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How To Build A Deck 7 Ft High Without Lateral Bracing

 
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Old 07-14-2015, 04:41 PM   #41
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Re: How To Build A Deck 7 Ft High Without Lateral Bracing


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...
"There you go again" - RR

but this time, I agree.
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Old 07-14-2015, 04:55 PM   #42
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Re: How To Build A Deck 7 Ft High Without Lateral Bracing


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Originally Posted by madmax718 View Post
Well, thats.. interesting. But why go with the angle iron, when they could have just gone with a 30" box. Angle iron still has significantly more deflection than the box, and they specify it for a full 10" depth anyways.
Those posts were 8x8 as well.
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Old 07-14-2015, 05:54 PM   #43
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Re: How To Build A Deck 7 Ft High Without Lateral Bracing


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Originally Posted by madmax718 View Post
anytime you make a notch/cut into the tops or bottoms of the wood you significantly weaken it.
I respectfully disagree, "The tops of the joists are in compression". etc.

Here's something else.
The center axis of a beam being bent is neither in compression or tension.
Therefore, with an 8' lg beam you could put a 8' lg very thin hole through the long axis and there would be no measurable change in bending strength.

With bottom notches you'd have to put a strip on to prevent the notch from opening, but this involves fastener holes which weaken the material.

With the top notch, the plug just sits there resisting the gap/notch closing.

And, depending on the metal thickness you could do without an angle. If you make an X with two strips they only have to resist tension and you don't have to worry about buckling. They maybe can be only 1/16" thk and the width can be varied to give the necessary tensile strength.

I should have thought this out more before posting. My bad.
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Old 07-15-2015, 06:04 PM   #44
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Re: How To Build A Deck 7 Ft High Without Lateral Bracing


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I respectfully disagree,
Notching top or bottom does weaken beams / joists etc. How significant depends on location and size of the notch.
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Old 07-16-2015, 10:09 AM   #45
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Re: How To Build A Deck 7 Ft High Without Lateral Bracing


I'm now thinking if any notching is done to make room for metal cross braces, it should be done on the underside of the deck boards.
That removes the issue of structural strength.

Also, it works on paper but it might not be practical to notch several joists in a line such that the metal strip is an 'interference fit' in all of the notches, "a fit between two parts in which the external dimension of one part slightly exceeds the internal dimension of the part into which it has to fit."
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Old 07-16-2015, 04:58 PM   #46
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Re: How To Build A Deck 7 Ft High Without Lateral Bracing


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Originally Posted by GettingBy View Post
I'm now thinking if any notching is done to make room for metal cross braces, it should be done on the underside of the deck boards.
That removes the issue of structural strength.

Also, it works on paper but it might not be practical to notch several joists in a line such that the metal strip is an 'interference fit' in all of the notches, "a fit between two parts in which the external dimension of one part slightly exceeds the internal dimension of the part into which it has to fit."
Metal braces would have to be made out of SS because with the pt you cant use steel or aluminum. Using SS isn't cost effective. Just use some headlocks and pt braces on the underside of the deck and be done with it.
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Old 07-16-2015, 05:41 PM   #47
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Re: How To Build A Deck 7 Ft High Without Lateral Bracing


Here's an engineered detail for a post for a deck with no knees. It's an oldie and there'd be some changes on it such as I don't like the tube not being designed to allow water that might get in to drain out.

Looks like the engineer got a little carried away on the footing size also as I don't remember the deck from being really big but not sure on that.
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Old 07-17-2015, 12:55 AM   #48
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Re: How To Build A Deck 7 Ft High Without Lateral Bracing


One solution: Steel strap, flashing tape on underside to prevent contact with PT.
Pop angled line on joist tops
Set Skil to " depth
Holding blade guard up, walk joists fuzzing out 1" wide channel along popped line.
Gotta account for teco heads as well.
Don't think any engineer will balk at " gone from joist. I get that much difference in joist heights at times.

Pain is forgetting to watch for the strap and bouncing a deck board fastener off it...

