Contractor Talk - Professional Construction and Remodeling Forum banner
1 - 20 of 22 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
5 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
hey guys i live in burlington, ontario, and have been asked by a number of clients if i can either fix their deck or build one int he winter and i keep tellin them i cannot dig posts in winter because i strongly believe that the will move come spring and ill have more work to do fixing them.
Any thoughts on this?
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
10,618 Posts
They wont move if you do the footers below the frost line. That's why we establish a frost line. Digging the holes is the hard part in the winter.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,378 Posts
The redi footing looks fine. Also alot of people use "cookies." Which are pre-cast concrete.
As far as moving, I don't see a problem either. The footing is below frost.
For concrete curing time. I still don't see a problem. The ground is 50 some degrees. The concrete will be down in the 50 degree from now on. It will have plenty of time to cure. Just make sure you back fill some after you pour. Even a little will provide insulation so the top of the concrete won't be exposed to the elements.
Like others have said, drilling/digging the holes will be the harder part. Even frost teeth on a auger will be slow going.
You could also run heaters in the areas of the holes.
By the time you do this, it should raise the price of the deck considerably. Fuel cost and labor to monitor the heaters.
Of course it may be better than not working. Depending on your situation.
 

·
Registered
Butcher of wood and metal
Joined
·
6,838 Posts
Biggest problem I see drilling holes in this weather is to even be able to get the hole dug. I have tried to do it in the past with even a auger on a Bobcat and it was a pain to do. Depending on the winter our frost line can be down to 4-5 feet just no way it is worth trying to dig in that stuff.
 

·
We Put Poles In Holes
Joined
·
206 Posts
Wish I would have taken pictures the other day. We set all our poles except 8 on a gable wall before freeze up. Well last week we just drilled those 8 holes. 45 minutes per hole with an 18" anger through 42" of frost. We had my gehl lift pushing down on the auger attached to the skid steer. Lots of down force required otherwise you just spin on top of the frost.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
192 Posts
I have only had to do this once in the past. Used a jack hammer to get through the frost line and then dug the rest of it like normal. Just make sure you finish the hole the same day. If you try to insulate it and finish it the next day, it will be frozen and you will need to jack hammer it again
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
908 Posts
I've done hundred of them on dozens of different decks through the years. The "secret" is to cover the ground with insulating blankets/straw/etc... long before you need to dig the wholes. Frozen turf is actually a bonus when it comes to damage from equipment........
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
48 Posts
Interesting product the only problem is that PVC piping breaks down. Yes that's right schedule 40, 80 PVC main water lines are breaking down into your water supply. So what will happen to the PVC footing. Of course the PVC manufactures don't want this known but it comes directly from the guy replacing the city's PVC water mains. I have seen 80 that has been worn paper thin. Scary that are water contains PVC. So when your deck collapses the company can blame the PVC manufacture. Perfect not my fault. Good product.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
28,132 Posts
Move to Texas and there is no frost line.
 

·
Talking Head
Joined
·
5,388 Posts
For concrete curing time. I still don't see a problem. The ground is 50 some degrees. The concrete will be down in the 50 degree from now on. It will have plenty of time to cure. Just make sure you back fill some after you pour.
If the frost is down to 40" and you install a 48" post then the ground is no where near 50 degrees.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,379 Posts
The frost level by code is just the maximum depth of unproyected soil that is needed to not cause structural damage to a building over a long period - 30 to 50 years annual occurrence period. Snow is a great insulator. I have dug down through 12" of snow to set surveying pins and there was only 4" of frost after a month of -0F to -30F lows for more than a month previously.

Here, some utility contractors will lay a strip of charcoal down and keep it going for a day or two and then cover with blankets to keep in the heat and use the lower thermal inertia/mass of the soil to soften things up a bit. If they are lucky, they will get some snow for additional insulation. the biggest problem is having no snow early in the winter since we have "brown Christmases" about 25% of the time.

When it comes to frost heaving for a post/cylindrical foundation, the ground freezes from the top down and pulls the post or foundation upward. A smooth surface (like PVC or a Sonotube) gives little for the frozen soil to grab on to. Rougher surfaces like had dug or drilled holes without and perviouse drainage material material will heave much quicker, especially if hand dug.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,256 Posts
I live in Maine where the ground freezes solid and the frost goes deep.
I found a local company that comes to the site and sets helical posts in the exact location you request.
I budget around $150 each
They usually take less than 4 hours to set up and complete the task
Once they're gone, I can start building on them immediately. No waiting for Frozen Crete to cure
There's no mess with loose dirt because there's no digging just drilling.
I'll never dig another hole, slop redimix in a wheelbarrow and bust my butt digging in rocky soils.

Check them out. They're located in Canada
Tom


http://www.technometalpost.com/en/contact-2/?gclid=CNeB-ciLtLwCFcY7Ogodlw8Atg
 
1 - 20 of 22 Posts
Top