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So Cal, The WRONG Way Or The RIGHT WAY

 
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Old 04-21-2017, 08:37 AM   #1
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So Cal, The WRONG Way Or The RIGHT WAY


I'm a HVAC installer and I work in the Southern California area. No one in California properly installs ductwork as in they run over 30 feet of flex duct from a square plenum directly off the furnace to the boot.

The correct way to install ductwork is have a trunk line in either the extended plenum or extended plenum reducing method and have your branch ducts with no more than 6 feet of flex going to your boots.

I am tired of every single company doing it the wrong way

Companies want to be all high tech but when they do not compensate static pressure with their 30 feet of flex duct runs with a unit and cannot properly install ductwork

I think they first need to install HVAC equipment properly before they start getting all high tech

My question is I just started at a new company and I am a master sheet metal fabricator and instead of metal ductwork I want to use duct board to fabricate trunk lines

Do I show my employer how to properly install ductwork or do I continue to do the ridiculous 30 foot flex duct runs

I am 26 years old and have five years in the trade, I am a lead installer commercial and residential .My employer allows me to design and install all systems to my liking as in he lets me do my job and stays out of my way.

However I have not yet done a trunk duct run because I am not sure how to go about it

Do I just do it and explain to him why or what do I do guys help me out.

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Old 04-21-2017, 09:16 AM   #2
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Re: So Cal, The WRONG Way Or The RIGHT WAY


what's the man hours & material cost difference?

If your boss has to competitively bid work it may not be in the cards.

The other issue that may come up, at least on commercial, is that your method may deviate from the plan.

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Old 04-21-2017, 09:44 AM   #3
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Re: So Cal, The WRONG Way Or The RIGHT WAY


It's MUCH cheaper and faster to do any of the trunk line methods rather than flex. Commercial is done properly, with metal spiral or square duct. This issue is with residential. And my method being any of the trunk line methods work in every given scenario, if you didn't know how to build transitions or elbows etc then you would have a tough time. However my question is how do I go about it because the way they do it is completely wrong

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Old 04-21-2017, 09:56 AM   #4
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Re: So Cal, The WRONG Way Or The RIGHT WAY


Remember that any way that the ducts are run the system must have no more than 5% leakage per the 2016 energy code.
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Old 04-21-2017, 10:13 AM   #5
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Re: So Cal, The WRONG Way Or The RIGHT WAY


Ya there is no leakage in either method, however the flex duct ran straight from a box plenum off a Air Handler has up to 4x velocity and air flow loss and a insane amount of restrictions if the flex is ran over 6ft compared to other way more efficient methods

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Old 04-21-2017, 10:15 AM   #6
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Re: So Cal, The WRONG Way Or The RIGHT WAY


My question still remains, how do I go about doing it the correct way? Just do it and show the results and data after? Or show him why first? Like I said I am a lead Installer and every Job I design and install myself, but on duct only jobs I have not done the trunk method yet due to the fact of why I need help with my question

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Old 04-21-2017, 04:59 PM   #7
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Re: So Cal, The WRONG Way Or The RIGHT WAY


Talk to your employer about it and see what they say..............
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Old 04-21-2017, 05:04 PM   #8
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Re: So Cal, The WRONG Way Or The RIGHT WAY


I'm not a HVAC guy, but I am a boss. If you came to me and showed me a method that was better AND cheaper I would be ecstatic.

Talk to your boss, what's the worst that could happen?
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Old 04-21-2017, 05:58 PM   #9
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Re: So Cal, The WRONG Way Or The RIGHT WAY


I'm not in the HVAC trade, but I see this often in crawlspaces and think to myself, are people really this [email protected] incompetent or they just don't give a [email protected] Really ticks me off to see.
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Old 04-21-2017, 06:28 PM   #10
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Re: So Cal, The WRONG Way Or The RIGHT WAY


Definitely show your boss it's faster, cheaper, and gives better air flow, so better cooling / heating and less electricity use.
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Old 04-21-2017, 07:42 PM   #11
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Re: So Cal, The WRONG Way Or The RIGHT WAY


It's not what you say, but how it's said.
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Old 04-21-2017, 08:55 PM   #12
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Re: So Cal, The WRONG Way Or The RIGHT WAY


Can you meet the insulation requirements with it?
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Old 04-22-2017, 03:27 AM   #13
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Re: So Cal, The WRONG Way Or The RIGHT WAY


Rectangular trunk line is not cheaper than a flex duct system. Flex systems are done because they are cheaper.

Nothing wrong with flex duct systems, if they are sized and installed properly. But most use a duculator for sheet metal to size flex duct, which is an incorrect thing to do.

Talk to your boss. But if you haven't done a trunk line system yet. You may be in for a surprise when you talk to him.

PS: Don't confuse flexible duct connector regs with flex duct, they are not the same.
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Old 04-22-2017, 11:22 AM   #14
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Re: So Cal, The WRONG Way Or The RIGHT WAY


Quote:
Originally Posted by HVACProJoe View Post
I'm a HVAC installer and I work in the Southern California area. No one in California properly installs ductwork as in they run over 30 feet of flex duct from a square plenum directly off the furnace to the boot.

The correct way to install ductwork is have a trunk line in either the extended plenum or extended plenum reducing method and have your branch ducts with no more than 6 feet of flex going to your boots.

I am tired of every single company doing it the wrong way

Companies want to be all high tech but when they do not compensate static pressure with their 30 feet of flex duct runs with a unit and cannot properly install ductwork

I think they first need to install HVAC equipment properly before they start getting all high tech

My question is I just started at a new company and I am a master sheet metal fabricator and instead of metal ductwork I want to use duct board to fabricate trunk lines

Do I show my employer how to properly install ductwork or do I continue to do the ridiculous 30 foot flex duct runs

I am 26 years old and have five years in the trade, I am a lead installer commercial and residential .My employer allows me to design and install all systems to my liking as in he lets me do my job and stays out of my way.

However I have not yet done a trunk duct run because I am not sure how to go about it

Do I just do it and explain to him why or what do I do guys help me out.

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I suspect he just wants it done, in a manner that does not draw his attention. If your way cost significantly more, in materials or labor, it's likely going to be a problem. Especially if the boss hasn't heard complaints about the other method.

If your way is less expensive, and it works great, why would (s)he complain?
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Old 04-22-2017, 05:14 PM   #15
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Re: So Cal, The WRONG Way Or The RIGHT WAY


Thinking on it it's hard to think of a more economical, not better, but economical way to run a duct than those giant slinky type pre insulated ducts the HVAC guys fill up the attics with.
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Old 04-24-2017, 08:08 AM   #16
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Re: So Cal, The WRONG Way Or The RIGHT WAY


Flex duct is fine, just need to pull it tight, and strap it consistently. labor cost would get quite high if we were to run it in matal, mastic all joints, and then insulate. Especially in most crawlspaces.

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