It has been driving me crazy for awhile now to foam or not to foam around windows? I had a customer tell me I installed her windows wrong and I wasent supposed to foam them. She said they do not operate right because foam bowed the jams. they seem fine to me, I like foam it seals better than anthing else. some people tell me not to foam in stucco situations because you are locking window in place and will crack stucco I dont know if this is true or not?
D. Jones Const
Use of low-expansion foam WILL give you the best sealing and insulating qualities, period. Some old timers may try to argue but that is just because they are set in their ways. Further, no manufactrurer will have a problem with it, in fact, many recommend it... My question is why is your customer informing YOU of the proper way to install a window. This is stuff that you need to know so that you can articulate it to them when they have questions or concerns.
Yes, low expansion foam. I usually put in about 2" on all windows, then go back and do it again. This way you aren't as likely to have any bowing issues.
Also, sometimes I will cut 'spreader' bars for the windows. Install at midpoint of the window. Now there is no way it can bow.
If you filled the cavity all in one go, there is a chance you bowed the windows. Simply measure the width at top and bottom. Then measure in the middle - this will tell you if you bowed them.
If you did bow them, then you need to remove the foam, install spreader bars, and do it again.
Carefull - the HO can check this pretty easy. :whistling
Also, sometimes I will cut 'spreader' bars for the windows. Install at midpoint of the window. Now there is no way it can bow.
If you filled the cavity all in one go, there is a chance you bowed the windows. Simply measure the width at top and bottom. Then measure in the middle - this will tell you if you bowed them.
If you did bow them, then you need to remove the foam, install spreader bars, and do it again.
Carefull - the HO can check this pretty easy. :whistling
I know they are fine I measured them top, middle and bottom even showed the ho with level how the jambs were still straight. she was complaining because one was off 1/16" from top to middle (wow). I have foamed windows for awhile and never had problems, I have even used the expanding kind when I ran the hilti gun out in the middle of nowhere and diden't really have a problem. marvin recommends minimal expanding foam of any kind I even showed the ho who is a freind of about 6 years this and she was convinced they dident operate right. Than it even got to the point where she was complaining about the nails I used, were the wrong nails. I think she just lost her mind she paid me upfront for the whole job and I got windows installed and cualked in exterior than all the sudden its like I killed her dog or something she will not return my calls or even talk to me. I am just doubting myself trying to figure this mess out for the last 6 months its bothered me.
Expanding foam will cause the windows to stick. Same as framing them in too tight.
Wood structures need to breath. When there is no room between the framing and the window, they will get stuck.
Just like installing a wood floor, roof sheeting, sheer wall paneling etc.
there should always be room for expansion.
A better alternative is fiberglass insulation, stuffed in loose with a butter knife.
This will allow room to breath as the seasons change.
Expanding foam will also damage the finish of the window.
Read the manufactures WARNING and install instructions.
Wood structures need to breath. When there is no room between the framing and the window, they will get stuck.
Just like installing a wood floor, roof sheeting, sheer wall paneling etc.
there should always be room for expansion.
A better alternative is fiberglass insulation, stuffed in loose with a butter knife.
This will allow room to breath as the seasons change.
Expanding foam will also damage the finish of the window.
Read the manufactures WARNING and install instructions.
In Ontario it is code to put foam around doors and windows, fiberglass can't be used. I've heard insulation pros call it filterglass-- those dark gray and black spots are where the air passes through. As far as I and my customers are concerned, foam is the only way to go.
I also foam in several passes, best is from the inside and outside.
I also foam in several passes, best is from the inside and outside.
The only thing that concerns me with foam is the head jamb. If the header sags at all, the head jamb of the window could sag as well. I notice this a lot on gliding doors. If shims or foam are used at the head jamb of a sliding door, over time the header sags and effects the operating panel. I have to remove the casing, cut out the foam (or remove shims) and replace with fiberglass insulation. So, I always use fiberglass, and never shim top of window or door.
I think that filling the void around the outside of the replacement window is overrated.
I used to think you had to "fill" the gap until I saw an airflow test.
One pass of foam as long as it was done correctly would allow as much air to pass through as a "filled" void.
With the price of foam I was surprised and relieved.:clap:
I used to think you had to "fill" the gap until I saw an airflow test.
One pass of foam as long as it was done correctly would allow as much air to pass through as a "filled" void.
With the price of foam I was surprised and relieved.:clap:
As an option to the OP,
and proof using fiberglass as a viable alternative to foam,
because I am cheap,and get bags of remnants from my insulator,
and I have pulled 20 year old windows stuffed with glass,
without any visible damage,
I'll post these pictures again:
These are shots of my own garage door that's been half done for ten years!
Notice the lack of discoloration in the second picture where I pulled out a piece of the glass.
and proof using fiberglass as a viable alternative to foam,
because I am cheap,and get bags of remnants from my insulator,
and I have pulled 20 year old windows stuffed with glass,
without any visible damage,
I'll post these pictures again:
These are shots of my own garage door that's been half done for ten years!
Notice the lack of discoloration in the second picture where I pulled out a piece of the glass.
Attachments
an interesting question here, shoemaker mentions the blower door test and sealing for air around the window. A house wrapped in a plastic bag would seal up too, but it's also the insulation that is important. On the other hand, you're insulating around something that has an R value of 3-6 at best. So. . .. I foam from the inside, and outside and if I happen to trap air between both passes all the better.
There are a lot of choices out there, but the Teq foam that we use boasts an R-value of r-5 per inch... Now in a 1/8" gap around a window you aren't going to see measureable energy-savings due to the r-value, but it can't be beat in terms of sealing. Anybody who replaces a lot of windows knows how customers suddenly get a super-human ability to feel drafts after installation. Knowing that opening is completely sealed is priceless.
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