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Topsoil Delivery And Emplacement Rate

 
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Old 05-10-2019, 10:04 PM   #1
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Topsoil Delivery And Emplacement Rate


Just curious how guys figure their rate on delivery and emplacement of topsoil.
I just did a job today and when I was done I felt like I had charged too much.

I delivered 25 miles and threw 2 yards of dirt around the house on one side and corner for drainage correction.

Charged $600 4 hours start to finish materials included.
Topsoil was 33 per yard...

Reasonable?
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Old 05-10-2019, 10:11 PM   #2
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Re: Topsoil Delivery And Emplacement Rate


You got the job so apparently you didnít charge too much

Its what the market will bear

Stop trying to save your customers money


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Old 05-10-2019, 10:12 PM   #3
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Re: Topsoil Delivery And Emplacement Rate


Sounds fair to me.

You deserve top dollar just for using the word emplacement.
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Old 05-10-2019, 10:13 PM   #4
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Re: Topsoil Delivery And Emplacement Rate


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Originally Posted by Windycity View Post
You got the job so apparently you didnít charge too much

Its what the market will bear

Stop trying to save your customers money


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Good point.

Still having a hard time figuring it though.
I just wung it and came out ahead.
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Old 05-10-2019, 10:17 PM   #5
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Re: Topsoil Delivery And Emplacement Rate


I can look at a tree no matter how big or small, its surroundings, liabilities, and tell exactly how much any pro will be in my area; as well as exactly how much I will make. That took me years.

This dirt stuff is gonna take a while.
Thats ok though, I got a while.
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Old 05-10-2019, 11:06 PM   #6
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Re: Topsoil Delivery And Emplacement Rate


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Originally Posted by MarkJames View Post
Sounds fair to me.

You deserve top dollar just for using the word emplacement.


I agree with mark

The Last guy that i sat down with that talked like that charged me $225 an hour


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Old 05-10-2019, 11:50 PM   #7
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Re: Topsoil Delivery And Emplacement Rate


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Originally Posted by Windycity View Post
I agree with mark

The Last guy that i sat down with that talked like that charged me $225 an hour


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Lmao!
Its more of an exoneration of guilt of whatever happens to the soil once I leave.

I am not finish grading, silt fencing, or guaranteeing anything other than putting the soil where they ask in loose form. I also make them sign a waiver that I will not be held liable for any damage caused to or by their soil, whether on their property or washed onto another property. The undersigned acknowledges the job is complete to their satisfaction and accepts the responsibility of the soil as is.

Last thing I need is a monsoon rain washing it away and the DNR, city, or homeowners (or all three) up my butt.

The city lake is brown now!
You plugged our storm drain!
WE PAID YOU TO LEVEL OUR LAWN! DOES IT LOOK LEVEL?

Too new at this to devote that kind of liability.
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Old 05-11-2019, 06:12 AM   #8
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Re: Topsoil Delivery And Emplacement Rate


Not too new to see it coming though.
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Old 05-11-2019, 09:57 AM   #9
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Re: Topsoil Delivery And Emplacement Rate


Quote:
Originally Posted by Capitalist View Post
Just curious how guys figure their rate on delivery and emplacement of topsoil.
I just did a job today and when I was done I felt like I had charged too much.

I delivered 25 miles and threw 2 yards of dirt around the house on one side and corner for drainage correction.

Charged $600 4 hours start to finish materials included.
Topsoil was 33 per yard...

Reasonable?
When you base your charges off of guesstimates, instead of charging what YOU need to charge to be in business, you'll always find yourself second guessing whether or not you charged too little...

As an example, in this case, you say you "came out ahead", how did you determine that?
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Old 05-11-2019, 10:30 AM   #10
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Re: Topsoil Delivery And Emplacement Rate


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When you base your charges off of guesstimates, instead of charging what YOU need to charge to be in business, you'll always find yourself second guessing whether or not you charged too little...



As an example, in this case, you say you "came out ahead", how did you determine that?
250 in tools 200 in cash tiny job.

There is such a thing as overcharging.
If you accidentally charhe a dumb person too much and a qualified pro tells them they would have done it for half then you may wind up with both of them blasting you behind your back.

I try to determine reasonable rates. Not cheap but not ridiculous. I also am not trying to stay in business I am trying to grow and make money. I can't be the best at everything though so if I am cheaper than a veteran thats fine because I wont produce their quality of work.

I also have no interest in cutting throats underbidding.


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Old 05-11-2019, 07:03 PM   #11
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Re: Topsoil Delivery And Emplacement Rate


Charge $350
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Old 05-11-2019, 08:45 PM   #12
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Re: Topsoil Delivery And Emplacement Rate


Quote:
Originally Posted by Capitalist View Post
250 in tools 200 in cash tiny job.

There is such a thing as overcharging.
If you accidentally charhe a dumb person too much and a qualified pro tells them they would have done it for half then you may wind up with both of them blasting you behind your back.




