[Shorty]

Hers an example:

Im on a bath remodel. The plumbing is planned and laid out. Plumber is scheduled. Tile guy is scheduled.

Customer goes to the plumber, not me, says I changed my mind, I want a rain shower overhead and another head on the other side.

Plumber says great I’ll do it. No price is given, I don’t know about it, it changes the Contract price, Scope of Work, and schedule. The extra work takes two extra days because the plumber has an emergency call, so now the tile guy is pushed back, and when the plumber bills me it’s $2K more than my contract, and the customer won’t pay the extra because he don’t know it was more, or that much more, or whatever, and it’s not legally binding, because there was no Change Work Order.

So now I can either lose $2,000 on the project to try and “keep a customer happy”, or not, and damage a relationship with a sub that might be a great guy to work with.

And this why my subs know that any communication between them and the customer that does not involve me, will get them terminated on the spot, and they will never get another project from me. Let alone get paid for the extra.

Worse, the customer brings in another contractor to do something extra while the project is ongoing, “ oh I decided to have this redone while you have the walls open” sort of thing, blows my schedule all to $#%T, and might create more work for me.

My Contract has many many clauses. One is that no Home Improvement projects may take place at the job location while under Contract
with me, unless prior written approval is given.

It’s not just a random power grab, it’s this way from many years of experience knowing so many ways a project can go sideways. And believe me, some customers will find the most amazing ways to derail the most organized project imaginable. Sometimes even unintentionally.

That makes perfect sense. And I thought I was being uptight always redirecting to the Lead even on small stuff, but if it's important for a sub, I would have to imagine that goes double for crew. Thank you for clarifying

 

[reggi]

The biggest red flag for me is a project that’s partially done already.

 

[Kowboy]

The biggest red flag for me is a project that’s partially done already.

True, but bailing people out of trouble can be very profitable. They are done shopping, I guarantee. If his wife is all over his a$$ to get that thing done, you won't have any problems, believe me.

 

[Leo G]

That seems to be a common theme. People expecting that they will be an exception to the rule and being surprised we have a life outside of work. Not that we don't work weekends, but I don't many people who are jumping to schedule further work on weekends. If they're serious, they'll make time.

Can't remember the last time I worked in someones house on a weekend. I use to do most of my looking at jobs on the weekend only because I wanted to be in the shop doing physical work on the weekdays. But now most of my work is going through a couple GCs or people I've done work for before and don't need to do much of that.

 

[Leo G]

Because it shows a lack of trust and control issues?
Makes sense about not wanting them doing the work themselves. You can't exactly control their quality of work like you would an employee, but you're still on the hook for it, regardless.

I would say they want to control costs more. But it always ends up costing the contractor time and money to deal with their failures.

 

[hdavis]

The biggest red flag for me is a project that’s partially done already.

I used to take these on, depending. Last one I did I told the HO to just pay off the existing contract, and I'd take over to finish it out.

 

[Shorty]

I used to take these on, depending. Last one I did I told the HO to just pay off the existing contract, and I'd take over to finish it out.

Did you ever have problems with them not letting you tear the last guy's work back enough to salvage it? We had a job this spring and it went pretty good, but they only wanted us to tear things back so far and the previous guy's work looked like he didn't use a level or square. At some point, it feels a little like polishing a turd. The siding looks good or trim or what have you, but the walls aren't straight in any way.

 

[hdavis]

Did you ever have problems with them not letting you tear the last guy's work back enough to salvage it? We had a job this spring and it went pretty good, but they only wanted us to tear things back so far and the previous guy's work looked like he didn't use a level or square. At some point, it feels a little like polishing a turd. The siding looks good or trim or what have you, but the walls aren't straight in any way.

No, I do what I do and they can hitr me or not.

 

[Jaws]

Excellent point. You don't expect to see your doctor or lawyer on nights and weekends. They are professionals whose time is valuable. Be the same please.

I only meet my attorney on Saturdays, lol. Hes open satursay until 2 to meet about new work. Otherwise I agree

 

[Jaws]

As a GC, we are the ”General” of the army, so to speak.

One of the things I get hired to do is to run the project. The physical work is only a part of that. If that is a shared responsibility, that will only create problems, especially when that is shared with someone who has no professional experience running a project.

I run the project start to finish, 100%, or I don’t run it at all.

Yep

 

[rrk]

We also have to define difficult vs crazy customers
I can usually handle difficult but crazy is a whole different ballgame
I had quite a few crazy customers that got bounced quickly except for one who I told never to call me again before I even finished her kitchen
I would not even talk to her, only to her husband, would not even let her in the kitchen if I was there

 

[GCTony]

Hers an example:

Im on a bath remodel. The plumbing is planned and laid out. Plumber is scheduled. Tile guy is scheduled.

Customer goes to the plumber, not me, says I changed my mind, I want a rain shower overhead and another head on the other side.

Plumber says great I’ll do it. No price is given, I don’t know about it, it changes the Contract price, Scope of Work, and schedule. The extra work takes two extra days because the plumber has an emergency call, so now the tile guy is pushed back, and when the plumber bills me it’s $2K more than my contract, and the customer won’t pay the extra because he don’t know it was more, or that much more, or whatever, and it’s not legally binding, because there was no Change Work Order.

So now I can either lose $2,000 on the project to try and “keep a customer happy”, or not, and damage a relationship with a sub that might be a great guy to work with.

