecework could be a real learning expierience.
It shouldn't really affect quality of work. The crew still has certain standards to uphold, and they'll start thinking off ways to go faster and not affect this quality. I think they'll all want to read the very effiecient carpenter by larry haun.

I don't see how it will just aggravate. If it does though its them or me. I won't find them sitting in the truck when theres a light drizzle. Standing around and not telling anyone that there lumber is not here, taking an hour for lunch. There going to want to work because its there money now.
 

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i've always piece worked per foot. in other words say you get $5 a foot to frame, sheathe, set windows and do blocking. say you're doing a 1000sf house. that's 5 grand.
2 dollars a foot to piece work framing, 70 cents a foot to sheathe. 2.30 for you to block it and throw windows in. 2 days tops. it works well in a development setting where you can do a model with your men and then just give them a nut per unit.

the upside to this is that your crew will automatically weed out people who are slacking. and after a couple of units they'll be popping them out like crazy.

you don't need more than 2 people for an average house (1,500 sf). I used to do duplexes (about 3,000 sf total with a party wall) in 6 days, by hand(no guns) with a snail of a guy to help.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
so clems how do you split that up between crew members? I do the same with subs but how do you do it for each guy. What if a guy dosne't show up one day, etc.
 

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so clems how do you split that up between crew members? I do the same with subs but how do you do it for each guy. What if a guy dosne't show up one day, etc.
that depends. if all your guys are different pay scale then each one would take his hourly out of the total. the balance, if any, if split equally. on the other hand, if they come up short, they'll know that they're worthless.

for the most part pieceworkers take out same salary. helpers and junior mechanics can't be brought into pieceworking at all and should just get they hourly. only senior guys can piecework.

again it depends on the size of the crew. I used to piecework in a pair, and I would take a couple of dollars more an hour because i'm a beast. then split the remainder between two guys. if you're trying to setup a crew of 4 to piecework then don't let the lowest men share or find out how much money senior boys are getting.
 

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WA state is way more employee leaning at the state regulatory level. Anything that gives the advantage to the boss and makes the employees have to work hard is often reported as abuse. It sucks but that's why I don't hire employees.
 

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WA state is way more employee leaning at the state regulatory level. Anything that gives the advantage to the boss and makes the employees have to work hard is often reported as abuse. It sucks but that's why I don't hire employees.

kind of numbers we get down here to frame our employees HAVE to work hard :rolleyes: nobody slacks on my watch :no:
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
that depends. if all your guys are different pay scale then each one would take his hourly out of the total. the balance, if any, if split equally. on the other hand, if they come up short, they'll know that they're worthless.

for the most part pieceworkers take out same salary. helpers and junior mechanics can't be brought into pieceworking at all and should just get they hourly. only senior guys can piecework.

again it depends on the size of the crew. I used to piecework in a pair, and I would take a couple of dollars more an hour because i'm a beast. then split the remainder between two guys. if you're trying to setup a crew of 4 to piecework then don't let the lowest men share or find out how much money senior boys are getting.
I see what your saying. Part of the problem is its geeting harder and harder to find good apprentices and labourers. So thats why I want to put everyone on piecework. So im hoping it will motivate them to work harder and want to learn more. Plus it will give the senior guys a good reason to kick them in the ass.
 

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I see what your saying. Part of the problem is its geeting harder and harder to find good apprentices and labourers. So thats why I want to put everyone on piecework. So im hoping it will motivate them to work harder and want to learn more. Plus it will give the senior guys a good reason to kick them in the ass.
definitely true for senior men. not necessarily so for low guys. truth be told, you can motivate someone by giving them more money - you'll just spoil them. the only way to motivate people is by riding them hard like the little ponies that they are. make them hate you and want to prove that they're better than a pony. these are the ones that will last, all the others are trash and should be doing inventory at home depot.

one of the guys i pieced off of used to give us sticks for $2 a foot. sub the sheathing. do the windows himself. and sell blocking to us for a fixed price. was something like $150 a unit to block. then $300 per basement to stick. if you hussles you could do 3 units of blocking or two basement in a day by yourself.

then again, some guys are built to be on the hour and can never accelerate to actually make anything over what they're making. go figure
 
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