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The charts you are looking at are for loose angles, that is why they stop at 10 or 12 feet. Spanning a 16' opening is not a loose angle, it has to be bolted to the framing, and as such there are entirely too many variables for a simple chart.

With 3' of masonry to support and assuming a sufficient framing member, then then a 3x3x3/16 bolted 24" OC could be sufficient. It depends upon the framing, not the angle.
 

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Discussion Starter · #23 ·
The charts you are looking at are for loose angles, that is why they stop at 10 or 12 feet. Spanning a 16' opening is not a loose angle, it has to be bolted to the framing, and as such there are entirely too many variables for a simple chart.

With 3' of masonry to support and assuming a sufficient framing member, then then a 3x3x3/16 bolted 24" OC could be sufficient. It depends upon the framing, not the angle.
Yes I've been assuming loose steel lintel. You're saying the 3.5x5.5 but bolted to the framing. No idea if the framing is up to it. They have another quote, maybe I'll let the other guys do it. I have zero desire to get into adding filtch plates or adding to headers etc...

Thanks everyone
 

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Discussion Starter · #24 ·
Ok, so I got the job, the couple told me what the other quote was and it was nuts, I'll make excellent money charging 1/2 of the other quote. I'm going to get a 3.5x7x 3/8 or whatever is closest and bolt into the framing. I put in a caveat for insufficient framing.

Best part is I can do it at my covenience. Since it's an easy setup I'll wait until really cold weather. thanks for the help guys
 

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Even if you have to take out the header and make one with a steel plate, win win for a half a day work and a couple hundred for the material.
 

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Discussion Starter · #27 · (Edited)
Maybe the other guy wasn't as confident as you are about the header supporting the load.

Good luck either way.
That's why I put in the caveat about the framing being adequate. Personally I doubt that it will be, but we'll see.

I know there's not supposed to be any pricing talk but.... the other guy(doing foundation work) quoted $12,000 to remove the approx 350 brick, the lintel a couple light fixtures and replace with new (except light fixtures). i figure I'll have about $1000 in materials including heat and I'll do it easy in 8 days or less myself, 5 if i can find a labourer by then, more likely a lot less, my price was a little less than 1/2 the other guys

I think the foundation guy got a quote and just doubled it. that and he probably saw an older couple who were nervous about the brick falling on their car and got crazy greedy
 

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Discussion Starter · #31 ·
Couldn't tell you. The garage door if framed by 2x6's and the steel rests on the 2x6 along with some decorative trim. That is all bowing, but...the garage is drywalled and the drywall inside isn't cracked at all. I would think that the drywall is attached to the header.
 

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Discussion Starter · #33 ·
Yeah I'll get someone to spec whatever is needed if it comes to it. I figure if there is at least 2 2x12 with some plywood and it hasn't deflected at all i'll probably live with it. The steel will still do 75% or more of the job, what is it carrying 150lbs per ft or so, and really only 1/2 that, a 3.5x7x 3/8 is a pretty decent piece of metal
 

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Make sure and post pics of you doing military presses with that hunk of steel before you put it on the scaffold.
 

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Discussion Starter · #36 ·
Make sure and post pics of you doing military presses with that hunk of steel before you put it on the scaffold.
Yeah it's going to be heavy. We just put in an 8' H beam at the job I'm on now, 8' x 8" wide x 6.5" high, I'm guessing at 5/16" Took 3 of us to lift it into place basically one side at a time, plus there was only 2" extra space on each side of the pocket. that sucked, but it went smoother than I would have thought. Helps when the guys you have helping are of the same mind how to go about it
 

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Yeah it's going to be heavy. We just put in an 8' H beam at the job I'm on now, 8' x 8" wide x 6.5" high, I'm guessing at 5/16" Took 3 of us to lift it into place basically one side at a time, plus there was only 2" extra space on each side of the pocket. that sucked, but it went smoother than I would have thought. Helps when the guys you have helping are of the same mind how to go about it
Get a hand-crank fork lift like the HVAC guys use, 2 guys installed 2 steel car lifts without any power equipment, just a crank lift.
 

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you are way over with the 7" high. 3/8 4 X 4 is plenty with lags. save the folks some money and your back.
This is not rocket science, rust probably caused the initial damage. The framing from 40 years ago is better than today by far.
 

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Discussion Starter · #39 ·
I guess i'm just wary of using lags since I've never done it or even seen it done around here. except for wall ties the masonry is completely independent of the framing everywhere, but all of a sudden there will be a lot of weight added to the framing which was originally designed only to take the wall load.

I won't be saving anyone except myself going with the smaller angle, I've already given them a price and they've accepted. The minimum i would go would be the typical 3.5x5.5x5/16, which is what is already there, at that point i would be willing to put some lags in every 2' if the framing looked up to it, since I think that steel will be doing most of the work. Last year a contractor was supplying all the materials and gave me a 3.5x3.5 for an 8' opening that had less than 1' of material above it. I knew it was undersized and said so but thye GC convinced me to use it since there was so little material above. By the time I got to the soffit the angle had sagged and was touching the brick mould. I tore it out and put the proper size in the next day, no problems.

I've installed 10'x 3.5x5.5 lots of times myself, so I'm sure I can get the bigger one in with no problems with a hand from a friend for an hour

40 years ago they were using the same 2x12's we're using today. I think glulams and LVLs are more structurally stable by far than lumber.

You may think it's overkill but I've seen lots of undersized angles that are dropping, I'm charging these folks quite a bit of money, I don't need to skimp.
 

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When doing the opening for the 16' garage we braced the precast 17'4" lintel. They weewe usually pumped petty quickyl after, but the bracing could have been removed after it set for a cuople days without an issue.

Long story short brace your steel till it sets up.
 
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