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Old 07-30-2009, 09:31 AM   #41
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Re: Tree Felling Pricing


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Me too, why did you feel the need to arouse my curiosity?

You sure it wasn't just your curiosity that got aroused?
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Old 07-31-2009, 10:54 PM   #42
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Re: Tree Felling Pricing


Not quite sure how my post would have insulted anyone including the OP. I did not question your skill nor your ability to drop a tree. I simply pointed out other people, including Pro's who woke up wondering what they would be doing that coming weekend. I am sure not one of them though their time was up.

However, since offense was taken, let me ask; Are You Insured for dropping trees? If you have insurance for dropping them, not pruning them (its different) then all the more power to you. FYI: I drop trees every year. I am good at it...I don't do it for a living and I don't charge for it. When a neighbor asks me to drop a tree for them, which they have, I do it with them. I don't bill them for it because I am not working, I am helping my friend out...and getting firewood As soon as you charged them, you were operating outside of your realm of expertise as indicated by your insurance and license. FYI: A lot of landscapers around here operate backhoes and mini excavators. None of them have insurance to perform "site work", but the have the equipment to perform it.

And finally, what does having Three Chain Saws have to do with being qualified to drop trees? Try telling that to your insurance agent when you tell them that the tree you were dropping just took someone or something out.

and the best part of this post...I have two tree guys coming over tomorrow to take down three trees. One, because its too close to the house and the other two to make a day of it.
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Old 08-01-2009, 12:52 AM   #43
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Re: Tree Felling Pricing


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When a neighbor asks me to drop a tree for them, which they have, I do it with them. I don't bill them for it because I am not working, I am helping my friend out...and getting firewood As soon as you charged them, you were operating outside of your realm of expertise as indicated by your insurance and license.
Your neighbor is taking an awful risk letting you cut his trees down if you aren't working under your license and insurance. If you get hurt you could hold him responsible. If you fall the tree on his house, he has no recourse. If you pick up a tool to help your neighbor you are technically his employee whether you are paid or not. Damages could be denied by his home owners insurance on that basis.
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Old 08-01-2009, 12:57 AM   #44
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Re: Tree Felling Pricing


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... Are You Insured for dropping trees? ....I drop trees every year. I am good at it...I don't do it for a living and I don't charge for it. When a neighbor asks me to drop a tree for them, which they have, I do it with them. I don't bill them for it because I am not working, I am helping my friend out...and getting firewood As soon as you charged them, you were operating outside of your realm of expertise as indicated by your insurance and license...

So what would happen if a tree you were dropping, on your neighbor's property took something or someone out? Not charging does not erase liability. And if you are "not working" is your commercial insurance going to cover you? But if you're getting "free" firewood, you are being compensated. Not trying to offend, but how is that any different from the CL guys doing the same thing?
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Old 08-01-2009, 06:38 AM   #45
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Re: Tree Felling Pricing


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Not quite sure how my post would have insulted anyone including the OP.
I admit that your points are valid. My point was just that in general the guys around here are much more aware of the realities involved than your average 9-5 office worker.

I confess to a certain amount of intolerance for the constant well-intentioned lectures that pop up here on a daily basis, insisting that "We're all gonna die!" unless we're licensed and insured up the wazoo for every single skillset remotely involved in whatever happens to be today's project. In practical terms that's just impossible.

A reasonably intelligent and sensible man has the capability of performing just about any task any other reasonably intelligent and sensible person can. It is up to him, and no one else to decide whether he has the life experience for a given endeavor or not.

If not, he will let someone else do it. If he decides to try it anyway and succeeds, he will have broadened his horizons. If he fails, he will have done his part to improve the gene pool.

I apologize for jumping on your post specifically; it just happened to get past the guard on one of my hot buttons.
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Old 08-01-2009, 08:20 AM   #46
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Re: Tree Felling Pricing


Exactly. If you ever need a kidney taken out, just give me a call. I've skinned a few rabbits in my life. There can't be much difference.
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Old 08-01-2009, 08:24 AM   #47
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Re: Tree Felling Pricing


Just to let everyone know:

The tree is down. It has been cut up, and has been placed next to the alley. The HO has a relative that is going to take it for his fireplace. As for the small stuff, the HO is tackling the task of cutting it up and placing it on the curb as yard waste.

I managed to cut the tree down with a chain saw. Not solely based on the need for money. I own three chain saws, and know how to use them. Not run them or start them or pull the trigger. I know how to use them.

The tree wasn't some 100' sycamore. It was about 35'. Getting it to drop was not an issue..... it was leaning at about a 30 angle against another tree and the HO was worried about it coming down the rest of the way while some poor slob was trespassing in her back yard.