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You arenít a qualified pro?
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Old 05-11-2019, 09:09 PM   #13
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Re: Topsoil Delivery And Emplacement Rate


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Charge $350


Depends on what part of the country you are in....

Around here it tree fiddy


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Old 05-11-2019, 10:57 PM   #14
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Re: Topsoil Delivery And Emplacement Rate


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You arenít a qualified pro?
I am qualified to do everything I offer.
I am not a professional dirt worker
I make my living off trees.
There are plenty out there that know more than me and I don't misinform people about exactly what I am. I have never let on to any customer that I know more that I do.

I have done a lot of dirt work on commercial water lines through yards.
Sod, silt control, finish grade and leveling.

A guy that has been in business for 20 years with great rating specializing in topsoil would tear me apart if he said I overcharged.

I just want to be fair and build a good reputation with the services I offer.
Word of mouth goes far.

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Old 05-11-2019, 11:37 PM   #15
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Re: Topsoil Delivery And Emplacement Rate


Quote:
Originally Posted by Capitalist View Post
250 in tools 200 in cash tiny job.

There is such a thing as overcharging.
If you accidentally charhe a dumb person too much and a qualified pro tells them they would have done it for half then you may wind up with both of them blasting you behind your back.

I try to determine reasonable rates. Not cheap but not ridiculous. I also am not trying to stay in business I am trying to grow and make money. I can't be the best at everything though so if I am cheaper than a veteran thats fine because I wont produce their quality of work.

I also have no interest in cutting throats underbidding.


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Each job consists of Labor, Overhead, Material and Profit (that you pay your Company not yourself - labor should he calculated in Labor or Overhead)... only two of those contain potential for "over" or "under-charging"... Labor and Profit... Labor if you don't accurately calculate the amount of time it will take to do the work, and therefore Profit, which is usually calculated on top of Labor, Overhead and Materials.

Materials and Overhead(s) are constants whose requirements define themself...

From what you've posted you generated $600 in gross revenue for four hours of work. You ddn't mention if this was the only work you had for the day or if it impeded your ability to actually do more work that day. Well, that second half of the day STILL has Labor, Overhead and Profit that needs to be covered.

Once you've calculated what that $600 represents to those needs, can you determine if you "over" or "under-charged" someone. Add to it, as you said, you're building a business, and therefore, the generation of Capital Reserves and Emergency Fund (3-6 months worth each), along with an Equipment Fund, are essential to long-term planning so build a solid foundation. This assumes you've already added personal expenses like Retirement, Benefits for you and your family (and employees, if any), taxes, insurance, etc. to your Labor and/or Overhead numbers.

If you're hitting all that on $600 for 1/2 days work, and you've got work to cover the rest of the days capital needs, you're golden...

If you're hitting it with those numbers and have excess Profit, then you can make the case that you're "over-charging"... but you need to charge what YOU need to charge to be in business... only you know what that is, and if you don't know if $600 is "over" or "under-charging", for a 12-days work, you might want to get to know your numbers a little more intimately...

Think of it this way... you've stated you've taken a lot of time and energy to get to know your bloodwork numbers to the point where you can challenge and endocrinologist, and how important it is to your body and how it's needs are different from body-builder to body-builder. Commendable... Knowing your numbers and what YOU need to charge to be in business is the life-blood of your business...

We have no idea your income goals, if you have employees, your Overhead and Profit needs, so there's no way for someone on the outside to determine if $600 for 1/2-days work suits your needs the same way someone on the outside can't determine your meds/supplement needs for your bloodwork... we can show you what to look for, but you have to do the work...


If you need to make a $1000/day for example to cover your businesses needs, and the $600 for 1/2-day was all you were able to realistically do because of the logistics in taking on the job, you're now $400 short of your businesses revenue needs for the day and you've found that you've gone from "over-charging" to actually "under-charging". That HAS to be made up somewhere... otherwise it can rapidly compound against you... the person who hired you paid it, and it's IRRELEVANT what someone else would need to charge. They may be happy making $40k/year while you've determined that you need to personally make $80K/year. That ONE metric alone makes it IMPOSSIBLE for the two of you to not only compete at the same price level, but determine who's over or under-charging. Now you also know why illegal labor, illegitimate business and hacks hurt those in our industry who operate above board.

Your job is to find people that you can charge to meet your businesses needs. That's YOUR customer... everyone is NOT our customer, so get out of the mindset of whether or not you're "Over-charging" someone and focus on do your numbers of what YOU need to make match with what the prospect needs. If so, you've got a match and a customer.

One of the things that is EXTREMELY helpful in zeroing in and defining all this is developing a price-list for your products/services... it will rapidly show you what YOU need each to achieve, no matter if it's an hours, 1/2-day or full-day.

