Before anyone will answer you, more info is needed and a picture would really help. I for one, do not know what a joist support board is? You have a 2X running along that the cripples to the rafters are attached to? Or is this a structural beam under the ceiling joists? See what I mean?

 

the joist support board runs perpendicular to the joist, it is nailed to evey joist in the attic. I would like to cut out the part that goes over the opening for the attic ladder which is in the middle of the support board.Go the the web site below and then go to page 7 section 1.6 figure 9 and see the joist support boards. The only difference is my support board runs right over the opening. Can i cut it on both sides and not lose any support?

please go to this web site and go to page 7 section 1.6 figure 9
http://www.wernerladder.com/catalog/files/rc62.pdf#search="how to install a attic ladder"

 

And I must be dumb, but what exactly is this "joist support board" supporting? What is the size of it? Is it nailed to the top of all the ceiling joists it crosses? if so, why? is there anything else attached to it? Was it placed diring constructiont o keep stuff pointed the right way while others things were done, and then left up there for a roost? (actually this is my guess).

 

I think what Jerry is describing is called a strongback. I am not certain what it is that a strongback does structurally, but I think it provides some kind of 'horizontal' bearing, though I dont see how it could.

 

We call a sistered 2x4 on the base of a stair stringer a strong-back. I think what the gentleman's referring to is the 2X4 support on top of the ceiling joists, this we refer to as a rat runner, we install them during framing to true the ceiling joists for drywall, lath etc. If I'm correct, the rat runner can be cut anywhere along it's span as long as finish ceiling is installed.

A pic would help.

Bob

 

Stringer is the term here Bob, and that is what I was guessing it is....but pics would be nice...what if it were a header between 2 walls that supported a valley jack? Cutting through it myght not be good.

 

it is a one by four that lays flat--after looking futher it lays on top of the joist where the joist are connected by "connecting braces".It is nailed to all the ceiling joist it crosses and lays over the connecting braces of the joist.(where one joist ends and another start). I hope glasshousebltr and joasis are right and it was just installed for constructions reasons and was left up there. it is not a header between two walls. i will try and get a picture up. glasshouseblr there is a picture on your websit that looks like my construction but my piece of wood is laying on top of the joist where you have the wood under the joist where the connecting braces are. what is the purpose of the long piece of wood and could it be cut between two joist

 

If it is a 1 x 4 laying flat to the ceiling joists, you are good to go. Cut it through and disregard it, all it was there for is spacing the joists dusing construction.

 

thank you very much!!

 

1 x 4 on the flat? Oh Yeah just ferget that sucker :clap::laughing: It probably was used as a spacer or somw other TEMPORARY use. chop it no problems :}:}:}:} Totally agree with previous post to just disregard it.
JackM

 

One thing I dont understand, is, how did this 22.5X54 RO get there.

 

The RO needed for an attic stair Vito is 22-1/2" X 54"....the opening isn't there yet, but will be...it would be a head banger to have a stringer across the opening...kinda be awkward carrying an arm load of crap up and down once a year (cleaning out the attic) and tripping over the stringer....but wait!....if you leave the stringer there, and use the stair, it may make America's Funniest Home Videos!

 

We call them catwalks here. Some of the truss engineering requires it be in place.

The more significant issue is using the attic for storage. This can be a real problem if the joists were not engineered for a storage load. Generally they are engineered to carry the weight of sheetrock only. The next issue is insulation crush. You will lose "R" value if you crush it.

I frame with engineered trusses. These cannot be used to support a storage load.

 

There is no insulation factor because it is over a garage.

 

Yea, Joasis, yea, I get the picture, especially if its inhanced by some fortified holiday cider or eggnog!!

Seriously. there is something called a strongback that is meant to tighten up the gable end. 'I think'.

Anyway, I could talk about something I do know.

There are two ways to install these attic steps. The way its described in the directions, and the other way.

The directions say to set up temp supports so that the 3/4 boxed jamb is flush with the sheetrock. My words, not theirs.

Or,

You could set up temp supports so that the actual door is flush with the SR.

If you follow the directions, you wont need a 1/4 inch pack out, but your margin for error and the need for a helper increases.