The planets are still in their orbits. The sun still came up in the eastern sky this morning. I still draw breath on this world, on this plane, in this existence. My family still loves me, I still have the best next-door-neighbors one could hope for, and my cat still wants fed every day. I continue to receive bills in the mail, the phone still rings, and I have $12.57 in cash in my pocket this morning. My truck will still start, I can still drive on public roads to go to the bank, and I plan on having some Iowa Peaches and Cream sweet corn for supper tonight.

As I stated in my OP, I am an electrician. To all you doomsayers who claim I should not be cutting down trees for whatever paranoid reason, the universe still exists. If I were to limit myself to pulling romex and bending conduit, pray what else should I do in my life?

Shall I stop changing the oil in my trucks because I am not a professional mechanic? God forbid I should pull out of my driveway and crunch a parked car with my bumper. Let some lawyer loose on that one... I'm a goner for sure!

Last week, I had my neighbors (yea, the nice ones) over for a bar-b-que. Chicken, steak, ham on the grill. Salads, chips, sun tea. Topped off with home-made ice cream. I didn't poison them. No one spent the night whistling carrots. No one felt the need to call 911. They still speak to me. All this despite the fact I am not a professional chef.

I am, at this very moment, pushing buttons on a thing called keyboard, which is wired to a contraption called a computer, which in turn is hooked to a system called The Internet. I may mistype a letter, or misspell a word, even compose a sentence that does not make sense. Yet no one dies simply because I am not a professional computer programmer.

Shall I discontinue mowing my own lawn because I am not a professional, trained and insured landscaper? Shall I sell my vacuum cleaner because I am not a professional, trained and insured house cleaner? Heaven forbid should I attempt to replace that asphalt shingle last week's storm ripped off my roof as I am not a professional, trained and insured roofer.

Just yesterday, my neighbors' 11-year old granddaughter knocked on my door. Seems the kickstand on her bicycle was loose, and she was inquiring as to whether I could fix it. I opened my van, pullout out a 3/8" allen wrench and tightened a bolt. My God, what have I done to that child? Will she spend the rest of her life in a vegatative coma? Will she live to have her father walk her down the aisle? This precocious child has expressed an interest in the medical profession, yet have I unwittingly destroyed mankinds means for a cure for cancer?

As I watched Haley (that's her name) merrily ride off, I noticed my neighbors garden flag was on the ground. I picked it up, and found the end of the pole was broken off. I reached in my van, pulled out my cordless sawzall, and put a nice, even square cut on it. I used my cordless drill to remove the portion of the pole out of the bracket attached to their deck.

This simple act of kindness, I am now convinced, spells the end of the cosmos as we know it. I have angered my Creator to the point He will divide by zero, and beset a super-massive black hole upon the universe. Everything that ever was, everything that is, and everything that ever will be shall be sucked up into Nothingness, just like the Freeling's home at the end of Poltergeist.








All this because of $600. Had I only known.........
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Old 08-01-2009, 12:29 PM   #48
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Re: Tree Felling Pricing


wowzer! you should be a handyman! oh wait..they arent union.
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Old 08-01-2009, 12:33 PM   #49
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Re: Tree Felling Pricing


All I got out of that was that you taught your granddaughter it's ok to hire an unlicensed hack to do repairs. And that you may need a license to use the internet.
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Old 08-01-2009, 05:04 PM   #50
 
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Re: Tree Felling Pricing


To the DIYChatroom for you Sparky!!!! How Dare You tighten the bolt on that bike and not be a licensed and insured Bike Shop Owner!!!!

BE GONE!!!!!



I have to agree though, sometimes while reading these forums it gets a bit ridiculous with the HOLY **** YOUR NOT LICENSED OR INSURED FOR THAT!

Not saying sometimes its not warranted but.....lets all take a step back and remember that leaky faucet we fixed, or the, "shingle the last storm blew off we replaced" This is the real world....helping ourselves and relatives/friends is ok, and in fact encouraged where I come from.
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Old 08-01-2009, 08:19 PM   #51
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Re: Tree Felling Pricing


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.........helping ourselves and relatives/friends is ok, and in fact encouraged where I come from.
It's expected on my side of the crick.
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Old 08-02-2009, 07:05 AM   #52
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I'm glad everything worked out for you, and I fully expect as much shyt from everyone here, when I ask for advice, when wiring my shop building later this year.
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Old 08-02-2009, 08:22 AM   #53
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Re: Tree Felling Pricing


This has actually gotten funny

Glad everything worked out for you 480. I think the moral of the story is do what you feel comfortble doing. I may change an outlet a couple of times a year in a customer's or a friends house. I told my insurance company I wouldn't and I don't. Felling trees however was never discussed I do feel comfortable dropping a tree here and there. Grew up in a house in Pennsylvania where the sole source of heat was wood....somewhere along the line I actully learned how to spin them to get them to fall other than the way they are leaning....however I do know my limits and asked the tree service to drop a couple of 150 year old maples in front of the church last week
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Old 08-02-2009, 11:14 AM   #54
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Re: Tree Felling Pricing


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Tree felling pricing

OK, I'll admit it..... I'm just a dumb electrician. But I'm cutting down a tree for a good friend only because things are slow and I have a chainsaw.

