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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
It seems that on the last several projects I've done the trim work on, the GC or owner calls me back about 1 or 2 doors rubbing out of about 20-25 doors. In each case, they were installed totally square and were not rubbing when I left the project and I left sufficient space for paint. They have all recently been pre-hung masonite hollow core doors with pine jambs. For most of them, I can just put in a full length screw in one of the hinge holes that goes all the way into the framing. I can't do this right when the are hung because most painters in the area remove the hinges and the doors to paint. Most of the hinges are really cheap hinges with screws that really aren't meant to be installed more than once and I find this may be most of the issue. Anybody else dealt with or dealing with this? I've noticed it more in the last year than in years previous and I've found the doors have not been built as well either (jambs too tight or too loose, etc). Thoughts on this? It is always the top corner of the door rubbing when it is closed so I generally put a screw into the top screw hole of the top hinge and it solves the issue or so it seems.
 

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Want to play a game?
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Jeld-Wen is where our doors come from. Their quality has gone way down in the past 5 years. You just have to give the doors a pretty good gap. Maybe a good 3/16. I usually carry a shim around that size and put it in between the door and the jamb all the way around to make sure the unit has that 3/16 reveal.
 

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wannabe
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Make a door punch list part of your contract...you come back after paint and inspect your work...might work in your advantage. Add $10 per door, go back, fix 2 doors (without hassle) and you made $250.

eg. We hang, trim etc... painter comes, removes hardware takes the door to his shop to spray and brings them back and re-installs. Sometimes paint builds up in the mortise that needs cleaned out. Not all hinges are the same, maybe they weren't put in the exactly how they were. A lot can happen.

Tuning up doors after paint is a standard for us...

The difference is, we don't sub carpentry.
 

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They have all recently been pre-hung masonite hollow core doors with pine jambs. For most of them, I can just put in a full length screw in one of the hinge holes that goes all the way into the framing. I can't do this right when the are hung because most painters in the area remove the hinges and the doors to paint.


I used to work for a builder where the painter took the hinges off . I sent them a letter stating I was not responsible for fixing any of the doors once the painter removed the hinges . They were flipping hinges around , stipping out scews ect , ect . Not my problem .

In your case though since it is only 1 or 2 doors it's hard to blame the painter IMO . Could be a humidity issue or poor quality doors ect . . Though it could be paint build up where the hinges go .

I'd like to know why some painters use this method . The one told me it was quicker than tapping them but I don't it that way . Seemed like laziness to me and why mess with someones elses work .
 

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Sawdust Sweeper
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This is pretty par for the course... I worked for several GCs that did their paint in house. We always numbered the doors and hinges so the hinges went back to their original locations. This is not done by painters much though and usually they will just throw hinges in randomly.

That last paint grade trim out I did I pulled 3 doors and cleaned out paint in the mortise.

The other thing I do to help alleviate call backs is to countersink and set a 3" screw behind the hinges so the door is less likely to get jacked up. I still put a 3" screw through the center hole on all 3 hinges, pisses off the painters a little bit, but such is life.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Sounds like I'm doing pretty much what everybody else is doing and that I'm not wrong in how I'm doing this. That is helpful to hear as having other trim guys back me up on this makes it much easier to go to GC's and owners and explain this in an educated manner. Most all painters here just number the doors and not the hinges. When they do this, they end up throwing all the hinges in a bucket and then put them all back on. Anyway...thanks for the suggestions and for the backup as it will be helpful to me in the future to be able to say this is a common issue and that several other trim guys can back me up on it. I do think a lot of it stems from poorly built doors. (paint grade doors in hollow core sell for $55 around here now and they were about $65 even just a year ago)
 

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Curmudgeon
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Sounds like I'm doing pretty much what everybody else is doing and that I'm not wrong in how I'm doing this. That is helpful to hear as having other trim guys back me up on this makes it much easier to go to GC's and owners and explain this in an educated manner. Most all painters here just number the doors and not the hinges. When they do this, they end up throwing all the hinges in a bucket and then put them all back on. Anyway...thanks for the suggestions and for the backup as it will be helpful to me in the future to be able to say this is a common issue and that several other trim guys can back me up on it. I do think a lot of it stems from poorly built doors. (paint grade doors in hollow core sell for $55 around here now and they were about $65 even just a year ago)
Show your painters these.....
http://hingemag.com/
 

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par for the course here also.
9 times out of 10 a door or 2 has to be adjusted when doing the lock out. not a big deal IMO
 

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Our painters always take the sash locks off the windows,before they paint, and then they never work the same EVER again:furious:
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Those masking magnets look like a pretty cool solution. Do they actually work well and do they actually fit most hinges? I'll give him that suggestion as on most of the houses it is the same painter and on others, I'm sure they would be open to the suggestion. Thanks.
 

