I'd do it myself, but I'm too busym

 

Slanted eyes, a rag on the head, ones that are living way above their income — lot’s of toys are a dead no go 4 sure. Those that say they could do it if they had time or they have some imaginary family in the business. That’s just a few. Learn to interview them, often through a phone call or text


Mike

 

that are living way above their income — lot’s of toys are a dead no go 4

Because they might not be able or willing to pay later and then you're out materials and time?

 

Rather than picking on stereotypes, I recommend just going with your built-in radar in most cases. We all have a built-in BS meter, though admittedly that takes some hard-knocks calibration over time.

Some clients need their hands held with decision-making; others know what they want and are willing to pay for that. I'm more comfortable with the latter, but you do need to develop a feel for whether they actually have that willingness. The good ones know they can be a PITA, and don't mind.

If you don't mind hand-holding, those folks can be quite lucrative--but keep in mind, you'll likely spend as much or more time doing that as actually performing the work.

And of course, it should go without saying (though I'm saying it anyway) that you should make sure to have a good contract to CYA.

 

That makes sense about the hand holding. Some of them do and don't need it and being willing to do that.

CYA

What's CYA?

 

You said you aren’t choosing your customers. So you have no choice … do the job snd smile. But surely you can look back and see those thatvwere difficult, and some warning signs they gav3 off.

 

Comparing this thread and what I've been reading to the last one, it is easier to see. It's trying NOT to smile at some of the stuff said to the Lead that kills me. 😂

 

Trust your gut as Tin said your built in radar will let you know
I used to be a contractor, my brother in law is a contractor, treat me right on this one I will give you more work, my realtor said it won't cost a lot, no need for a permit the red flags are always there of course these days some people think that phone is a leash for them late night phone calls texts and E Mails

 

Ones that balk at a down payment or a small scheduling fee of some sort.

Ones that call you twice for an estimate. (Happened to me, I was a fool and took on the project. Wish I didn't, she was a nightmare)

Anyone who tells you that you are too expensive and you know you aren't.

"You're so much more expensive than everyone else"
"Call them up then, goodbye"

That dude actually had the nerve to call me and ask me to fix the cheap guys phuk up. 😅

Liquor store owners

People who already ordered the windows

Electrical engineers are always a pain.



Listen to your gut, you'll get the feel for it. You're not gonna sniff them all out but again...listen to your gut.

 

If they have a lot of horror stories of past contractors, dig in and ask follow up.

totally likely they just got screwed by clowns. But also possible it’s a “them” problem.

dig in (not too obviously) and decide whether they’re hard to work with and maybe those other contractors werent the problem

 

Check civil and criminal records of principles if the job could break you financially.

Some team members don't play nice even when it is THEIR $$$.

 

I've got kind of a short list of red flags that have helped me once I learned them the hard way:

Want a hard price for a complicated project on the spot.

Want to provide the materials to dodge paying a markup. Sometimes I'll install customer provided items if it's something special (a fixture they found while on vacation springs to mind), but if they just want a day laborer they need to go elsewhere.

Promising more work if you give them a discount on this job. Never works out.

Want to collect a huge number of bids. I don't mind being competitive, I know my market, but if they're getting 6-7 bids on a job it probably means they're going to be a problem later.

Anyone that contacts you well outside of business hours. If you call me at 10pm something better be on fire.

Don't want to pull permits. This is distinct from people who don't understand that they're necessary, but if somebody expressly doesn't want the proper permits pulled just walk away. Don't risk your license for somebody to save a few hundred bucks on permit fees.

And of course crazy people. I did a lot of work for a customer that was very financially successful but completely paranoid and bonkers. Convinced there were people living secretly in their back yard and such. After a while they tried to drag me into their nonsense and it was a huge mental drain.

 

That helps a lot. Thank you!

Want to collect a huge number of bids. I don't mind being competitive, I know my market, but if they're getting 6-7 bids on a job it probably means they're going to be a problem later.

This means they're always looking for the cheap route or a way to undercut?

 

When they show you a full wrap around T and G porch with collapsing posts and say they really don't want to spend a lot of money and will get the materials from guy they know.

When they talk to you like you are 12 years old and ask if you really want this job, because you aren't responding to thier every whim and expectation.