I'm at a loss as to what to charge.

Tree is two minor trunks about 12" diameter each, which had split off from the rest of the tree and were leaning at a 30 angle on another tree. All this person wants is to bring it on down so it doesn't fall on someone, cut it up and place it all by the alley for anyone who wants firewood.

No overhead utilities or structures to worry about. Just curious as to what a fair price would be.
Charge him the same amount as you charged to fix the bike. You are equally capable and legally certified and insured to perform both tasks. The question wasn't should you help blah blah blah. The question was what should you charge.

When I do electrical work I usually inform "my good friends" that I'm not licensed to do electrical work other than a few minor tasks and that major electrical work wouldn't be covered by my bond or liability insurance policy.

I realise that once the tree is removed without incident that it isn't going to fall on some one at a later date because you felled it the wrong way and that you are PROBABLY capable of felling a tree without incident. That's not the point of the whole licensing, insurance, bonding issue. In todays world, you can NOT perform any task safely without PROOF of financial responsibility.

The point of licensing, bond and insurance (as you well know) is having the proper documentation proving to your "good friend" that should you cause damage or injury to yourself or others that they have some type of recourse to recover damage costs and protection of his assets should you harm yourself in some way that your "good friend" may be determined to be responsible.

You know all this. Anyone in business knows how to determine the costs of a project and add a percentage for profit. I have to wonder why you even asked the question.

To make your own thread into an arguement with an electrician about helping a little girl with her bicycle or helping a poor old woman cross the street or whether the planets are aligned properly is clearly an attempt to deflect.

It wasn't some dumb loggers that lobbied your states legislature to gain advantage politically in the business sector. It was/is the IBEW (and the insurance industry and the plumbers unions and the banking industry etc. etc.)

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Old 08-02-2009, 04:17 PM   #55
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Re: Tree Felling Pricing


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.............To make your own thread into an arguement with an electrician about helping a little girl with her bicycle or helping a poor old woman cross the street or whether the planets are aligned properly is clearly an attempt to deflect.

It wasn't some dumb loggers that lobbied your states legislature to gain advantage politically in the business sector. It was/is the IBEW (and the insurance industry and the plumbers unions and the banking industry etc. etc.)
What is it you are even talking about?

Deflect what? Am I on the Enterprise and have stumbled across a whole passel of Romulan Warbirds suddenly decloaking?

The question was about pricing. Should I have charged $600 to fix the bike instead?
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Old 08-02-2009, 04:30 PM   #56
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oh sorry I thought you posted all this crap about people giveing you a hard time for not being licensed or insured for the job. Maybe I misunderstood the post. If it made no sense ignore it.
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Old 08-02-2009, 04:45 PM   #57
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oh sorry I thought you posted all this crap about people giveing you a hard time for not being licensed or insured for the job. Maybe I misunderstood the post. If it made no sense ignore it.
I was asking about the 'clearly an attempt to deflect' portion. If it was so clear, I sure couldn't see it.

I still don't know how you went from loggers to the legislature to the IBEW in so few words.
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Old 08-02-2009, 05:28 PM   #58
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Re: Tree Felling Pricing


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As I stated in my OP, I am an electrician. To all you doomsayers who claim I should not be cutting down trees for whatever paranoid reason, the universe still exists. If I were to limit myself to pulling romex and bending conduit, pray what else should I do in my life?

Shall I stop changing the oil in my trucks because I am not a professional mechanic? God forbid I should pull out of my driveway and crunch a parked car with my bumper. Let some lawyer loose on that one... I'm a goner for sure!
So..we don't need a license or insurance to participate in business, in your opinion? It's deflection to assert that you can't do anything else with your life...nobody suggested that. What people were saying is that you are doing business...charging people to do work for them without proper licensing and insurance. That's hilarious coming from an electrician. But sadly..typical.
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Old 08-02-2009, 05:30 PM   #59
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So..we don't need a license or insurance to participate in business, in your opinion? It's deflection to assert that you can't do anything else with your life...nobody suggested that. What people were saying is that you are doing business...charging people to do work for them without proper licensing and insurance. That's hilarious coming from an electrician. But sadly..typical.
Hate to burst your bubble, but no license is needed to cut down a tree. So if none is required, where, pray tell, would you suggest I obtain one?
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Old 08-02-2009, 05:54 PM   #60
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Apparently your state is quite lenient on commerce of the nature you described. A bond isnt required if your job is less than 5000 dollars. If you earn less than 2000 dollars per year in this type of work you don't even have to register as a contractor. As far as a license not even being available they loosely lump this type of work under "construction contracting" along with (I assume) land scaping etc. KUDOS to your state!

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