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mightyoakllc

· MightyOakContractingLLC
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Discussion starter · #1 ·
Hello All!!
I have been pounding away for a few months now and am doing very well. Its hard finding help but luckily I have a few specialty sub's I can lean on here and there.

This will be as short as possible but I want to get be clear about the situation I am in.
I was referred to a customer from a very good source that I wanted to keep on my good side. So this HO needed a complete bathroom remodel gut job. With new marble shower and vanity top. Restore cherry paneling in the bath and the heart pine floors refinished. Sherle Wagner fixtures were retained but had to be rebuilt etc. etc... I submitted a quote for this with 2 draws. They were in a mad rush to get this bath done for accessibilty for a family member. They accepted my bid over several others due to my historic preservation background and reputation. Also there is an exterior contract that was submitted at the same time I was clear that I would knock out the bath ASAP but could not get to the exterior restoration for quite sometime. I didn't include a timeline on the exterior work proposal. Their bank cut me a one check for the first draw of the exterior work and the first draw of the bath.
I knew I should have just handed that back but like I said mad rush!!

So I knocked out the bath and the first 1/3 of the work required on the exterior contract and continued to stress to them I don't have time to complete the exterior work at this time. I submitted an invoice for the final draw on the bath and gave them a date of when I'd be back to finish the exterior work.

Well they are saying that the bank will not cut me my final check for the bath, until I return to the exterior work. I tried to explain these are two separate contracts but they seem to think that since I already have the first draw on the exterior that should cover the balance of the bath. But I already spent that on the exterior errr!!!

Now they are asking for an itemized invoice and I am just exhausted with this HO and don't think I should even give them one. I certainly have nothing to hide and have practically given them a new bath but what do I do??
 
#2 ·
mightyoakllc said:
Hello All!!
I have been pounding away for a few months now and am doing very well. Its hard finding help but luckily I have a few specialty sub's I can lean on here and there.

This will be as short as possible but I want to get be clear about the situation I am in.
I was referred to a customer from a very good source that I wanted to keep on my good side. So this HO needed a complete bathroom remodel gut job. With new marble shower and vanity top. Restore cherry paneling in the bath and the heart pine floors refinished. Sherle Wagner fixtures were retained but had to be rebuilt etc. etc... I submitted a quote for this with 2 draws. They were in a mad rush to get this bath done for accessibilty for a family member. They accepted my bid over several others due to my historic preservation background and reputation. Also there is an exterior contract that was submitted at the same time I was clear that I would knock out the bath ASAP but could not get to the exterior restoration for quite sometime. I didn't include a timeline on the exterior work proposal. Their bank cut me a one check for the first draw of the exterior work and the first draw of the bath.
I knew I should have just handed that back but like I said mad rush!!

So I knocked out the bath and the first 1/3 of the work required on the exterior contract and continued to stress to them I don't have time to complete the exterior work at this time. I submitted an invoice for the final draw on the bath and gave them a date of when I'd be back to finish the exterior work.

Well they are saying that the bank will not cut me my final check for the bath, until I return to the exterior work. I tried to explain these are two separate contracts but they seem to think that since I already have the first draw on the exterior that should cover the balance of the bath. But I already spent that on the exterior errr!!!

Now they are asking for an itemized invoice and I am just exhausted with this HO and don't think I should even give them one. I certainly have nothing to hide and have practically given them a new bath but what do I do??
Click to expand...

Why did you even bother depositing the check for the exterior? Secondly, why did you start it if you knew you wouldn't be able to finish it? Sounds like you don't have a leg to stand on now. You should have sent the exterior draw back.
 
#3 ·
Lemme see.

You have continually informed the homeowner/client that you do not have time to perform the exterior renovation(s). Yet, you have commenced work and are, approximately, at the 1/3 point of your scope of works.

You don't have time, yet you commenced work.

I am having a difficult time grasping your dilemma.

You commenced work on something for which you don't have time.

You accepted the first draw for said scope of work(s). The one for which you do not have time, but were able to start.

They request an itemized invoice.

You don't feel as if you should comply with said request.

Obviously, I am missing something (probably many things).
 
Discussion starter · #4 ·
Yes I agree with you all I should have not accepted the exterior draw but it was on the same check as the bathroom that was needed ASAP and didn't want to slow the process I was already lining up materials etc.. As far as getting started there are 2 distinct phases to the exterior contract. First draw- brick/gutter repair, second draw- woodwork repair/painting then final draw. I know again I shouldn't have started but my mason had an open window so I put him on it and knocked it out while I was renovating the bathroom.

I don't understand why they need an itemized invoice at this point on the bathroom, I gave them a contract that were signed and accepted I just want paid for the bathroom...
 