Good luck... 8^)

Last edited by KAP; 05-11-2019 at 11:54 PM.
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Old 05-11-2019, 11:50 PM   #16
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Re: Topsoil Delivery And Emplacement Rate


Quote:
Originally Posted by KAP View Post
Each job consists of Labor, Overhead, Material and Profit (that you pay your Company not yourself - labor should he calculated in Labor or Overhead)... only two of those contain potential for "over" or "under-charging"... Labor and Profit... Labor if you don't accurately calculate the amount of time it will take to do the work, and therefore Profit, which is usually calculated on top of Labor, Overhead and Materials.

Materials and Overhead(s) are constants...

From what you've posted you generated $600 in gross revenue for four hours of work. You ddn't mention if this was the only work you had for the day or if it impeded your ability to actually do more work that day. Well, that second half of the day STILL has Labor, Overhead and Profit that needs to be covered.

Once you've calculated what that $600 represents to those needs, can you determine if you "over" or "under-charged" someone. Add to it, as you said, you're building a business, and therefore, the generation of Capital Reserves and Emergency Fund (3-6 months worth each), along with an Equipment Fund, are essential to long-term planning so build a solid foundation. This assumes you've already added personal expenses like Retirement, Benefits for you and your family (and employees, if any), taxes, insurance, etc. to your Labor and/or Overhead numbers.

If you're hitting all that on $600 for 1/2 days work, you're golden...

If you're hitting it with those numbers and have excess Profit, then you can make the case that you're "over-charging"... but you need to charge what YOU need to charge to be in business... only you know what that is, and if you don't know if $600 is "over" or "under-charging", for a 12-days work, you might want to get to know your numbers a little more intimately...

Think of it this way... you've stated you've taken a lot of time and energy to get to know your bloodwork numbers to the point where you can challenge and endocrinologist, and how important it is to your body and how it's needs are different from body-builder to body-builder. Commendable... Knowing your numbers and what YOU need to charge to be in business is the life-blood of your business...

We have no idea your income goals, if you have employees, your Overhead and Profit needs, so there's no way for someone on the outside to determine if $600 for 1/2-days work suits your needs the same way someone on the outside can't determine your meds/supplement needs for your bloodwork... we can show you what to look for, but you have to do the work...

One of the things that is EXTREMELY helpful in zeroing in and defining all this is a price-list... it will rapidly show you what YOU need each to achieve, no matter if it's an hours, 1/2-day or full-day.

Good luck... 8^)
Great post!
Thats very well put!

I have kind of narrowed the delivery to $100
Per hour and have a basic pricelist.
I won't lose money.
I still am just very new to it all and trying to be competitive.

Everything you said was 100% correct though. A few more jobs and I will have the kinks ironed out. I actually know a rich farmer that got his start in lawn leveling and topsoil I may talk to a bit.

I adapt well.


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Old 05-11-2019, 11:53 PM   #17
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Re: Topsoil Delivery And Emplacement Rate


Quote:
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Great post!
Thats very well put!

I have kind of narrowed the delivery to $100
Per hour and have a basic pricelist.
I won't lose money.
I still am just very new to it all and trying to be competitive.

Everything you said was 100% correct though. A few more jobs and I will have the kinks ironed out. I actually know a rich farmer that got his start in lawn leveling and topsoil I may talk to a bit.

I adapt well.


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Sounds like it... re-read it though because I added to it to provide some clarification on some things while you were posting apparently... oops...
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Old 05-12-2019, 12:28 AM   #18
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Re: Topsoil Delivery And Emplacement Rate


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Sounds like it... re-read it though because I added to it to provide some clarification on some things while you were posting apparently... oops...
Still 100% right.
I have fought all the crap wannabes and illegals in the tree industry coming up.
They have damn near booted me out of Kansas City. They are the primary reason I advertise the way I do. I bid a tree a while back at $2500 removed and I was being very conservative. Some crack head bid it for $800.

When the homeowner told me I turned red and laughed satanically. I said I won't lower my price and I will no longer serve this city (it was a small town).

To my suprise the homeowner stopped me leaving and went with my bid after I told him that guy was an idiot and couldn't dream of completing the job.

I no longer serve that area though unless it is a repeat customer. I wish I had walked away and let that idiot attempt it.

I don't ever want to rob a contractor like that. Its the same as the illegals happy to make $100 a day breaking their back and screwing others out of business.
Poor people make poor ways and I want no part of that perpetual descent into poverty. Failing business screws successful business until it goes out of business.

I would much rather overcharge than be even a little low.

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Old 05-12-2019, 12:34 AM   #19
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I like the reinforcing thoughts I am getting here.

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Old 05-12-2019, 12:35 AM   #20
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Re: Topsoil Delivery And Emplacement Rate


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A guy that has been in business for 20 years with great rating specializing in topsoil would tear me apart if he said I overcharged.

I.

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I could give two *****s about a what someone else says about my pricing, whether they have been in business 5 min or 50 years. I charge what I need to stay in business and live how I want to.

It is easy to say I could have done it for less when the job is done, you found the customer, they agreed to the price, you did the work you agreed to do and were paid what they agreed to pay you, find the next one

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