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Curmudgeon
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Those masking magnets look like a pretty cool solution. Do they actually work well and do they actually fit most hinges? I'll give him that suggestion as on most of the houses it is the same painter and on others, I'm sure they would be open to the suggestion. Thanks.
Should be quicker (cheaper) for him
than masking or unscrewing them.
 

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Superior Firepower
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Those masking magnets look like a pretty cool solution. Do they actually work well and do they actually fit most hinges? I'll give him that suggestion as on most of the houses it is the same painter and on others, I'm sure they would be open to the suggestion. Thanks.
Those cheap brass plated steel hinges are better off primed and painted anyway. The thin brass coating prevents rust temporarily.
 

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copycat
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Maybe you could tell the painter to tap the pins out instead of removing the hinges. I always thought removing the hinges was stupid with the cheap doors in most new const. houses. I have found that you really do need to leave a good reveal 1/8 - 3/16 around the door to overcompensate for painters and their mexicans.

I sometimes put a long screw behind the top hinge too. Maybe get some more shims in the doors.

What's a painter doing with a drill anyway? :rolleyes:
 

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Maybe you could tell the painter to tap the pins out instead of removing the hinges. I always thought removing the hinges was stupid with the cheap doors in most new const

I sometimes put a long screw behind the top hinge too. Maybe get some more shims in the doors.
:rolleyes:
Removing pins is a good way to keep the hinges from getting mixed up for residential doors. Of course the painters might also lose the pins - which has happened to me, but what are you going to do?

The long screw in the top hinge will suck the door back and raise the latch side corner of the door up.

If you need to suck the entire door back toward the hinge side, use one long screw in each hinge.

You can also use a crescent wrench to slightly bend the hinges in or out before replacing the pin to adjust the way the door sits in the frame - which is faster than shimming.
 

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I had this first couple of houses we did for a builder, he uses a painter that seems to have a different crew every time I see them. Anyway this one paticular painters helper was always pulling the doors off and doing the prep. I watched him remove the top hinge pin first,( this builder will not put three hinges per door no matter how mush we complain) so when slomo pulls the pin top first the door tends to lean out as he is trying to remove the bottom pin. Bent the hinges on a pile of doors before we figured it out. Watch the guy pulling the doors off, and maybe walk through it with the builder to avoid the free call backs. Good luck
 

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Make a door punch list part of your contract...you come back after paint and inspect your work...might work in your advantage. Add $10 per door, go back, fix 2 doors (without hassle) and you made $250.

eg. We hang, trim etc... painter comes, removes hardware takes the door to his shop to spray and brings them back and re-installs. Sometimes paint builds up in the mortise that needs cleaned out. Not all hinges are the same, maybe they weren't put in the exactly how they were. A lot can happen.

Tuning up doors after paint is a standard for us...

The difference is, we don't sub carpentry.
Hey this seems like a good idea, just not sure i fully understand. Is it like... I will hang/trim these 25 doors for this$$. But also add this$$ because i"ll come back after painters leave to check doors? Do you just hide it in the price anyways?
 

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my two cents

If putting a long screw in doesn't help, you can do one of two things.

Put a thin piece of wood behind the hinge (I usually carry tooth picks on me), the side nearest the stop will give you another sixteenth gap in the door opening.

Or you can put a screw behind the stop to pull the jamb a little more on either side.

I agree with the others; you've gotten some good advice. Painters can be a little bit of a pain. Sometimes doors aren't exactly the same size, can be off an eighth inch, and if the painters switch em, you just have to find which one they have switched.

Other times an inexperienced trim person can come behind you after you've set the door and squeeze the base in. If they do this on the hinge side, it will push the door up towards the top jamb, and if there isn't a lot of gap to start with it can cause rubbing there as well as on the bottom.:w00t:
 

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Make a door punch list part of your contract...you come back after paint and inspect your work...might work in your advantage. Add $10 per door, go back, fix 2 doors (without hassle) and you made $250.

eg. We hang, trim etc... painter comes, removes hardware takes the door to his shop to spray and brings them back and re-installs. Sometimes paint builds up in the mortise that needs cleaned out. Not all hinges are the same, maybe they weren't put in the exactly how they were. A lot can happen.

Tuning up doors after paint is a standard for us...

The difference is, we don't sub carpentry.
WYN is right! :clap: Put it in your price and market the Sh!t out of it. Make some money don't do it for free. :thumbsup:
 

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WYN is right! :clap: Put it in your price and market the Sh!t out of it. Make some money don't do it for free. :thumbsup:
I agree. Don't do it for free, but I can imagine the GC saying, "I'm not paying for that." Then you don't have to go back.

Also have the GC check all the doors after install to verify the install was done correctly and he's satisfied.
 
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