If you set up temp suppports so that the actual luann door is flush with the rock, then it becomes a much more safer, one man job. Then you just gotta pack out the jamb a 1/4 inch

 

Seriously. there is something called a strongback

Vito, I'm with you too on the term "strongback". Must be a "Jersey" definition. Old timers told me it was to hold the ceiling joists in place so that you didn't end up with a 16"OC bowing out to maybe 17" or down to 15" and also as wet lumber dried it helped keep them from twisting and causing nail pops in the rock ceiling below. Now in the days of trusses that board would help stabilize the trusses as you set them so you don't end up with them falling over like a stack of dominoes while you are setting them and keep your 24"OC.

 

Then you just gotta pack out the jamb a 1/4 inch?-- ok what is meant by this?

 

to bring the surface of the actual door's frame/jamb flush with the surface of the finished ceiling, so that inner side of the trim sits on a flush an even plane as the outer side.

 

Jerry: This is how we did them when we were trimming houses; First get a helper, no BS ya need one.
take 2 pcs of 1x4 wide enuf to span that opening and nail or screw em into the framing on the sides of the hole BUT; let the edges extend into the opening enuf to form ledger strips so you can rest the frame of the stairs on them; this makes the frame flush with the rock.
IN this Order: pull stairs into attic; nail temps in place, one man stays on floor, 2nd in attic; lower steps into hole, guy on floor centers it, 2nd guy still in attic nails it in place at 4 corners, guy on floor opens and lowers stars, attic guy with other help now fully nails it off, leaves ( optional :}:} ) the attic, trim it and done about an hr max

 

thank you for the information!!

 

...

 

Are you the Vito that recommended that Italian restaurant in Metuchen/Edison.

No Sir, it was not me. Did ya have a nice meal, or spend a day or two regretting it

 

We call them catwalks here also, used to keep truss centers true for drywall as explained above. If they are in our way during rough in, we cut them out, never heard a complaint from the GC or drywall guys(as if they cared about our stuff when they get there ).

 

Bottom Chord lateral bracing (aka "ratrunners", "stringer", etc..) is required on the trusses to prevent against truss "buckling". I wouldn't recommend just cutting through it but perhaps relocating it so that it isn't directly over the opening. Cutting through it or removing it could cause cracking in your sheetrock as the sheetrock would then be acting as the spacer for the bottom chord of the trusses.

It is NOT a temporary member to be discarded or cut through but a permanent part of the roof system.

 

Bottom Chord lateral bracing (aka "ratrunners", "stringer", etc..) is required on the trusses to prevent against truss "buckling". I wouldn't recommend just cutting through it but perhaps relocating it so that it isn't directly over the opening. Cutting through it or removing it could cause cracking in your sheetrock as the sheetrock would then be acting as the spacer for the bottom chord of the trusses.

It is NOT a temporary member to be discarded or cut through but a permanent part of the roof system.

Yeah, when we get the arhitecturals that come with the trusses here in md , the catwalking/bracking/strongbacking is specified on the drawings. On a residential framing job, not one brace gets removed until the roof is sheathed and the catwalks are done.

 

if you are going to cut the joist out you must do what is called head it off that means cut it back from the oppening and put a 2x across from one joist to the other use a a35 clip to help suport it because you cant get the head out in a hanger but where it gos up to the part you cut use a hanger there on both sides where you cut the peace out your head out gos up to the cut end of your joist slip the hanger over the cut end of the joist and nail to your head out hope this helps

 

This is an engineered truss roof, you can not be cutting any part of this roof other then the sheathing..........

 

A strong back holds the gable upright when setting the gable end before sheathing the roof.

If you are framing a set of stairs to the ceiling, you can cut the joists and then install a header board, which should be consistant with the dimensions of the joist. Frame to the desired width and nail through the joists, into the butt end of the headers. If the joists are 24 o.c you would have 22.5" already, if not cut to the width and frame desired opening after the headers are tied in.

If your using engineered 2x4 trusses, storage will be an issue, keep it light, or your liable to have issues.
The joist support board, or bracing, can be cut back, the header will act as support because it ties in the joists.

 

Divine Design

Sky Master, excellent discription, simple and to the point. taught me something new! I love it!:clap: