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Crawlspace Low Point Drain Details Pacific NW

 
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Old 05-18-2019, 06:17 AM   #21
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Re: Crawlspace Low Point Drain Details Pacific NW


Every site is different, when you dig the hole you have to determine if that basement will need a sump and pump and footing drains or not. It’s been about 50/50 for me.
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Old 05-18-2019, 06:56 AM   #22
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Re: Crawlspace Low Point Drain Details Pacific NW


Here: Gravity or sump pump assisted - We must have one or the other.

I have zero builds with gravity systems.
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Old 05-18-2019, 09:46 AM   #23
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Re: Crawlspace Low Point Drain Details Pacific NW


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Sump pumps are a necessary evil. I don't know what folks with basements did before sump pumps came along. Bailed after every rain storm I guess.


Well John,this is what they did in the rural areas. They built on the high ground and let gravity do it's thing. Around here N.W. Indiana,you can drive past any old farmstead and see where the house was built,it was the highest portion of the farm. I don't care if that high place was 10 ' from the road or if it was 700 ' ,that is where the house went.

Determining how to address the water management concerns during the basement and excavation portion of the job is the incorrect way to attack the situation in my not so humble opinion. That should be looked into before the yellow iron ever pulls up to the site. There have been several article that warn / implore builders to do soil testing on every lot in the subdivision. It is prudent and rather inexpensive to do them all while the equipment makes one trip rather than piecemeal. A good developer will spend that money up front to assure that each lot is truly shovel ready.


I have seen developers literally go bankrupt trying to save a few bucks. A long standing developer by me developed and area with questionable soil. Several years later,much settling was taking place;it was determined the homes were build over a bog several feet below the clay soil beneath the footings. The cost to install helical piers was over 75 K for each of the homes,and that was over 20 years ago.


We now have available testing methods that can ALMOST take the risk out of the unknowns,it is prudent to avail ourselves of this technology.

If the lots show a high water table,the idea of a full basement probably should not be in the cards.


Bottom line,I'm not against sump pumps,all I'm saying is place them outside,in the event of a problem,you have bought yourself a tad more time.
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Old 05-18-2019, 10:12 AM   #24
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Re: Crawlspace Low Point Drain Details Pacific NW


Pumps are rare here. Generally they tie to the storm sewer or go to daylight.
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Old 05-18-2019, 10:26 AM   #25
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Re: Crawlspace Low Point Drain Details Pacific NW


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Pumps are rare here. Generally they tie to the storm sewer or go to daylight.



That is very interesting and makes sense.

Just some trivia,I have an long term friend in the area whose family were some of the very first settlers in the area. My fiend who is 83 yrs old has been an excavating contractor his entire life. One of the very best machine operators I ever knew. He is a guy with so much knowledge of soils in the surrounding area,he can tell you with assurance what you will hit when yo did at what season of the year. Several years ago,he said 60 % of the remaining undeveloped lots in the county were not fit to be built upon. At that time,I thought his assessment was rather harsh . Now,I look back and realize if he was wrong,it was because he was on the low side.

When less than prime locations are developed,that is when issues pop up that impact the buildings for the duration.
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Old 05-18-2019, 10:33 AM   #26
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Re: Crawlspace Low Point Drain Details Pacific NW


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Well John,this is what they did in the rural areas. They built on the high ground and let gravity do it's thing. Around here N.W. Indiana,you can drive past any old farmstead and see where the house was built,it was the highest portion of the farm. I don't care if that high place was 10 ' from the road or if it was 700 ' ,that is where the house went...............

.
Yup. How my parents old farmstead was built. Those days are long gone. Like 150 years long gone.

I spent nearly 20 years building on the largest ex-gravel pit operation in the state. Some places you can drill 250 ft and still get gravel on the core bit.

Doesn't matter. Every basement got a perimeter tile and sump. We're gonna spend the dime. If HO wants to do something after - so be it.
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Old 05-18-2019, 04:51 PM   #27
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Re: Crawlspace Low Point Drain Details Pacific NW


Just thought I'd share this first hand experience why soil borings are extremely beneficial PRIOR to laying out the strategy for a new building and before the yellow iron is on site.

I'm located about 3/4 of a mile due south of the south shore of lake Michigan. From the shoreline inwards for the first 1 / 2 mile pure sand about as far down as you would want to dig. That sand is very fine grained but well drained. after that first 1/2 mile and about 4 miles south,the top soil is hard pan clay for the first 6 -8 ' then extremely coarse well drained sand.

So,the newbies that are not aware of that,do the typical footing drain pipes ,sumps the whole nine yards. The option is if you know the soil you are up against,you still do the drain pipe etc. however,in strategic locations in the SDR 35 drain pipe,you install a 4 way T over holes and pipe you have bored down 2 feet or so to the well drained sand. One part of the T is ran straight up to grade and capped off. From that point forward,little if any water ever makes it to the sump basin. The reason for the pipe and T to grade,all it will take is a minuscule 1/4 " of clay silt to migrate down to the sand and seal it off. When one discovers their sump pump has been running,just pull the cap and poke down a tad with a sharp stick and you will be in great shape for several more years.


For those who never had soil borings and are unaware,they wrestle with what comes with pumps,electric outages etc. for the life of the building.
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Old 05-18-2019, 09:21 PM   #28
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Re: Crawlspace Low Point Drain Details Pacific NW


The sleeve in the footing to allow the basement to FILL with water in flood so the walls of the basement aren't blown in by the liquidfied soil,

A wet basement, much better then a destroyed foundation.

Don't keep pumping when the yard is Under river water....

Agree with FJN, install primary sump pump in a window well or Fruit cellar/vault room with a raised threshold/kneeknocker. Secondary one on interior loop of tile, cross connected with a plunger style valve for Noah floods.
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Last edited by Fouthgeneration; 05-18-2019 at 09:26 PM.
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Old 05-19-2019, 06:40 AM   #29
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Re: Crawlspace Low Point Drain Details Pacific NW


Quote:
Originally Posted by fjn View Post

Just some trivia,I have an long term friend in the area whose family were some of the very first settlers in the area. My fiend who is 83 yrs old has been an excavating contractor his entire life. One of the very best machine operators I ever knew. He is a guy with so much knowledge of soils in the surrounding area,he can tell you with assurance what you will hit when yo did at what season of the year. Several years ago,he said 60 % of the remaining undeveloped lots in the county were not fit to be built upon. At that time,I thought his assessment was rather harsh . Now,I look back and realize if he was wrong,it was because he was on the low side.

When less than prime locations are developed,that is when issues pop up that impact the buildings for the duration.

I guess if you, your friend and the democrats have your way this is America’s future:
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Last edited by Big Johnson; 05-19-2019 at 06:45 AM.
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