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Do You Have To Abate Asbestos… Entirely?

 
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Old 06-28-2016, 07:54 PM   #1
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Do You Have To Abate Asbestos… Entirely?


Here’s the deal. My largest customer’s son (not in girth) bought a brand-old home. House is a 1500 SF ranch with baseboard heat. The house was built in 1957 and he wants to put in a high velocity A/C system in the attic.

I walked the project today with my HVAC guy and we noticed many of the ceilings had a tile installed. Reminds me of the old, interlocking, asbestos stuff that got glued and stapled to the ceiling. So here comes the question:

If we proceed with the system install and the tile tests positive for asbestos, does it all need to come down? Or, is there an appropriate method to just cut the holes we need (with proper containment – done by a certified firm) and leave the rest of the ceiling intact?
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Old 06-28-2016, 10:09 PM   #2
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Re: Do You Have To Abate Asbestos… Entirely?


It's best to abate.

The general rule is that if you can encapsulate it or leave it alone and don't disturb it, there's no risk.

Based on what you're planning, I don't think that either of the above situations will apply to you because no amount of containment is going to do anything once it's disturbed other than to completely remove it. Sure, you can work in a bunny suit inside of a plastic bag but once the work is complete, a forced air system can still kick up any residue that had not been collected at the time of the remodel.

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Old 06-29-2016, 08:28 AM   #3
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Re: Do You Have To Abate Asbestos… Entirely?


Thanks Ted. I’m just trying to see if there’s a way to keep the project price from quadrupling because of 20 – 2” holes.
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Old 06-29-2016, 08:11 PM   #4
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Re: Do You Have To Abate Asbestos… Entirely?


Just bumping this one time to see if anyone’s got any ideas before I walk away from the project.
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Old 06-29-2016, 08:27 PM   #5
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Re: Do You Have To Abate Asbestos… Entirely?


Never been in that situation, Paul. Common sense would seem to indicate that if you jump through the proper hoops while cutting the holes, you could leave the remaining unfriable material in situ. But that's common sense.

Maybe contact a couple of [good] remediation outfits and see what they say?
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Old 06-29-2016, 10:12 PM   #6
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Re: Do You Have To Abate Asbestos… Entirely?


Get it tested. I can't recall seeing or removing any asbestos containing ceiling tiles.


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Old 06-29-2016, 10:32 PM   #7
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Re: Do You Have To Abate Asbestos… Entirely?


No, it doesn't all have to come down. It doesn't have to be complicated:

http://www.ishn.com/articles/82547-a...rbing-asbestos
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Old 06-30-2016, 04:53 AM   #8
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Re: Do You Have To Abate Asbestos… Entirely?


Quote:
Originally Posted by hdavis View Post
No, it doesn't all have to come down. It doesn't have to be complicated:

http://www.ishn.com/articles/82547-a...rbing-asbestos
Seen that done , only the guy was using adjustable drywall/ceiling tile cutter with the dust cover, he also used shaving cream in it, very effective and dust free. The cover on the cutter is plastic and makes it very easy to clean after you done.

Using a cup is the same concept, the only thing with cutter much easier to work and faster.
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Old 06-30-2016, 06:39 PM   #9
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Re: Do You Have To Abate Asbestos… Entirely?


I talked to my asbestos/lead paint abatement guy this morning and no shaving cream in a cup doesn’t legally cut it. I also called the testing company we use and he said the same thing. BTW, both of them said that the asbestos is probably in the adhesive – not the tile.

Funny thing is, both of them said “WTF, for that little bit - just do it – who the hell will know?”

At this stage in my career, I’m a little litigation apprehensive. My luck, I’d have a disagreement with one of my subs and he suddenly comes down with mesothelioma.

Strange thing from the Colorado Department of Public Health & Environment website:

“If you’re the homeowner, you may remove asbestos from your primary residence without obtaining a permit from us.”

I thought asbestos removal/handling laws were federal? Does that mean I can place a piece of blue tape on the ceiling and tell the kid “I need 2” holes at each tape location – I’ll be back tomorrow – have it done”?
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Old 06-30-2016, 06:56 PM   #10
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Re: Do You Have To Abate Asbestos… Entirely?


Quote:
Originally Posted by DaVinciRemodel View Post

Strange thing from the Colorado Department of Public Health & Environment website:

“If you’re the homeowner, you may remove asbestos from your primary residence without obtaining a permit from us.”

I thought asbestos removal/handling laws were federal? Does that mean I can place a piece of blue tape on the ceiling and tell the kid “I need 2” holes at each tape location – I’ll be back tomorrow – have it done”?
That's how I read it.

I know a couple of lawyers in Colorado if you need one.

One of them just won a major case in Aurora.

Tom
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Old 06-30-2016, 07:02 PM   #11
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Re: Do You Have To Abate Asbestos… Entirely?


I’m leery of the word “us” when it says “without obtaining a permit from us.” Who do I need a permit from?
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Old 06-30-2016, 07:37 PM   #12
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Re: Do You Have To Abate Asbestos… Entirely?


Likely the Colorado Dept of Health. Asbestos abatement contractors are licensed through the state dept health.


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Old 06-30-2016, 08:34 PM   #13
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Re: Do You Have To Abate Asbestos… Entirely?


Quote:
Originally Posted by DaVinciRemodel View Post

I thought asbestos removal/handling laws were federal? Does that mean I can place a piece of blue tape on the ceiling and tell the kid “I need 2” holes at each tape location – I’ll be back tomorrow – have it done”?
Yes, same thing here. I did a job where the homeowner took it all down, when I first looked at the job it was there. When he called me back it was gone and the room was spotless. Everything was double bagged behind the garage. He was waiting for hazardous waste day each county has, people bring all sorts of stuff over no fee no questions.
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Old 06-30-2016, 11:33 PM   #14
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Re: Do You Have To Abate Asbestos… Entirely?


Quote:
Originally Posted by DaVinciRemodel View Post
Strange thing from the Colorado Department of Public Health & Environment website:

“If you’re the homeowner, you may remove asbestos from your primary residence without obtaining a permit from us.”

I thought asbestos removal/handling laws were federal? Does that mean I can place a piece of blue tape on the ceiling and tell the kid “I need 2” holes at each tape location – I’ll be back tomorrow – have it done”?
It's like the lead laws - home owners are exempted. As a HO, there are city landfills that let you dispose of asbestos waste with no traceability. As an abatement firm, you have to use a different asbestos hazardous waste dump with plenty of record keeping.
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Old 07-01-2016, 12:00 AM   #15
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Re: Do You Have To Abate Asbestos… Entirely?


Colorado trigger level is 32 sqft:

https://www.colorado.gov/pacific/sit...Demolition.pdf
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Old 07-01-2016, 08:04 AM   #16
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Re: Do You Have To Abate Asbestos… Entirely?


Quote:
Originally Posted by hdavis View Post
Thanks davis It was mentioned that 36 SF was the trigger and I’ve been searching “36” with no joy. Good find my friend. Now I need to determine if the city of Denver is different in their amended code.

Would you get on that for me
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Old 07-02-2016, 07:54 AM   #17
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Re: Do You Have To Abate Asbestos… Entirely?


Quote:
Originally Posted by DaVinciRemodel View Post
Thanks davis It was mentioned that 36 SF was the trigger and I’ve been searching “36” with no joy. Good find my friend. Now I need to determine if the city of Denver is different in their amended code.

Would you get on that for me
I'm leaving a little something for you.

All I find in the Denver info are references to state code.

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