[richpuer]

Why would anyone combine the two methods when building the boxes? I read somewhere that some cabinet makers will combine the two methods in building cabs. I'm just wondering what the benefits are and what they look like.

Does anyone have pictures? How is this done?

All I can think of is instead of edge banding the plywood box with a veneer, you would just edge band it with solid wood stock, cut 3/4 in wide to match the plywood thickness. The only benefit in this i can only think of is aesthetics when you open the box you see a solid 1 in wide edge that's solid wood instead of a sticker.

Is this what combining the two methods is? Or do I have it wrong?

 

[Roger Manning]

Why would anyone combine the two methods when building the boxes? I read somewhere that some cabinet makers will combine the two methods in building cabs. I'm just wondering what the benefits are and what they look like.

Does anyone have pictures? How is this done?

All I can think of is instead of edge banding the plywood box with a veneer, you would just edge band it with solid wood stock, cut 3/4 in wide to match the plywood thickness. The only benefit in this i can only think of is aesthetics when you open the box you see a solid 1 in wide edge that's solid wood instead of a sticker.

Is this what combining the two methods is? Or do I have it wrong?

I have seen some shops that will build a face frame cabinet the cover up the frame with big overlays so it looks frameless, lots of extra work if you ask me.
One shop even says we can make face frame look just like frameless, to me that is a very dumb thing to say.

 

[Gus Dering]

This is what I consider a hybrid. It has some face frame and some frameless all in the same cabinet.

Generally speaking, the most common detail is that there is a perimeter of frame with 1/8" margins in the interior.

There are other details that could be used to get a similar look. One way is to build your euro box as normal and apply filler elements to them to create a similar look as these two pictures. I may have some pictures of that as well.
Second thought, we have a job in the shop right now that fits that description. I'll be back...

 

[richpuer]

This is what I consider a hybrid. It has some face frame and some frameless all in the same cabinet.

Generally speaking, the most common detail is that there is a perimeter of frame with 1/8" margins in the interior.

View attachment 108880



There are other details that could be used to get a similar look. One way is to build your euro box as normal and apply filler elements to them to create a similar look as these two pictures. I may have some pictures of that as well.
Second thought, we have a job in the shop right now that fits that description. I'll be back...

so the top picture it looks like you just put a filler on the bottom edge connecting the two side posts? and the boxes are euro boxeS?

 

[tjbnwi]

I do it to make rollouts work easier. The return does nothing but waste space.

Tom

 

[Gus Dering]

so the top picture it looks like you just put a filler on the bottom edge connecting the two side posts? and the boxes are euro boxeS?

That cabinet could have been done that way. In this case it was not. The rest of the room needed more frame parts than just the bottom rail so I kept the system the same throughout.
The box parts that don't have a frame attached, just get edgebanded and adjust the door sizes accordingly.
This picture is the rest of that area to show you what I mean.

This kitchen had two different systems in play. The micro cabinet and the oven box were hybrids but the runs of base cabinets were straight euro.

The job in the shop right now is regular euro cabinets with miterfolded fillers for a chunky frame look.
This wall is for the wine coolers. The openings on the right and left will be filled with wine coolers. The center section will have wine glasses hanging from the center shelf.

you can see that the center cabinet is a basic frameless box with a mitered walnut top. Designer's idea....

 

[richpuer]

That cabinet could have been done that way. In this case it was not. The rest of the room needed more frame parts than just the bottom rail so I kept the system the same throughout.
The box parts that don't have a frame attached, just get edgebanded and adjust the door sizes accordingly.
This picture is the rest of that area to show you what I mean.

View attachment 108882

This kitchen had two different systems in play. The micro cabinet and the oven box were hybrids but the runs of base cabinets were straight euro.

View attachment 108883

The job in the shop right now is regular euro cabinets with miterfolded fillers for a chunky frame look.
This wall is for the wine coolers. The openings on the right and left will be filled with wine coolers. The center section will have wine glasses hanging from the center shelf.

View attachment 108884

you can see that the center cabinet is a basic frameless box with a mitered walnut top. Designer's idea....

View attachment 108885

wow nice work. so basically on that wine cab, you used 3 franeless cabs and then frames around the edges. so there is like overhang on all sides protruding into all three boxes?

also, whats miterfolded...nvm i just saw your vid on youtube. lol impressive stuff. this can only be done on a cnc machine?

 

[Gus Dering]

wow nice work. so basically on that wine cab, you used 3 franeless cabs and then frames around the edges. so there is like overhang on all sides protruding into all three boxes?

also, whats miterfolded

The 3" sections are miterfolded on the cnc. They protrude past the frameless box by about 13/16" so the flush out with the doors and drawer fronts.

This video shows you what miterfolding is all about

 

[richpuer]

for example,

heres one of my cabinets. it is frameless as you can see here.

then when you open it, you see this solid wood frame...but it is 100% flush to the box so that guides and stuff can be attached...(i know that is the wrong hardware there),

basically this frame is held together by pocket screws and then pocket screwed to the carcass

Im wondering why they would do this? is it just aesthetics? or is there another purpose. seems like an extra step to me and more work instead of just edge banding veneer

 

[richpuer]

The 3" sections are miterfolded on the cnc. They protrude past the frameless box by about 13/16" so the flush out with the doors and drawer fronts.

This video shows you what miterfolding is all about

can this only be done on cnc?

 

[Gus Dering]

can this only be done on cnc?

I won't say you can't do it with a hand held router but I do think it would be difficult.

The tip of that bit is riding along at a very precise height of .012" above the spoils board. If you try this with a hand held router and regular veneer core plywood, your registration point is on the face and the material thickness consistency comes into play. If the material has a section that is thinner than your set up is for, your bit cuts completely through. Not good...

Not to mention that spindle on our machine is 10 horse power and the best you can do is about 3 1/2. Several passes with a hand held router would be a pain.

My guess you would be better off just mitering the material and joining them in a traditional manner.

Back to your original question;
I see no benefit of putting on a frame and covering it like that picture you showed.

There is a shop close to us that does it that way. They say they don't want to stray from their normal framed method and cause confusion in the shop. I could argue in the other direction but it all boils down to doing things in a manner that you and your guys are comfortable with and the equipment you have at your disposal.

 

[richpuer]

I thought maybe they did that because they didn't want to stick a drawer stretcher inside obstructing the sink. But I don't know

 

[Gus Dering]

I thought maybe they did that because they didn't want to stick a drawer stretcher inside obstructing the sink. But I don't know

We don't use a drawer stretcher on a sink base cabinet. We put a "sink skirt" in. Just a 6" (or so) wide piece of ply with the face flush with the cabinet box. The false front is simply screwed on from the inside. The skirt extends below the false front by 3/8" so the doors bump into it.