 

A lot of great advice here. One thing I will add is getting along with the client. Tough to work with someone you generally don't get along with. I'm a fast paced guy, organized and very detailed. So I don't work well with disorganized HO's who can't make a decision. I also don't work well with customers who want it sugar coated or blow smoke up their ass. I like to pull the band-aid right away no matter the pain. So even though these can be great clients they simply aren't for me.

Huge red flag is work hours. Had one estimate that wanted me to work around their 25 year old kids sleep schedule. Kid got up between 10 and noon. This is the work hours and the job will be open M-F at these hours. If they plan a vacation and don't want you in their home, just run. I have garage codes and hidden key locations for most of my customers.

Also learn to read tire kickers on the phone. If they sound like a tire kicker or price shopping ask a few questions and give a rough ballpark before wasting more time. If they still want you to come out charge a small consult fee, if they won't pay $50 they aren't committed to doing anything other than wasting your time.

Lastly, and I catch heat from some for this. I only look at jobs during work hours m-f 8-4. If they can't be bothered to alter their schedule for a 30min-1 hour meeting then they aren't serious. Looking at jobs on the weekends and nights I found most were just curious what their "dream project" will cost.

 

Lastly, and I catch heat from some for this. I only look at jobs during work hours m-f 8-4. If they can't be bothered to alter their schedule for a 30min-1 hour meeting then they aren't serious. Looking at jobs on the weekends and nights I found most were just curious what their "dream project" will cost.

Excellent point. You don't expect to see your doctor or lawyer on nights and weekends. They are professionals whose time is valuable. Be the same please.

 

Situational awareness. Is the garage cleaner than your kitchen? Does the pegboard have the crescent wrench outlined in black magic marker? White carpet and you have to take your shoes off (careful, that could be cultural)?

Ask if they've had any other work done recently and if so, how did it go? You'd be amazed at the amount of potential customers who will tell you how they had to sue the last guy. Check please, as the guy may have deserved to be sued.

It's never a good idea to stereotype, however, knowing that business is done differently in other parts of the world and that some customers prefer to do business their way isn't stereotyping, it's good business sense. To many people the contractor does the job and then you negotiate.

In one of my last sink replacement jobs, the customer was balking at making a $3,000.00 down payment on a custom made kitchen sink saying he'd had trouble with his pool screening contractor. I asked him if I waived the down payment, could we do business? He said "Yes", we shook hands, no signed contract. The sink went in flawlessly, he paid in full and it was a moneymaker. Why did I risk it? I would have sold the custom sink eventually, but more importantly, he and his wife were in the right neighborhood and were nice people. If you can't fly by the seat of your pants occasionally, you're going to leave a lot of money on the table, believe me.

 

The best one I have is a cold call customer who was very rude over the phone. Back and forth about a bunch of different work and I said let's price 1 project and if the numbers work we can talk about the other stuff. After trying to several dates and times to come take a look she says "I work all week I will be home on Saturday." "Yep me too, good luck with your project."

I have said no to 3 specific project my gut told me hell no. Big projects and big money, I was fully capable of the work. The people/location/project just didn't feel right and I politely declined after thinking on it a day or two. All 3 would have put me out of business for sure. My lead at the time was like man you really know when to walk away. 2 ended in litigation and the ended up with 3 separate contractors before it sorta got finished.

 

Thank you for taking the time to offer input and clarification. I definitely learned a lot here.

 

People who want to do some of the work, use their own sub for part of it, or want a detail breakdown and what subs you plan on using.

 

Because it shows a lack of trust and control issues?
Makes sense about not wanting them doing the work themselves. You can't exactly control their quality of work like you would an employee, but you're still on the hook for it, regardless.

 

I don't have much to add here but i ask how they got my name, if its a referral that puts me at ease. I have learnt, thanks to this forum, there are basically a few reasons for screening customers:

Is it a job i want to do? I no longer have to take everything that comes my way.
Are they willing to wait for me before i can do the work?

If that initial contact with the potential customer goes well and i agree to look at the job then when we meet that is where I am mentally screening them. In time and with experience you can pick up on when something seems off.

My experience is that you run in to one or two whacko's from time to time.

I will add this, non of this means they won't be a deadbeat non payer, that is where you need good contract language, timely payments or work stops. Don't put yourself out there, we can all tolerate different risk.

