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Daikin FIT system - Can't get it working correctly

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tombeck2727

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Discussion starter · #1 ·
Hopefully someone can help-

I'm at my witt's end with this HVAC contractor - He was supposed to provide us with 5 tons of cooling per room - Not happening.

An HVAC contractor provided & installed (4) 5 ton Daikin FIT systems for us - (1) each in four 16' x 26" x10' ht ceiling rooms - The air handler is installed in the room with no plenum or ducting what-so-ever. The units will not cool the rooms even though the load varies dramatically from room to room. The HVAC contractor has been scratching his head for months - A couple of Daikin reps came out and we never heard from them.

The HVAC contractor told us how these units where the cat's meow - They could do all sorts of stuff - At this point I'm wondering if the software/technology is just "too smart" for our application? Something screwy is going on.

The latest from the HVAC contractor is that he's guessing maybe the units need some sort of "static pressure" to function? Currently, there is no ducting at all - Just the unit hanging in the rooms.

We're looking into installing 12' - 15' of ducting to find out what that does.....(why we're doing, I don't know)

Thanks for any help
 
#2 ·
Do you have 4 condensing units, or is it supposed to run all 4 off one unit? I did a quickie google search, looks like the typical ductless system ... so I would be throwing the BS flag on his diagnosis.

I recently had 2 typical split systems installed, performance was terrible. GC and hvac installer were no help, so i called in a commissioning specialist. Cost me $3,000 but we learned a lot ... basically that the installer was incompetent. They installed double filters in the units, so the static pressure was way over spec. It had a 2 stage compressor, but they wired it so it come on at max every time ... and would only run for 2 min before cycling off. And they had the outside makeup air dampers wide open, rather than the 20% that was on the design. There was more. Point is, it took the consultant less than an hour to find everything and now its running correctly.
 
Discussion starter · #3 ·
Half-fast-

Thanks for the input - I'm hoping someone on here has knowledge to put us on the right course - I absolutely detest working with "consultants". I'm sure there are authentic guys out there but......

Yeah each unit is a stand-alone & has it's own condenser.

I'm sure there's someone at Daikin that could help, but they are worthless at this point.

All we need is an engineer or a knowledgably person on this site I'm sure.

Thanks again
 
Discussion starter · #9 ·
I'll try again......Anyone here that can offer some advice? Have four Daikin FIT systems - One 5-ton system per 400sf room, (10' ht ceiling).....all have similar loads...Odly, the one with the highest load is the only unit that operates correctly, (or close to it).....The other three are all over the board.....The installing contractor has been out several times, as well as "reps", (I'm assuming "sales" reps, because no one as of yet has come up with anything to remedy)

I'm no HVAC guy, but could it be these FIT systems are just "too smart" for our application? Is there any way to replace the controls?

When a "rep" was out he noted that one of the units would not run a maximum.....But when put in "charge" mode, the unit blasted.....WTH?

The entire air handler unit is mounted in the rooms - no ductwork what-so-ever.
 
Discussion starter · #10 ·
Half-fast Eddie said:
It’s an ice house. Or maybe the contractor grossly over sold ... and under delivered.
Click to expand...
Yeah - You'd think, but don't cool worth a crap......There's more to it, but still seeking help.....The air handler units are inside the rooms....condenser outside of course.....No ductwork; Thought possible unit is c\\\"confused" w/o static pressure? Anyhow they operate sporadically....In my lay-man's terms; I think the FIT system is "too smart"......Sposed to be in residence, but it's in a commercial utility install....Hoping to make it work somehow.....
 
#12 ·
Tom, this is a very strange situation. Are you a GC? Is this your regular HVAC sub? Or are you the building owner?
Seems to me when you contracted for the installation you would not pay until the units worked as contracted. Even if you did pay, are they not under warranty?
If you cannot get the HVAC contractor to fix them, I would hire a competent contractor to fix the units and then seek legal remedy for the cost of repairs.
I don't think you'll have much luck trying to get an HVAC expert to fix it for you over the internet. "They don't cool worth a crap" is not much to go on. A competent contractor needs to go on site and diagnose the problem(s) with test equipment, etc.
 
Discussion starter · #15 ·
tjbnwi said:
Block off part of the supply side opening, lets see if it is a static pressure issue.

Tom
Click to expand...
Bingo! Blocked-off aprx. 50% of the intake and whalla!..... Unit revs-up - starts blasting out substantially cooler air and at a higher rate....Pulled temp down 15 degrees in room......Over a year battling this and several "experts", (including a couple visits from Daikin reps), poking-around.....Thank you sir! Now we're finally getting somewhere.

So now we've come full-circle around to my initial thoughts; That these FIT units are wrongly specified/applied......So, are my current thoughts appropriate that we're now to play the game of "fooling the technology" I suppose?
 
Discussion starter · #16 ·
tombeck2727 said:
Bingo! Blocked-off aprx. 50% of the intake and whalla!..... Unit revs-up - starts blasting out substantially cooler air and at a higher rate....Pulled temp down 15 degrees in room......Over a year battling this and several "experts", (including a couple visits from Daikin reps), poking-around.....Thank you sir! Now we're finally getting somewhere.

So now we've come full-circle around to my initial thoughts; That these FIT units are wrongly specified/applied......So, are my current thoughts appropriate that we're now to play the game of "fooling the technology" I suppose?
Click to expand...
OK - Now it appears the unit has adapted to the "Mcgiver antic"....Back to not cooling.....
 
Discussion starter · #18 ·
tjbnwi said:
Now you need to get the static pressure balanced. That with take some ducting and a manometer.

Tom
Click to expand...
Hey, thank you for the info.....Daikin contacted me a few days ago. They have since come out and made "adjustments", to which one of the four units appears to be functioning properly. While I am thankful Daikin has stepped-up where the contractor has failed/abandoned us, I am continuing with guarded optimism however, because we've been here before, time & again.

My "laymans" opinion of this has always been that the FIT systems are great systems just not appropriate, (or "Too smart"), for our application, (indoor agriculture), It seems the AC's can be "McGivered"/"adjusted" to work properly, then eventually "re-think" and everything goes all hay-wire again. This was confirmed/agreed to by the Daikin rep that came out last, as he informed me they've, (Daikin), had similar issues with other FIT systems in agriculture/green house type environments, and adamantly suggest the FIT should not be installed in an ag environment. He brought replacement thermostats, ("old style he said), but ended-up not replacing them.

He got the one unit working, but my fear is, it won't last long.....It will revert-back again, just as it has time & again.

They're all tight-lipped on their "meetings" among themselves....Wish they would share, it's costing us dearly($), in lost production.

Thanks again for your help/insights - I pass them along
 
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tombeck2727
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