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Discussion Starter #1
Always used cabots in the past. But that seems to have problems.
And having a problem finding a oil base solid color.
Know abot the VOC problem. But if they can still make oil base primers, why not deck stain
Any suggestions?

Need to recoat a deck I did years ago with a solid oil base stain.
 

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We use Ben Moore arbor coat, it is waterborne but a great product. is it oil on it now? Not even sure if I can get oil based solid stains anymore here, havnt tried in years.
 

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SuperiorHIP said:
We use Ben Moore arbor coat, it is waterborne but a great product. is it oil on it now? Not even sure if I can get oil based solid stains anymore here, havnt tried in years.
Have you tried q tech
 

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Solid color exterior stains are going to be impossibly expensive soon and harder to find. If you just latex prime it and solid top coat it with
a low sheen latex deck paint, you'll get the same appearance you had previously with the solid color oil stain. You'll also benefit your customers by weening them off soon to be no longer available "solid colored" oil based deck paints. A situation he'll have to face soon enough due to VOC regs.

I'd go as far to say that using an exterior flat "paint and primer in one" will stick well enough and wear the same and look the same as how the deck looks now. Quick prime it anyways, just to be sure.

Oil based deck "solid colored" deck stains were made with a lot of solids, making them almost totally flat when dry. I wouldn't be surprised if Behr's best exterior paint and primer in one sticks fine to it. Change the customer over to latex. That's actually a profitable selling point too, more work more money for you, but with a good reason.

I'm saying (additionally and finally) that oil based solid color flat stains were of extremely low quality, giving them acceptable "tooth qualities" in some cases (with todays improved latex paint sticking properties) Solid colored oil stain deck paint were also used as exterior wood shingle paint. It wears down to nothing pretty fast. Making it possible that an exterior flat "paint and primer in one" would stick to it and wear as a deck paint just as well as any solid colored oil stain. Prime it anyways.
 

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Around here I give water based stains about six months on a deck before they start peeling, a good oil based gives me 3 to 5 years. Try Armstrong Clark semi solid stains. Give them a call with your project, I think his name is Pete, real knowledgeable guy.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Around here I give water based stains about six months on a deck before they start peeling, a good oil based gives me 3 to 5 years. Try Armstrong Clark semi solid stains. Give them a call with your project, I think his name is Pete, real knowledgeable guy.

Thanks,
Hate to have to order stain. But shipping cost was not to bad after the 1 st gallon and fed ex so should have in about 5 days.
 

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rayh78 said:
Thanks,
Hate to have to order stain. But shipping cost was not to bad after the 1 st gallon and fed ex so should have in about 5 days.
Yeah it takes a couple days for me because it comes from California and I am in Washington. You'll be happy with it as long as you like the color, I just finished a deck with the Oxford brown Armstrong clark, it came out good.
 

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Thanks,
Hate to have to order stain. But shipping cost was not to bad after the 1 st gallon and fed ex so should have in about 5 days.
My take?
Todays best water based deck paints (and latex in general) outperform solvent based deck paints in every way. They retain color longer (synthetic oils break down faster in the sun and therefore colors fade faster), they stick better to properly prepared surfaces, and they're easier to apply.

I've given up my devotion to solvent based paints because research and development of water based paints by paint compaines have come a long ways.

I even did my own experiment to prove it. I painted half a primed wood sample with the highest quality latex enamel and the other half with oil based enamel (medium blue color). I set it out in the sun for a year and a half and compared the two. The oil enamel had already started chalking a little while the latex showed none. The color retention on the latex side of the sample was better too. When fully cured, latex enamels can take almost as good a beating as oil finishes. Every year that aspect of wearability is being improved.

Oil based paints still have their uses in certain instances (they level better on interior trim), like, if you're painting a rich movie stars home and you can charge them up the ying-yang.

Having out of state paints shipped to please your customer is going a bit far IMO (for this application). What about the next time he wants his deck painted and you're not there to order them out of state? Then he will HAVE to make the switch, right?