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Old 07-18-2015, 09:01 AM   #49
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Re: How To Build A Deck 7 Ft High Without Lateral Bracing


Or else you caulk the interface between metal and wood to prevent water being trapped.
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Old 07-18-2015, 04:45 PM   #50
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Re: How To Build A Deck 7 Ft High Without Lateral Bracing


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Originally Posted by BuiltByMAC View Post
One solution: Steel strap, flashing tape on underside to prevent contact with PT.
Pop angled line on joist tops
Set Skil to " depth
Holding blade guard up, walk joists fuzzing out 1" wide channel along popped line.
Gotta account for teco heads as well.
Don't think any engineer will balk at " gone from joist. I get that much difference in joist heights at times.

Pain is forgetting to watch for the strap and bouncing a deck board fastener off it...

Mac
Router should be faster than saw kerf cuts.
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Old 07-18-2015, 05:13 PM   #51
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Re: How To Build A Deck 7 Ft High Without Lateral Bracing


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Originally Posted by TG Deck View Post
Router should be faster than saw kerf cuts.
I can use a skilsaw as a router
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Old 07-18-2015, 05:23 PM   #52
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Re: How To Build A Deck 7 Ft High Without Lateral Bracing


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Originally Posted by Californiadecks View Post
I can use a skilsaw as a router
I can clean my ear canals with a roto-zip.

My router will eat your skilsaw for the above mentioned need....
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Old 07-18-2015, 05:26 PM   #53
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Re: How To Build A Deck 7 Ft High Without Lateral Bracing


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Originally Posted by TG Deck View Post
I can clean my ear canals with a roto-zip.

My router will eat your skilsaw for the above mentioned need....
I would like to clean your ear canals with a roto-zip too.
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Old 07-18-2015, 05:31 PM   #54
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Re: How To Build A Deck 7 Ft High Without Lateral Bracing


I don't normally pull out the router on framing days, so yes, a router would make the cuts faster but you have factor in the time it takes to go get the thing! Plus,I don't have a rafter hook on my router so it'd be more of a pain to deal with the tool on an elevated open frame.

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Old 07-18-2015, 05:36 PM   #55
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Re: How To Build A Deck 7 Ft High Without Lateral Bracing


Oh, and I'm not talking about making multiple cuts and chiseling them out... Set your depth to ", pin the guard back and slide the saw back and forth over the joist keeping the blade moving the whole time. It's hard on the blade but so damn fast to create a channel.

Mac
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Old 07-18-2015, 05:45 PM   #56
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Re: How To Build A Deck 7 Ft High Without Lateral Bracing


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Originally Posted by BuiltByMAC View Post
Oh, and I'm not talking about making multiple cuts and chiseling them out... Set your depth to ", pin the guard back and slide the saw back and forth over the joist keeping the blade moving the whole time. It's hard on the blade but so damn fast to create a channel.

Mac
Exactly.
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Old 07-18-2015, 06:30 PM   #57
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Re: How To Build A Deck 7 Ft High Without Lateral Bracing


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Originally Posted by BuiltByMAC View Post
I don't normally pull out the router on framing days, so yes, a router would make the cuts faster but you have factor in the time it takes to go get the thing! Plus,I don't have a rafter hook on my router so it'd be more of a pain to deal with the tool on an elevated open frame.

Mac
I've done that many times insetting gate latches on posts.
Those are a lot of wood to clear.
The router thing just made that much faster and cleaner...and no chisel work.

I appreciate your posts.

Mike wasn't very exact on his canal wax cleaning, so I'm now deaf - but life goes on...
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Old 07-18-2015, 09:09 PM   #58
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Re: How To Build A Deck 7 Ft High Without Lateral Bracing


My new favorite tool is a flush cut saw...I inset my gate latches as well and the flush cut saw has replaced my chisel for clearing the corners.

I dig the router for shop work, don't often pull it out on site. It generates a huge amount of sawdust.

Last edited by BuiltByMAC; 07-18-2015 at 09:12 PM.
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Old 07-18-2015, 09:15 PM   #59
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Re: How To Build A Deck 7 Ft High Without Lateral Bracing


Couldn't figure out how to edit my post above to add this...
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Old 07-18-2015, 10:11 PM   #60
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Re: How To Build A Deck 7 Ft High Without Lateral Bracing


Site built gate latch I did 23 years ago on my house.

On it's second gate, but that is all original hardware.

Remember EVERYTHING rusts and runs here...

It has also lasted through about 13 million cycles with teenage boys....
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