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New Building With Commercial Smoke Alarm System

 
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Old 05-08-2019, 09:44 PM   #1
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New Building With Commercial Smoke Alarm System


I am building a new building that they labeled "Multi-Use" because it has a living space upstairs. Downstairs is mostly garage space that has a small office area in the front. With the "Multi-Use" they let me take out a homeowners permit for the electrical.
The building will have a full fire sprinkler system. What size and type of wire is required for an alarm system that will have six smoke detectors ? I have talked with different fire monitoring companies and got different answers, some say two some say four. I just want to have enough wire for any possible use in the future. Thanks
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Old 05-08-2019, 09:56 PM   #2
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Re: New Building With Commercial Smoke Alarm System


Fire Alarm Cable 14, 16 or 18 gauge ?

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Old 05-08-2019, 10:23 PM   #3
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Re: New Building With Commercial Smoke Alarm System


Two or four what? Conductors? Wire Gauge?

Is this part of an alarm system, or just the six inter-connected smoke detectors?

Are you doing combo smoke/CO detectors?
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Old 05-08-2019, 10:34 PM   #4
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Re: New Building With Commercial Smoke Alarm System


Quote:
Originally Posted by Seven-Delta-FortyOne View Post
Two or four what? Conductors? Wire Gauge?

Is this part of an alarm system, or just the six inter-connected smoke detectors?

Are you doing combo smoke/CO detectors?
Yes, it will be part of an alarm system. and Yes 2 or 4 conductors and wire gauge ?
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Old 05-09-2019, 07:00 AM   #5
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Re: New Building With Commercial Smoke Alarm System


The detection side is usually 16, the notification side is usually 12.
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Old 09-20-2019, 05:58 PM   #6
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Re: New Building With Commercial Smoke Alarm System


Does any know where to buy less expensive Intelligent or Addressable fire alarm systems , I will have 6 smoke alarms, 8 alarms and 3 pull stations ?
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Old 09-20-2019, 06:32 PM   #7
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Re: New Building With Commercial Smoke Alarm System


Quote:
Originally Posted by Parnelli Jones View Post
Does any know where to buy less expensive Intelligent or Addressable fire alarm systems , I will have 6 smoke alarms, 8 alarms and 3 pull stations ?

For starters, maybe you need to define the words "less expensive" with a few "$" signs!!

I guess if you could, the system would be missing the following.

Support, Simple Design, Quality Construction, Reliability, Install Manual in English to name a few perks.

Then again you might want to check on eBay for a auction posting.
You never know, you could get lucky!!

Sorry, i couldn't resist.

Have a good weekend.

Les
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Old 09-20-2019, 06:41 PM   #8
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Re: New Building With Commercial Smoke Alarm System


Fire alarm systems are designed/engineered to calc voltage drop to a device which in turn will have an effect on wire size.

The design also will call out what type of devices will be where.

Last three systems i put in only have one pull station for drills.
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Old 09-20-2019, 06:57 PM   #9
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Re: New Building With Commercial Smoke Alarm System


Quote:
Originally Posted by griz View Post
Fire alarm systems are designed/engineered to calc voltage drop to a device which in turn will have an effect on wire size.

The design also will call out what type of devices will be where.

Last three systems i put in only have one pull station for drills.
None at the exit doors?

Worst thing you can do is use the same pull station for every fire drill. I used to work for a large institutional fire alarm company, at one large high school they did that for several years. When our company got the service contract for that school I had to test the system, the only thing that worked in the entire 40 something zone system was that one pull station. They had no idea nothing else worked.

They had to have a fire watch manned by firemen until we could get the system operational. Systems get inspected 1 or 2 times a year, fire drills are 2 times a month.
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Old 09-20-2019, 07:01 PM   #10
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Re: New Building With Commercial Smoke Alarm System


Quote:
Originally Posted by rrk View Post
None at the exit doors?

Worst thing you can do is use the same pull station for every fire drill. I used to work for a large institutional fire alarm company, at one large high school they did that for several years. When our company got the service contract for that school I had to test the system, the only thing that worked in the entire 40 something zone system was that one pull station. They had no idea nothing else worked.