Years ago I too thought oil was superior to latex, but I've seen the advances paint companies have made with latex coatings and it really has gotten better, enough that I'm confident in using them rather than solvent based paints (for most applications).
 

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Caslon said:
My take?
Todays best water based deck paints (and latex in general) outperform solvent based deck paints in every way. They retain color longer (synthetic oils break down faster in the sun and therefore colors fade faster), they stick better to properly prepared surfaces, and they're easier to apply.

I've given up my devotion to solvent based paints because research and development of water based paints by paint compaines have come a long ways.

I even did my own experiment to prove it. I painted half a primed wood sample with the highest quality latex enamel and the other half with oil based enamel (medium blue color). I set it out in the sun for a year and a half and compared the two. The oil enamel had already started chalking a little while the latex showed none. The color retention on the latex side of the sample was better too. When fully cured, latex enamels can take almost as good a beating as oil finishes. Every year that aspect of wearability is being improved.

Oil based paints still have their uses in certain instances (they level better on interior trim), like, if you're painting a rich movie stars home and you can charge them up the ying-yang.

Having out of state paints shipped to please your customer is going a bit far IMO (for this application). What about the next time he wants his deck painted and you're not there to order them out of state? Then he will HAVE to make the switch, right?

Years ago I too thought oil was superior to latex, but I've seen the advances paint companies have made with latex coatings and it really has gotten better, enough that I'm confident in using them rather than solvent based paints (for most applications).
Might want to mention where you are and exactly what material you used. I've experimented for years too and have had far better luck with oils when it comes to decks.
 

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Might want to mention where you are and exactly what material you used. I've experimented for years too and have had far better luck with oils when it comes to decks.
Check my avatar as to location. Brutal sun. "Better luck" not having paint failure? If you apply highest quality properly and have paint failure, call out that paint companies sales rep! High quality paint companies don't make deck paints that totally fail (excluding color fading).
 

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Caslon said:
Check my avatar as to location. Brutal sun. "Better luck" not having paint failure? If you apply highest quality properly and have paint failure, call out that paint companies sales rep! High quality paint companies don't make deck paints that totally fail (excluding color fading).
Sorry that doesn't work on tablets
 

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Caslon said:
So. Calif. I know you get a lot of rain up there. Still...
That's where they make Armstrong clark oil stains, try it in your experiment and let us know how it works. You didn't say exactly what it was you used in your trials, there are some bad oil based products out there.
 

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That's where they make Armstrong clark oil stains, try it in your experiment and let us know how it works. You didn't say exactly what it was you used in your trials, there are some bad oil based products out there.
Weren't we all talking recoating with oil based solid colored deck stains?

I don't doubt the quality of Armstrong products, nor was I referring to initial coating on new wood in my replies. The OP was talking about recoating an existing deck that previously had a solid colored oil deck stain.

We good on that?
 

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Caslon said:
Weren't we all talking recoating with oil based solid colored deck stains?

I don't doubt the quality of Armstrong products, nor was I referring to initial coating on new wood in my replies. The OP was talking about recoating an existing deck that previously had a solid colored oil deck stain.

We good on that?
Yes, but they make semi-solid stain. You can see through it a little bit, or if you want you can spray on a second coat and it basically becomes solid. You can use two coats to cover whatever crud is left on the deck that you couldn't get off. Like I said, you didn't say exactly what you tried so I'm not sure what you were talking about.
 

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Yes, but they make semi-solid stain. You can see through it a little bit, or if you want you can spray on a second coat and it basically becomes solid. You can use two coats to cover whatever crud is left on the deck that you couldn't get off. Like I said, you didn't say exactly what you tried so I'm not sure what you were talking about.
I know. But the original poster (OP) was not talking semi-transparent oil based deck stain. There's a huge difference between semi-transparent oil stains and SOLID COLORED oil based deck stains.
 

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Caslon said:
I know. But the original poster (OP) was not talking semi-transparent oil based deck stain. There's a huge difference between semi-transparent oil stains and SOLID COLORED oil based deck stains.
I know, but the stuff I am talking about is not much different than a solid colored deck stain. It's semi solid, not semi transparent.
 
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