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huntington beach, ca.
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362 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
Last year i took on a job, the GC & Owner gave me the prints and I bid on the job for XXXX amount( he supllies materials),it is also stipulated that I would get all the existing lights etc.. back working.

I finished rough last year, but because he couldn't finish some walls, my rough couldn't pass. So while the job sits, he's adding, changing, moving, things and i'm constantly making changes and he won't pay for changes and threatens to kick me off the job.

Rough Electrical past 3 months ago (still making changes) and he still hasn't drywalled, I tried billing him for change orders and materials I payed for, but he refuses and now wants me to redo the whole job in EMT to his liking in 2 days or he is kicking off job and he is saying I have to do it myself.

Now basically with the contract I signed and what he is claiming, he can make me do anything and it would be basically impossible to ever finish. Just constantly make changes, with no pay until I walk off th ejob.

I realized the guy was crazy long ago, but I just bared with it, just wanted to finish, but it is obvious he never was going to have me finish.
 

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General Contractor
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3,444 Posts
Talk to a lawyer about ways to bring his site to a creep if not a grinding halt. He may just want to come around to your way of thinking.
 

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Ahhh, the old won't pay a change order trick. If it is clear the the owner, architect or another sub delayed you're work, you have to get paid for that delay - I really don't care what the contract says because you can't just go around screwing people over. Just threaten to sue them, and maybe have a lawyer send a letter and you should be good to go.
 

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I own stock in FotoMat!
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12,611 Posts
Whose contract.... yours or his/theirs?
 

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huntington beach, ca.
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362 Posts
Discussion Starter · #6 · (Edited)
Whose contract.... yours or his/theirs?
I believe he signed my contract and I signed his.



He was on job site everyday, agreed to everything we did, called inspection for what we did, now says change everything or we sue you.
Mind you we passed inspection, everything is too code.

I just looked my 1st inspection was in DEC. 2008, failed because he didn't finish walls.
 

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Boss-man
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Well it will come down to what your contract says... However, surely there is a line that states, changes to this contract will be done so in writing. More work or deviation from the contract will be agreed upon prior to work. I would not do anymore work until I see payment or agreement with consideration... He can't make you do above and beyond your scope of work on his terms.
 

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General Contractor
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8,051 Posts
Talk to a lawyer and if you have a good contract you can collect for breach of contract, lost time, special damages,etc... by the time you be done with it, his head will spin :thumbsup:
 

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A strongly worded letter from your lawyer may bring him around to reality or open a can of worms if the changes were made without signed change orders.

Either way I would not go back until the issue is resolved. Its been 9-10 months since your rough inspection so a few weeks to clear up this issue should not make a big difference.
 

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Without airing alot of dirty laundry to them, have you spoke to other subs for comparison of his tactics?

Take note of any other violations going on.

Once securing your money phone calls to appropriate authorities such as I.N.S. and O.S.H.A. could be considered as interest on your nuisance fees.

Also check out the "I need a new prank" thread for the more devious NON TRACEABLE pranks.

Consider it pain and suffering retribution.
 

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General Contractor
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Do whatever you intend to do upfront. You have every right and reason to utilize all legal and ethical means at your disposal to achieve your ends. But as a man, you also have some responsibilities to yourself and your reputation. Don't weasel around like a kid afterward. Passive aggressive tactics honor no one. My Pappy used to tell me that if I couldn't say or do something to a man's face, in broad daylight, I had no business even considering it under the sneaky cloak of aninimity.
 

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318 Posts
Stop work and file your lien now. Include the cost of the change orders in the lien. Talk to your lawyer and have him/her write a letter to the GC and owner. If the house is being built on a construction loan the bank is going to get really irritated when the lien agent reports back to them. That in itself may get you your money.

I would avoid any pranks or calls to government agencies (unless there truly are OSHA violations that you are concerned about) out of spite or to get even. This will just look bad and if you have to go to court and they can prove you did those things it might hurt your case. Remember your goal is to get your money and get out, leave the high school pranks to school yard kids and focus on the goal at hand. Good luck, I hope it works out for you.
 

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huntington beach, ca.
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362 Posts
Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Huh???? Why would you have two contracts on the job? And why were they both so open ended with regard to scope? Did the scope read "do electrical rough-in work for as long as I tell you to"???
He made the contract, I just asked him to sign mine for my records. The contract stated that I finish rough in 2 weeks, so that was back in Nov. 08, which I finished, but couldn't get it signed off, because of him.

Look contract wise, he has me by my balls most likely, so i'm not going to pretend. But contract, no contract, i'm not going to be someone indentured servant.
 