 

Lots of good, solid advice in this thread. 👍

It will also vary with the individual contractor. I turn down work these days that I just don’t want to do, because the project isnt a good fit for me, when the customer might be fine.

For me, a customer buying anything but possibly a unique plumbing or electrical fixture is an absolute non starter. It is without fail a clusterfkk. I know many contractors do not feel that way, which is why I said it will vary a lot with different contractors. One of my tile subs likes the customer to supply their own tile, and he just installs. I can’t operate like that.

Any residential project where there is more than one other bidder, maybe a 3rd for some rare scenario, I won’t even bother quoting it. I don’t think homeowners getting involved in competitive bidding scenarios is a good idea at all. They are not public entities with in house engineers and planning depts, so it’s an asinine activity in my opinion, and one which I will decline to participate in.

Anyone who thinks I’m going to work without shoes on; Hard pass. This isn’t a dance routine, and if you think shoes are going to be a problem, you’re really gonna be messed up with all the dust, dirt, noise, vibration, etc, of a construction project.

High maintenance vs low maintenance is a personal choice. I’ve worked with both, had great success with the high maintenance types, but you have charge for PM/Admin work in your bid. Your time needs to be charged out, whether you are demo’ing a wall or describing the intricacies of the project.

I personally have found Asians to be difficult people to work with. Their religion and culture is cold, materialistic, and self-centered, and they are usually fussy for no reason, unreasonable, miserable, and just a drag to be around.

Anyone who doesn’t want me in their house without them there is not going to work out for me. We need to have mutual trust and respect for a large construction project to work, and if that’s lacking, I want no part of it.

 

Working around day to day schedules, possibly pet or unsupervised kid issues, etc

 

People that try to get between you and your subs can cause some headaches.

 

Talking behind your back or trying to be a go between when it's entirely unnecessary?

 

As a GC, we are the ”General” of the army, so to speak.

One of the things I get hired to do is to run the project. The physical work is only a part of that. If that is a shared responsibility, that will only create problems, especially when that is shared with someone who has no professional experience running a project.

I run the project start to finish, 100%, or I don’t run it at all.

 

Spoken like a true dictator business in not a democracy sure I'll listen but I and I alone decide

 

The biggest red flag for me is a project that’s partially done already.

 

True, but bailing people out of trouble can be very profitable. They are done shopping, I guarantee. If his wife is all over his a$$ to get that thing done, you won't have any problems, believe me.

 

We also have to define difficult vs crazy customers
I can usually handle difficult but crazy is a whole different ballgame
I had quite a few crazy customers that got bounced quickly except for one who I told never to call me again before I even finished her kitchen
I would not even talk to her, only to her husband, would not even let her in the kitchen if I was there

 

We also have to define difficult vs crazy customers
I can usually handle difficult but crazy is a whole different ballgame
I had quite a few crazy customers that got bounced quickly except for one who I told never to call me again before I even finished her kitchen
I would not even talk to her, only to her husband, would not even let her in the kitchen if I was there

Ha!! i`ve told many clients " i don`t mind picky . but i won`t deal with impossible ."
i agree with one of the guys said about getting along with the client in general
i talk with possible future clients or guys look for a job , for a bit. make small talk , see if they open up a bit , and after a while , you can see if your agreeable for the most part
but if i find we have nothing in common ,i steer clear

 

Project conflict also occurs when one's service does not align with the client's goals. Quick and cheep, verses quality, for example. Custom home to economy build apartments..

Or, just plain ignorance combined with hyper detail.

Project expectations and outcomes to poorly matched products and materials used.

I was just quoting a shower build on a house. The tile guy was all about upselling features. My client just wants the bathroom updated and redone. A few more years in the house, and they are selling. No, we do not need all the fancy stuff, the rest of the home isn't being updated. They just want moderate level materials, no hassles, and no leaks.

Match your products to your clients needs as best as possible.

 

Match your products to your clients needs as best as possible

Well stated. My Grandfather would always tell me, we’re not going to see their bank balance son so let’s sit @ their table a few days. Doing kitchen & bath remodels


Mike

 

So that second red bull walloped me, and I couldn't sleep and ended up compiling this thread onto paper. It actually turned out pretty cool and boiled down well. Thank you for all the input. Here is the result.

 

Pretty surprising!

If someone were to tell me they were going to tie one on Friday night, and post a pic to the internet.....