Instead Of A P-trap ---- - Plumbing - Contractor Talk

Instead Of A P-trap ----

 
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Old 10-08-2006, 09:21 AM   #1
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Instead Of A P-trap ----


I saw these devices on a recent trip to Europe. They call the "Siphon" ... they look much better that p-traps and are much shorter. Are they available (and legal) here?
[IMG]javascript:OpenPopUpZoom('690','540','http://www.otto.de/is-bin/INTERSHOP.enfinity/WFS/Otto-OttoDe-Site/de_DE/-/EUR/OV_DisplayProductInformation-SuperZoomMoreImages;sid=uupfpMJnDcNfpIdOvUKfzK5tU2 J8vTA58n-so2Oi6PX66pB4H6T0yM-_Izfg9w==?ProductID=HkR_AAABEcMAAAENvTFNPPRh&Pictu re='+selectedImage);[/IMG]
Thanks ....
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Old 10-08-2006, 09:28 AM   #2
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Re: Instead Of A P-trap ----


pic ..

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Last edited by Vermonster; 10-08-2006 at 09:30 AM. Reason: image didn't work
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Old 10-08-2006, 09:34 AM   #3
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Re: Instead Of A P-trap ----


Reminds me of the old drum traps that were outlawed here. Here's another pic of one:


http://www.dearbornbrass.com/datafil...s/967GBN-1.pdf

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Old 10-08-2006, 10:06 AM   #4
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Re: Instead Of A P-trap ----


They are not approved under any model code I'm aware of, but I'm somewhat behind the lastest changes.

I can't imagine they would be approved with moving parts. There are specific areas of the code which prohibit water seal traps with moving parts.
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Old 10-08-2006, 04:57 PM   #5
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Re: Instead Of A P-trap ----


Quote:
Originally Posted by mdshunk View Post
Reminds me of the old drum traps that were outlawed here. Here's another pic of one:


http://www.dearbornbrass.com/datafil...s/967GBN-1.pdf

MD are you saying you cant use a trap like that ? We call that a bottle trap and we use them a lot on basins, I cant imagine why they would be outlawed, perhaps you could enlighten me.
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Old 10-08-2006, 04:59 PM   #6
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Re: Instead Of A P-trap ----


Quote:
Originally Posted by Nick H View Post
MD are you saying you cant use a trap like that ? We call that a bottle trap and we use them a lot on basins, I cant imagine why they would be outlawed, perhaps you could enlighten me.
I don't have a clue. I'm just a sparky.
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Old 10-08-2006, 05:02 PM   #7
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Re: Instead Of A P-trap ----


Quote:
Originally Posted by mdshunk View Post
I don't have a clue. I'm just a sparky.
To be honest, I dont really give a s**t, I'm just a chippy !!
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Old 10-08-2006, 05:32 PM   #8
 
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Re: Instead Of A P-trap ----


how does that old drum trap seal sewer gases from the habitation.looks like a trap that might be used to recover something that may have fallen into the drain.
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Old 10-08-2006, 11:31 PM   #9
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Re: Instead Of A P-trap ----


The model codes used in most areas require that water seal traps be self cleaning. The bottle or more correctly the bell trap MD has shown, is not self cleaning and is disallowed under most model codes.

That is another reason I think the 'siphon' in the first drawing won't be adopted in the US, but I've been wrong before and will be again soon, I'm sure.

The photo MD shows is not a drum trap, this is


and this is a P-Trap



A bell or bottle trap
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Old 10-09-2006, 07:02 AM   #10
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Re: Instead Of A P-trap ----


I saw them all over Germany. Given their level of engineering I would imagine that they work and are save. But if I had all the answers I wouldn't have asked the question in the first place ....

Thanks ....
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Old 10-09-2006, 09:20 AM   #11
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Re: Instead Of A P-trap ----


I didn't mean to imply they are not safe. Drum traps were used extensively and still are for some applications.

For some reason, the model codes consider cleaning with an auger or self cleaning more important than style. You can't pass a cable through a bottle or drum trap.

I agree that a bottle trap is much more compact and attractive, but it has to be taken apart to clean it.

The plumbing world in Europe is light years ahead of us in the USA in many ways as far as material uses and especially radiant heating systems and controls.
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Old 10-10-2006, 07:45 AM   #12
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Re: Instead Of A P-trap ----


Drum trap and bottle traps are allowed in Oregon under UPC, but only when authorized for use, I don't see too many here, I guess the place you might see them is in Hosipitals and other commercial Buildings that might have the need for them.

I don't like them or care for them myself, but that just me.
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Old 10-10-2006, 08:21 AM   #13
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Re: Instead Of A P-trap ----


Quote:
Originally Posted by cmwacasey View Post
how does that old drum trap seal sewer gases from the habitation.looks like a trap that might be used to recover something that may have fallen into the drain.
The way the drum trap seals is the inlet is much lower than the outlet. So it must flood over the inlet before reaching the outlet.

The bottle trap does about the same thing, it has a pipe that extends down close to the bottom, then the water must flood until it can spill out the outlet.

They are quite effective at sealing out sewer gases.
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Old 10-10-2006, 11:49 AM   #14
 
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Re: Instead Of A P-trap ----


thanks AA.I was not sure of the interior design of that bottle trap.
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Old 10-10-2006, 02:54 PM   #15
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Re: Instead Of A P-trap ----


Like I said, we use bottle traps a lot and they are simple to clean, you just unscrew the bottom and all the crud drops out, easy.
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Old 10-10-2006, 08:18 PM   #16
 
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Re: Instead Of A P-trap ----


Looks like to me the p-trap has the best and most efficient design.does anyone think differently?are there situations where one of the other designs might be better?
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Old 10-10-2006, 11:10 PM   #17
 
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Re: Instead Of A P-trap ----


interesting stuff, i too would like to know the pros and cons of those.

i can see how the drum trap works, but the bell traps weir is so high how can it trap gasses above the bell?

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