#6 ·
mightyoakllc said:
............I don't understand why they need an itemized invoice at this point on the bathroom, I gave them a contract that were signed and accepted I just want paid for the bathroom...
Click to expand...
Call their bluff. Ask for the banks' contact person and phone number.
 
#7 · (Edited)
Return the the money for the exterior, Bill them for bath final, then after the bath final check clears, send an unconditional release FOR THE BATHROOM CONTRACT. This let's them know you are knowledgeable about lien laws as well.

Then bill them for what you spent on the exterior (first draw) as a whole other job, with a change order reflecting your new completion date.
 
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#8 · (Edited)
The only thing your invoice has to reflect is the work you performed per your contract, and the draw for that work per your contract.
 
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#10 ·
If the bank combined checks for payment of two separate contracts, they would have delineated it on the stub...

The numbers will not match up...

If the HO gave you the check that included both amounts, something is not right...

There's no reason to ask for an itemized invoice AFTER the project is done... except one... the bank does not need it for any reason...

I agree... call their bluff and get the bank info...
 
#11 ·
KAP said:
......
There's no reason to ask for an itemized invoice AFTER the project is done... Except one... .........
Click to expand...

And that is to start chiseling you down on your price.

"How can this cost that much?"

"I didn't think this would be so expensive!"

"Why is this so high?"

"Seems an awful lot of money when you only had to spend $140 on material..... I know what it costs cause I priced it at Home Depot."

"Gee, I wish I could make $250 an hour!"

"You are really too expensive. I found I could have hired Joe Blow for half of what you charge."

"Was (insert top-grade material here) really necessary? Couldn't you have used (insert low-end cheap crap here) instead?"
 
Discussion starter · #12 ·
Thanks guys I agree, I have requested the banks information by email this morning. I am anticipating the response. Your advice is very valuable as I am new to contracting but not construction. I will probably also just return the exterior deposit for a payment of what I have completed on the exterior and the final draw on the bath.
 
#13 ·
mightyoakllc said:
Thanks guys I agree, I have requested the banks information by email this morning. I am anticipating the response. Your advice is very valuable as I am new to contracting but not construction. I will probably also just return the exterior deposit for a payment of what I have completed on the exterior and the final draw on the bath.
Click to expand...
Not so fast... I wouldn't be so quick to return any money... who issued you the check, the bank or HO? And was it delineated anywhere what it applied to?...
 
Discussion starter · #14 ·
Bank issued it but homeowner handed it over and it was not delineated to anything. They are refusing to give me the bank persons info although I already know who it is. I don't want to step on the HOs toes but I'll do what I have to. And the only way I would turn the money back over would be at the bank with them handing me another check with what's owed. HO said ALL matters with the bank must go through her. And she did cap ALL as well. Errrr!!
 
#15 ·
Call the bank and get the truth. You can be professional and courteous with the bank, without mincing words - they've seen and heard everything. If the homeowner freaks out because you called the bank, too bad - you have a financial relationship with the bank, and you need to hear from them why they aren't paying you.

Edit: Do you have it in writing from the homeowner that the bank has refused to issue the check?
 
#17 ·
mightyoakllc said:
Yes I agree with you all I should have not accepted the exterior draw but it was on the same check as the bathroom that was needed ASAP and didn't want to slow the process I was already lining up materials etc.. As far as getting started there are 2 distinct phases to the exterior contract. First draw- brick/gutter repair, second draw- woodwork repair/painting then final draw. I know again I shouldn't have started but my mason had an open window so I put him on it and knocked it out while I was renovating the bathroom.

I don't understand why they need an itemized invoice at this point on the bathroom, I gave them a contract that were signed and accepted I just want paid for the bathroom...
Click to expand...
I don't see a problem with you taking the first draw on the second contract. Maybe I would have done it the same, maybe not, but at least from what you're saying you didn't deceive the homeowner about the schedule.
 
#18 ·
The itemized invoices and the bank not paying sounds fishy to me. I wonder what kind of loan they have that the bank doesn't require any more documentation than Draw 1 and Draw 2?

In my very limited experience (1 time) in getting paid directly from the bank instead of from the customer, there was a schedule of values, full or partial lien releases were submitted with a draw request and then the title company would send out someone to verify the work was performed before the bank would issue a check.
 
Discussion starter · #19 ·
Yeah this is my first time as well dealing with the bank through the customer. She claims its a home equity loan but when I had an equity loan in the past they paid the entire portion to me and I spent it however I wanted. Who knows, I am calling the bank tomorrow before I itemize anything.
 
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KAP
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