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MOTB

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This came across from an advertisement where now Consumers can Buy & Schedule Service. My instinct is AL is looking to expand on the Consumer spend, as opposed the Contractor spend which many contractors here on the forum tend to question.

Here is just a snapshot of what is part of the landing page, and I encourage contractors to be very careful when the next set of solicitations comes for them to be a part of the new AL program since having a homeowner feel you offer a discount before even finding out what the job is is not the way to build your business. Maybe I am wrong :rolleyes:

How Angie's List is different
Reviews are submitted by verified members, not anonymous visitors.
Buy and Schedule services – including discounts of up to 70% - from member-reviewed companies.

Of course 70% sounds nice to get someone (a consumer) to pay to be placed in contact with a contractor, but lets be reasonable. Without a contractor first marking up his normal cost by 200% to 300%, how can anyone even afford to talk 70%?

Sure, 5% and even maybe 10%, but 70% is one step away from just making all contractors go out of business on the job. I'll bet AL will soon start trying to convince they need to lose money on a few jobs to build their AL reputation - but that is not a way anyone should build a company. You do not have to lose money on any job or you are simply going out of business.

It would be great if someone from AL could join this forum discussion to provide a reasoning why 70% is a good starting point. Makes great sense for a Homeowner and terrible sense for a Contractor (in my opinion). It really makes the contractor feel like their services are more and more negotiable, when in fact, a good contractor (just like a doctor or attorney or other white collar provider) does not need to keep negotiating (and definitely 70% is way out there).

I realize AL now needs a way to get a homeowner to spend money, but why does the contractor have to give up something? Why such a large starting point? If you are a good crafts person and a good business person, think twice before thinking about a discount when you may just want to pass on the work. I have spoken to so many customers who were willing to pay the right price to get the right job done. And I have spoken to many of contractor customers who rather work a few more profitable jobs as opposed to just discounting to get work and not make money. Think about it.

Soon we will see "Our contractors pay you to do the job" :laughing:
 
This company and the way it does buisness make my blood boil, They (angie) have been in buisness 18 years AND NEVER HAS MADE A PROFIT, Yet their whole model is to rate other companys, And now the latest idea is to get sevice providers too discount their services. Yelp gets 25 million visits a month for free, Angie gets less than 5 million. Angie's operating loss went from 44 million to 50 million in one year, yes loss not profit. Customer revenue has dropped from $50 to $25 per member. Now its time for contractors to lose money so Angie can try to make money, but after 18 years of not making money is this the way to make money, by asking the people who can not get on the list, To discount their services up to 70%. Anyone on this forum knows that a 70% discount is not a real number, as a contractor there is no way i can give a 70% discount for any one never mind some one from angies list. But remember you can not get on the list, but angie will sell you a way to get to the top of the list. The numbers are about 70% of all on line reviews are false. Can any one on this forum lose money for 18 years and still be in buisness ?.
 
I'll elaborate on this one as I know what they are doing.

Basically they have companies offer "big deals". These are services, like for instance, myself would offer a roof replacement for $6000.00 without ever seeing the job. Of that $6000.00, Angieslist takes 30 or so percent of that number.

Now the thing is, they'll advertise that $6000 price is 50% off and normally costs $12000.00. They do it with all different types of things and I get the emails for it.

One guy has his as 5 windows replaced for $5500 a 40% savings! Yeah right. They need to go out of business.
 
BamBamm5144 said:
I'll elaborate on this one as I know what they are doing.

Basically they have companies offer "big deals". These are services, like for instance, myself would offer a roof replacement for $6000.00 without ever seeing the job. Of that $6000.00, Angieslist takes 30 or so percent of that number.

Now the thing is, they'll advertise that $6000 price is 50% off and normally costs $12000.00. They do it with all different types of things and I get the emails for it.

One guy has his as 5 windows replaced for $5500 a 40% savings! Yeah right. They need to go out of business.
We are doing it right now. No one has bought our deals but it drives people to your page and makes them more inclined to call you. Any service paid through angies list, they mail us a check within 7 days and they keep 3% so it would be like a customer using a credit card. If done right no one is loosing money on the deal. We have a 50% off deal and what it does is allows our customers to buy a $500 voucher to spend on our services for $250

We also have a 5 window deal out there thats a good base for an upsell.
 
So now they only keep 3%? Last time i did it, it was around 30%. Then I had to deal with all the people who didn't read the fine print and get angies to refund them and what a hassle.

It was because of that I had my listing entirely removed from angieslist. Ironically enough, business has never been better and my customers have been better.
 
BamBamm5144 said:
So now they only keep 3%? Last time i did it, it was around 30%. Then I had to deal with all the people who didn't read the fine print and get angies to refund them and what a hassle.