They had to have a fire watch manned by firemen until we could get the system operational. Systems get inspected 1 or 2 times a year, fire drills are 2 times a month.
new california code, well for schools anyways...

system is also audible, voice gives instructions to exit the building.

no more blaring sound.

devices can also be tested with canned smoke.
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Old 09-20-2019, 07:21 PM   #11
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Re: New Building With Commercial Smoke Alarm System


Quote:
Originally Posted by ABLE1 View Post
For starters, maybe you need to define the words "less expensive" with a few "$" signs!!

I guess if you could, the system would be missing the following.

Support, Simple Design, Quality Construction, Reliability, Install Manual in English to name a few perks.

Then again you might want to check on eBay for a auction posting.
You never know, you could get lucky!!

Sorry, i couldn't resist.

Have a good weekend.

Les
I have a small system and was just looking for something designed for a small application, I was looking for brand names and model numbers if any one has used small units. Some of these Intelligent Systems are designed for larger buildings with way more features then I need.
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Old 09-20-2019, 07:44 PM   #12
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Re: New Building With Commercial Smoke Alarm System


Quote:
Originally Posted by Parnelli Jones View Post
I have a small system and was just looking for something designed for a small application, I was looking for brand names and model numbers if any one has used small units. Some of these Intelligent Systems are designed for larger buildings with way more features then I need.
yes, but do you know what features you need?

Current codes?

who designed/engineered the system?
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Old 09-20-2019, 08:07 PM   #13
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Re: New Building With Commercial Smoke Alarm System


Quote:
Originally Posted by Parnelli Jones View Post
I have a small system and was just looking for something designed for a small application, I was looking for brand names and model numbers if any one has used small units. Some of these Intelligent Systems are designed for larger buildings with way more features then I need.
My personal favorite is Silent Knight.

https://www.silentknight.com/Pages/C...S-SILENTKNIGHT

I choose the system and am not to concerned about the price
since I know what I am getting is worth every penny.

Les
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Old 09-20-2019, 08:11 PM   #14
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Re: New Building With Commercial Smoke Alarm System


Quote:
Originally Posted by griz View Post
yes, but do you know what features you need?

Current codes?

who designed/engineered the system?
I had the fire department over and they told me what they wanted, I want to tell my installer what package I want to buy ?

I don't know if you are helping ?
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Old 09-20-2019, 08:12 PM   #15
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Re: New Building With Commercial Smoke Alarm System


Quote:
Originally Posted by ABLE1 View Post
My personal favorite is Silent Knight.

https://www.silentknight.com/Pages/C...S-SILENTKNIGHT

I choose the system and am not to concerned about the price
since I know what I am getting is worth every penny.

Les
Thanks, thats a start-
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Old 09-20-2019, 08:18 PM   #16
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Re: New Building With Commercial Smoke Alarm System


Quote:
Originally Posted by Parnelli Jones View Post
I had the fire department over and they told me what they wanted, I want to tell my installer what package I want to buy ?

I don't know if you are helping ?

Yes he did!!

Don't you have building codes??
Need to follow NFPA 72!!

IBC

ADA

etc.

Need to have full plan submittals!!



Les
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Old 09-20-2019, 08:52 PM   #17
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Re: New Building With Commercial Smoke Alarm System


Quote:
Originally Posted by ABLE1 View Post
Yes he did!!

Don't you have building codes??
Need to follow NFPA 72!!

IBC

ADA

etc.

Need to have full plan submittals!!




Les
I have plans, the contractor will deal with code issues. I was worried more about price from different manufacturers
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Old 09-20-2019, 08:58 PM   #18
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Re: New Building With Commercial Smoke Alarm System


Quote:
Originally Posted by Parnelli Jones View Post
I have plans, the contractor will deal with code issues. I was worried more about price from different manufacturers
When you are dealing with Fire Alarms and
Life Safety 101 taking a low bid is not necessarily
the best logical thinking that should be forefront
on your brain!!


Les
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Old 09-20-2019, 09:02 PM   #19
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Re: New Building With Commercial Smoke Alarm System


Quote:
Originally Posted by Parnelli Jones View Post
I had the fire department over and they told me what they wanted, I want to tell my installer what package I want to buy ?

I don't know if you are helping ?
but WHO designed & engineered the "package"?????
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Old 09-20-2019, 09:15 PM   #20
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Re: New Building With Commercial Smoke Alarm System


Quote:
Originally Posted by griz View Post
but WHO designed & engineered the "package"?????
it hasn't been done yet, it doesn't matter that much, all of these systems can handle what I need, and handle the wiring in place

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