[Patsfanindallas]

So we have a contract to gut an old house and convert it into a cafe/bar/bookstore. We are approximately 3/4 finished with the job. The owners are happy with the work, but we are coming upon a bunch of change orders, and want to use some subs that they found, obviously because tgey think itll be cheaper.

As the GC with my name on the contract, the permits, and the insurance, I don't think they should be able to pull in their own subs to do anything. Any suggestions?

 

[KAP]

Unless you are contracted for the Change Orders or your contract states they can't do it, they don't HAVE to use you...

Pointing out the potential pitfalls, delays that occur because of scheduling/overruns that are out of your control, the subs work affecting your work, warranty issues, etc... may sway them to change their mind...

 

[mrcharles]

You can push back on this... You are carrying the liability and the permit on the job. You can not be expected to manage and coordinate their sub. However you do need to entertain using their sub, but contracted to you.

 

[Patsfanindallas]

You can push back on this... You are carrying the liability and the permit on the job. You can not be expected to manage and coordinate their sub. However you do need to entertain using their sub, but contracted to you.

Kinda what I was thinking. I'm responsible for everything on that job. What happens if that sub gets hurt on my job site? What happens if his work injures one of my workers? Who is it on if his work fails code? Am I supposed to watch and be responsible for them?

 

[brunothedog]

No matter how the contract is written, The law states that i am the only one responsible for the well being of all those on the job site, therefore o have the last say as who comes on the site.
when a customer has stated that they may sub on their own on a contract. It is not legal while I own the site. Their subs come thru me, or wait until I am done with my work, and paid, and the owners have signed the release.

 

[mrcharles]

No matter how the contract is written, The law states that i am the only one responsible for the well being of all those on the job site, therefore o have the last say as who comes on the site.
when a customer has stated that they may sub on their own on a contract. It is not legal while I own the site. Their subs come thru me, or wait until I am done with my work, and paid, and the owners have signed the release.

You're obviously not a gc. Often times I have to coordinate and deal with owners AV, security, or phone contractors.... I make nothing from it, but still have to handle it. But anything beyond low voltage and specialties needs to go through me. Though there such a thing as multiple prime contracts... A lot of higher Ed projects go this way.

 

[tedanderson]

X2 on that. They have to let you finish what you are doing and end the job with a clean break. Even if they want to settle up with you on where the project is right now and let the other guys finish the rest, that's the way to do it.

Aside of the liability factory, what concerns me is the potential for blaming and finger pointing if there is a problem when the other guys come on to the scene. Even if they do something that is clearly THEIR fault, the HO may not want to pay you until the other company finishes and/or corrects their work.

Also, one thing that you REALLY don't want to have happen is for a delay in their work to cause a delay in yours. I've caused a cabinet builder to get burned a couple of times (being in the change-order-guy position) simply because I was waiting on some strange part for one of my systems and the HO didn't want to pay them until my stuff was ready to be closed in.

 

[greg24k]

I would never allow owners get someone else while being under contract, having your name on the permit and being responsible person on the job.

If they have someone cheaper, have them sign off on the job that your job is done, collect your final payment and let them bring anyone they want.
In addition, I would make them sign a waver that you're not responsible for any damages to your work caused by others.Owner takes sole responsibility for all and any damages.

 

[mudpad]

I wouldn't have a problem with it if they (the subs) can pre qualify, provide proof of insurance and workmen's comp, agree to your payment schedules etc. and you get reimbursed for supervision, project management and a fair profit on subcontracted work. Otherwise they can wait 'til you have final completion and full payment and then they can pull their own permits.

That's only fair, and if you explain that respectfully, I don't think they can argue with the logic.

 

[Shellbuilder]

What are the changes?

 

[Patsfanindallas]

What are the changes?

Possible aesthetic only brick chimney, side walk and handicap ramp. Maybe a few other things.

 

[jamestrd]

Kinda what I was thinking. I'm responsible for everything on that job. What happens if that sub gets hurt on my job site? What happens if his work injures one of my workers? Who is it on if his work fails code? Am I supposed to watch and be responsible for them?

I think you answered your own questions..the change order is just that and you are within your rights to make sure those issues are included in them.

 

[sunkist]

Possible aesthetic only brick chimney, side walk and handicap ramp. Maybe a few other things.

That ada ramp needs a permit, Side walk needs a permit who`s lic?. This is your job site, You rule the roost.

 

[brunothedog]

You're obviously not a gc. Often times I have to coordinate and deal with owners AV, security, or phone contractors.... I make nothing from it, but still have to handle it. But anything beyond low voltage and specialties needs to go through me. Though there such a thing as multiple prime contracts... A lot of higher Ed projects go this way.

No, I do not allow others to enter My job site, The law specifically states so.
The subs Signing a waver does not relieve me of the responsibility.
I have no problem with the HO getting their own painters, tile guys, etc..
But I will be long gone and paid before that happens,
You never had a death on the job site I see.
They will all come to you looking for answers, and liability.
Here the penal law is strict, everything else Waivers, signing off, etc..
goes thru civil, after they have raped you for all.
This happened at my uncles job site.
So , I know how it will go down if crap happens. after 8 yrs, he is still being sued.