It was because of that I had my listing entirely removed from angieslist. Ironically enough, business has never been better and my customers have been better.
Bam just so you understand that i am giving you the straight scoop I HATE angies list. I took about a two year hiatus from it cause i was so fed up with their crap. However my area has become really dependent on it and for the time being im gonna have to embrace it to stay competitive. People aren't using the phone book, and people don't even talk to one another no more. They wanna browse the web from their smart phone at 2am and find a roofer or sider.

Ill can keep you posted or you can email me if you want exact stats on it but we went live with it this past monday and have three appointments set for this week as a direct result.
 
So lemme see if I got this straight.

AL has been a money pit for almost a score. Now they're lying to their customers about artificially high prices they're just guessing about.


Wow. Sounds like a losing proposition.
 
480sparky said:
So lemme see if I got this straight.

AL has been a money pit for almost a score. Now they're lying to their customers about artificially high prices they're just guessing about.

Wow. Sounds like a losing proposition.
What are they guessing about? The companies are the one that set up their own deals.
 
Patrick, I'm surprised to hear that many people depend on angieslist. I've said it before but there are nearly two million people in my working area and angieslist has about 20k subscribers. I've gotten many more people saying they saw the google reviews and called because of that.

We sold a few of the "big deals". Since yours is a $250 coupon for $500 worth of work, I can almost guarantee you what those reviews are going to say. I'm sure they'll be along the lines of...

"The big deal was $250 for $500 worth of work. Contractor was only here a few hours and barely even did $250 worth of work. We could've found someone to do more work for less money."

I'm sure you'll have positive ones to but those are the ones I read around here.
 
BamBamm5144 said:
Patrick, I'm surprised to hear that many people depend on angieslist. I've said it before but there are nearly two million people in my working area and angieslist has about 20k subscribers. I've gotten many more people saying they saw the google reviews and called because of that.

We sold a few of the "big deals". Since yours is a $250 coupon for $500 worth of work, I can almost guarantee you what those reviews are going to say. I'm sure they'll be along the lines of...

"The big deal was $250 for $500 worth of work. Contractor was only here a few hours and barely even did $250 worth of work. We could've found someone to do more work for less money."

I'm sure you'll have positive ones to but those are the ones I read around here.
Naw its gonna give them $500 towards a whole job. Very rarely do we do anything under 5k
 
What are they guessing about? The companies are the one that set up their own deals.
How can they say something is 70% BEFORE anyone even looks at the job?

Are they colluding with their contractors to jack their prices up so AL can magically offer 70% off?
 
480sparky said:
How can they say something is 70% BEFORE anyone even looks at the job?

Are they colluding with their contractors to jack their prices up so AL can magically offer 70% off?
Clearly you dont get it. We are basically selling a gift card $500 for $250 hence 50% off. Or we could sell it for $150 and it would be 70% off. If it sells roofs and siding what do i care? Ill give 500-1000 bucks off our list for any full house job signed on the initial visit any day. Angies list or not
 
Patrick, I'm confused how yours works. Well, first I'm really surprised it's only 3% they are taking and not that 30% number I mention. Must be a lot different where you are.

Anyways, you said three people bought the coupon but is only a gift card? What if they decide not to use you even though they bought it? The problem with a service based business is even with your "gift card" you could still be thousands higher.
 
BamBamm5144 said:
Patrick, I'm confused how yours works. Well, first I'm really surprised it's only 3% they are taking and not that 30% number I mention. Must be a lot different where you are.

Anyways, you said three people bought the coupon but is only a gift card? What if they decide not to use you even though they bought it? The problem with a service based business is even with your "gift card" you could still be thousands higher.
No one has bought one yet we got three leads in one week since starting though. The deals increase your rankings making someone more likely to look at your page.

Yes i am going to be thousands higher. If the job is 10 k they are buying a $500 voucher for 250 its not that complicated
 
Clearly you dont get it. We are basically selling a gift card $500 for $250 hence 50% off. Or we could sell it for $150 and it would be 70% off. If it sells roofs and siding what do i care? Ill give 500-1000 bucks off our list for any full house job signed on the initial visit any day. Angies list or not
"We" is who? Your company? You and AL?

When did gift cards get involved? It's hard to have this conversation when everyone keeps tossing out new targets.


Again, it still sounds like contractors and/or AL is colluding to artificially raise 'prices' in order to offer a percent discount. In my book, that's a scam. I will repeat that in case no one saw it.... in my book.

My book. Not yours. Not anyone else's. MY book.
 
Its hard to have a conversation with you who cant comprehend anything. And bam who keeps talking about what he "thinks" angies list is doing
 
Its hard to have a conversation with you who cant comprehend anything. And bam who keeps talking about what he "thinks" angies list is doing
Man, you are the one that needs a reading comprehension class.

Where did I claim I 'think' I know what AL is doing?

Where?

Care to point that out? Seems to me all I did was ASK QUESTIONS.


Or do you prefer to thump your chest and proclaim your self-supposed intellectual superiority?



I'm done here. All you 'know-in-alls' can have it.
 
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