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I keep seing these posts about some disagreement or another. I have always followed a simple rule. I work on houses, lawyers do legal work. I am not going to waste alot of time and aggravation doing something I am no good at. Therefore in these kind of situations If a resonable conversation gets nowhere or is not possible I cal the lawyer and let hom do what he is good at and I go on to the next job and do what I am good at. If you are in business and you don't have a relationship with an attorney you should. Just like an accountant. Its the simple facts of being in business. You should have had your contract either written by or at least approved by an attorney. I know it sound harsh but I see so many people get on these boards with a woe is me story and it is simple. An attorney os another tool, just like a saw or a drill. If you are lucky and everyone of your customers makes your morning coffee and backs cookies in the afternoon and pays you 110% (in case of problems you know) up front then eventually you are going to need a lawyer. I saw file a lien, have a lawyer send a letter and get on to something more productive
 

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huntington beach, ca.
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362 Posts
Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Yes I have a lawyer and he is advicing me on every step.


Ok I went and met with the GC/Owner (gc is the owners son). That lasted 5 minutes, he went off and threatened to beat me, if I didn't get off his property. He even as much threatened to grab a hammer, but put it down.

I was very polite and we sat down talked about the change orders,
I said lets go line by line. We made it past 1 and he went off, even after I said I wouldn't charge him for the 1st one.

Job is completed, insulation is on the walls, there is nothing that needs to be done on my part. His 1st words to me, if you try to charge me for these change orders, I will remake you do this entire job, to my liking. I just sat silent and listened.
 

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I own stock in FotoMat!
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12,611 Posts
I believe he signed my contract and I signed his...........
You 'believe' he signed yours and you signed his? You don't know if he signed your contract?

He made the contract, I just asked him to sign mine for my records. The contract stated that I finish rough in 2 weeks, so that was back in Nov. 08, which I finished, but couldn't get it signed off, because of him..................
Why on earth would you sign two contracts for the same job?

Yes I have a lawyer and he is advicing me on every step.


Ok I went and met with the GC/Owner (gc is the owners son). That lasted 5 minutes, he went off and threatened to beat me, if I didn't get off his property. He even as much threatened to grab a hammer, but put it down.

I was very polite and we sat down talked about the change orders,
I said lets go line by line. We made it past 1 and he went off, even after I said I wouldn't charge him for the 1st one.

Job is completed, insulation is on the walls, there is nothing that needs to be done on my part. His 1st words to me, if you try to charge me for these change orders, I will remake you do this entire job, to my liking. I just sat silent and listened.
NEVER NEVER NEVER talk to this person alone again. ALWAYS have someone with you as a witness. Tell the owner that is what this person is in attendence for...... as a witness. Take a video camera or a tape recorder or a digital recorder..... something that will document what happens.
 

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Project Manager HFH..
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3,711 Posts
Yes I have a lawyer and he is advicing me on every step.


Ok I went and met with the GC/Owner (gc is the owners son). That lasted 5 minutes, he went off and threatened to beat me, if I didn't get off his property. He even as much threatened to grab a hammer, but put it down.

I was very polite and we sat down talked about the change orders,
I said lets go line by line. We made it past 1 and he went off, even after I said I wouldn't charge him for the 1st one.

Job is completed, insulation is on the walls, there is nothing that needs to be done on my part. His 1st words to me, if you try to charge me for these change orders, I will remake you do this entire job, to my liking. I just sat silent and listened.
I don't understand his beef with you.
Is he not happy with your work?It does not sound like it as he has finished over it.
Does he not want to pay for the CO's?
Why?
Did he OK them?
Why would he want you to "Re-do the entire job" if you ask him to pay for the CO's?That is extremely baffling.....
Crazy.:blink:
 

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Stop work and file your lien now. Include the cost of the change orders in the lien. Talk to your lawyer and have him/her write a letter to the GC and owner. If the house is being built on a construction loan the bank is going to get really irritated when the lien agent reports back to them. That in itself may get you your money.

I would avoid any pranks or calls to government agencies (unless there truly are OSHA violations that you are concerned about) out of spite or to get even. This will just look bad and if you have to go to court and they can prove you did those things it might hurt your case. Remember your goal is to get your money and get out, leave the high school pranks to school yard kids and focus on the goal at hand. Good luck, I hope it works out for you.
That's why I said make a note of any other violations. I WOULD NEVER advocate prank phone calls to OSHA or ICE,INS etc. They do defeat the purpose. Why let him get by with other violations IF he his guilty?

And I have reported pricks to these agencies you don't have to go to court and/or be named.

As far as the actual "pranks" I referenced to yeah a bit sophmoric but, sometimes it makes you feel better WITHOUT breaking laws like vandelism or aggrevated assault.

And although I feel aggression should FIRST be met with diplomacy and Karma will get the person.

I also feel occasionally Karma needs a helping hand.
 
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