And this why my subs know that any communication between them and the customer that does not involve me, will get them terminated on the spot, and they will never get another project from me. Let alone get paid for the extra.

Worse, the customer brings in another contractor to do something extra while the project is ongoing, “ oh I decided to have this redone while you have the walls open” sort of thing, blows my schedule all to $#%T, and might create more work for me.

My Contract has many many clauses. One is that no Home Improvement projects may take place at the job location while under Contract
with me, unless prior written approval is given.

It’s not just a random power grab, it’s this way from many years of experience knowing so many ways a project can go sideways. And believe me, some customers will find the most amazing ways to derail the most organized project imaginable. Sometimes even unintentionally.

Not to be a jerk but it sounds like you need to train your plumber and all your people that work for you. "sure we can install that rain head but you need to get with Seven and explain what you are looking for. He will issue me a written change order for that. I work for him and not you." I don't do residential (except for friends/family) but no direct communication with the Owner is in our standard subcontract agreement. Like you said, you learn from experience and when you take the General out of the loop, nothing good is going to happen. Same with subs dealing directly with other subs, the General needs to know what they are discussing.

 

[GCTony]

True, but bailing people out of trouble can be very profitable. They are done shopping, I guarantee. If his wife is all over his a$$ to get that thing done, you won't have any problems, believe me.

Yep, I make a whole lot of money fixing, repairing adjusting other people's work. A PM for one of the suppliers I work for calls me The Wizard. Not because I have some special gift it's because I have 40 years of experience of fixing my own screw-ups.

 

[Seven-Delta-FortyOne]

Not to be a jerk but it sounds like you need to train your plumber and all your people that work for you. "sure we can install that rain head but you need to get with Seven and explain what you are looking for. He will issue me a written change order for that. I work for him and not you." I don't do residential (except for friends/family) but no direct communication with the Owner is in our standard subcontract agreement. Like you said, you learn from experience and when you take the General out of the loop, nothing good is going to happen. Same with subs dealing directly with other subs, the General needs to know what they are discussing.

That is an example of why those policies are in place, not an anecdote from my project.

The OP was wondering about why we have some of these policies in place, I gave a hypothetical example.

 

[LaMadrinaViejo]

People who want to do some of the work, use their own sub for part of it, or want a detail breakdown and what subs you plan on using.

People who have one roofing guy friend and they want to put him on your crew. Lol. Or let him manage the crew.

People with s***** yards. Dead giveaway they don't have any money and a bigger giveaway that when they get some money from the insurance carrier they're not going to give it to you.

Anyone that talks crazy and laughs to themselves, wants to purchase their own materials.. claims that they are Christian folks. Calls me more than once a day, has too many animals and don't live on a farm. I had a lady tell me one time that she woke up and there was a strange cat in her bed, And instead of freaking out a little bit she just said oh hi who are you? to the cat.

 

[META]

Project conflict also occurs when one's service does not align with the client's goals. Quick and cheep, verses quality, for example. Custom home to economy build apartments..

Or, just plain ignorance combined with hyper detail.

Project expectations and outcomes to poorly matched products and materials used.

I was just quoting a shower build on a house. The tile guy was all about upselling features. My client just wants the bathroom updated and redone. A few more years in the house, and they are selling. No, we do not need all the fancy stuff, the rest of the home isn't being updated. They just want moderate level materials, no hassles, and no leaks.

Match your products to your clients needs as best as possible.

 

[META]

People who have one roofing guy friend and they want to put him on your crew. Lol. Or let him manage the crew.

People with s***** yards. Dead giveaway they don't have any money and a bigger giveaway that when they get some money from the insurance carrier they're not going to give it to you.

Anyone that talks crazy and laughs to themselves, wants to purchase their own materials.. claims that they are Christian folks. Calls me more than once a day, has too many animals and don't live on a farm. I had a lady tell me one time that she woke up and there was a strange cat in her bed, And instead of freaking out a little bit she just said oh hi who are you? to the cat.

So, no Cat Ladies. Lol

 

[Kingcarpenter1]

Match your products to your clients needs as best as possible

Well stated. My Grandfather would always tell me, we’re not going to see their bank balance son so let’s sit @ their table a few days. Doing kitchen & bath remodels


Mike

 

[LaMadrinaViejo]

So, no Cat Ladies. Lol

Had another customer with 26 cats and when they died they left the house to the cats and paid someone to come feed them every day. She named them all for me once, Samantha, Christopher, Johnathan....that's all I remember because I got stuck on Christopher. WhoTF names a cat Christopher? They all had people names. It was weird. These were the same customers who shown the lost airplane light up my a$$ and lined the ground with their couch cushions in case I fell off their roof.

 

[Spike7]

We also have to define difficult vs crazy customers
I can usually handle difficult but crazy is a whole different ballgame
I had quite a few crazy customers that got bounced quickly except for one who I told never to call me again before I even finished her kitchen
I would not even talk to her, only to her husband, would not even let her in the kitchen if I was there

Ha!! i`ve told many clients " i don`t mind picky . but i won`t deal with impossible ."
i agree with one of the guys said about getting along with the client in general
i talk with possible future clients or guys look for a job , for a bit. make small talk , see if they open up a bit , and after a while , you can see if your agreeable for the most part
but if i find we have nothing in common ,i steer clear