Milwaukee Owns Li In Cordless Tools? - Tools & Equipment - Contractor Talk

Milwaukee Owns Li In Cordless Tools?

 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 11-04-2014, 01:43 PM   #1
Thom
 
thom's Avatar
 
Trade: General Contractor/Homebuilder
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Albuquerque NM
Posts: 4,137
Rewards Points: 4,748

Milwaukee Owns Li In Cordless Tools?


Milwaukee tools, in a page out of Apple's play book, patented the use of Lithium Ion batteries in cordless tools and is now suing other tool manufacturers for royalties.


http://www.toolsofthetrade.net/manuf...n-tools_o.aspx

Of course Apple won claiming ownership of certain existing ideas by patenting their use in mobile phones. It seems Milwaukee is trying the same thing. Surprised they didn't patent the design feature "round" for use in saw blades for cordless tools.

Our patent system is horribly broken.
__________________
Patriotism is being loyal to your country all the time and your government when it deserves it. Mark Twain
thom is offline  

Warning: The topics covered on this site include activities in which there exists the potential for serious injury or death. ContractorTalk.com DOES NOT guarantee the accuracy or completeness of any information contained on this site. Always use proper safety precaution and reference reliable outside sources before attempting any construction or remodeling task!

   

Advertisement

 

Old 11-04-2014, 01:59 PM   #2
LRG WoodCrafting

 
Leo G's Avatar
 
Trade: Maker of Fine Sawdust
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Windsor Locks, Connecticut
Posts: 40,200
Rewards Points: 11,063

Re: Milwaukee Owns Li In Cordless Tools?


Lithium is an atom. You can't patent what nature has created naturally, or so I thought. Maybe they just want to patent the "Li" term. But that was conceived a long time ago when they made the periodic tables.

What is it exactly they are trying to patent?

Advertisement

__________________
Sawdust Follows Me Everywhere
I can explain it to you, but I can't understand it for you.
Sanding is the bane of my existence
WWG1WGA

Quote:
Originally Posted by HusqyPro View Post
Carpenter by day.
Mad scientist by night.
http://lrgwood.com
Custom Cabinets in Hartford County Connecticut
Leo G is online now  
Old 11-04-2014, 02:07 PM   #3
LRG WoodCrafting

 
Leo G's Avatar
 
Trade: Maker of Fine Sawdust
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Windsor Locks, Connecticut
Posts: 40,200
Rewards Points: 11,063

Re: Milwaukee Owns Li In Cordless Tools?


Good luck with this. Putting batteries in a package is what they are claiming their patent covers. Well, putting Li-Ion batteries in a pack. How absurd. They've been stacking batteries since they were invented.

Quote:
The operative text in the section above is “adopted Milwaukee Tool’s inventions”. If any of these cases go to trial it will be up to a jury to decide if putting Li-Ion cells in a battery pack is an “invention” covered by patent law. It will be interesting to see what happens. A win by Milwaukee could mean some companies would be barred from producing or selling Li-Ion tools if they were unable to come to a financial agreement with Milwaukee.
And I'll bet that Sony might have something to say about this....



Quote:
In 1991, Sony and Asahi Kasei released the first commercial lithium-ion battery.
__________________
Sawdust Follows Me Everywhere
I can explain it to you, but I can't understand it for you.
Sanding is the bane of my existence
WWG1WGA

Quote:
Originally Posted by HusqyPro View Post
Carpenter by day.
Mad scientist by night.
http://lrgwood.com
Custom Cabinets in Hartford County Connecticut
Leo G is online now  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 11-04-2014, 02:07 PM   #4
Noob
 
Andrew6127's Avatar
 
Trade: Framing
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: SE, MI
Posts: 243
Rewards Points: 80

Re: Milwaukee Owns Li In Cordless Tools?


This should be thrown out the window, f---ing stupid. You shouldn't be able to get a patent on IP. Patents should be on products only, not ideas.

Making something lighter, faster, stronger, but not new isn't inventing. I consider it redesign/reengirneering, no patent should be issued for something like that.
Andrew6127 is offline  
Old 11-04-2014, 02:13 PM   #5
LRG WoodCrafting

 
Leo G's Avatar
 
Trade: Maker of Fine Sawdust
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Windsor Locks, Connecticut
Posts: 40,200
Rewards Points: 11,063

Re: Milwaukee Owns Li In Cordless Tools?


I took your invention and put two of them together, now it's my invention.
__________________
Sawdust Follows Me Everywhere
I can explain it to you, but I can't understand it for you.
Sanding is the bane of my existence
WWG1WGA

Quote:
Originally Posted by HusqyPro View Post
Carpenter by day.
Mad scientist by night.
http://lrgwood.com
Custom Cabinets in Hartford County Connecticut
Leo G is online now  
The Following User Says Thank You to Leo G For This Useful Post:
thom (11-05-2014)
Old 11-04-2014, 02:42 PM   #6
Hack
 
asevereid's Avatar
 
Trade: Carpenter
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Kamloops, B.C.
Posts: 2,700
Rewards Points: 354

Re: Milwaukee Owns Li In Cordless Tools?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Leo G View Post
I took your invention and put two of them together, now it's my invention.
Reminds me...I gotta go file a patent for piano cabinets

But seriously, this is ridiculous.
I think it's just an attempt to reach an "amicable negotiation" with the companies named in the suit.
This "agreement" may already be in place with the other 'Big 3', and that's why they are not named.
__________________
How to figure your pricing:
http://goo.gl/Il8c2
L+M+O+P/ Pricing, Estimating, And Success
Charging tree fiddy per lineal BOB
asevereid is online now  
Old 11-04-2014, 02:42 PM   #7
Noob
 
Andrew6127's Avatar
 
Trade: Framing
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: SE, MI
Posts: 243
Rewards Points: 80

Re: Milwaukee Owns Li In Cordless Tools?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Leo G View Post
I took your invention and put two of them together, now it's my invention.


What does a company like Milwaukee need to sue for anyway? Their tools are so damn expensive they can't be hurting for money.
Andrew6127 is offline  
Old 11-04-2014, 03:04 PM   #8
Pro
 
hdavis's Avatar
 
Trade: remodeling
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: CoastalME
Posts: 23,367
Rewards Points: 2,900

Re: Milwaukee Owns Li In Cordless Tools?


This is more plausible than it seems. I think they'll have problems with some of their claims because they aren't all magic for the 20 amp supply.
hdavis is online now  
Old 11-04-2014, 03:09 PM   #9
Pro
 
hdavis's Avatar
 
Trade: remodeling
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: CoastalME
Posts: 23,367
Rewards Points: 2,900

Re: Milwaukee Owns Li In Cordless Tools?


Quote:
Originally Posted by thom View Post

Our patent system is horribly broken.
I haven't (and won't) wade through the patents in the area to see what, if anything, they actually carved out.

IMO, ythe biggest problem with a lot of companies is they think they're a tool company, for instance, and give IP a back seat.

We'll see how the litigation goes, but there are overseas companies that were shipping tools with Li battery packs around the time the first patent was applied for.
hdavis is online now  
Old 11-04-2014, 05:53 PM   #10
Pro
 
BCConstruction's Avatar
 
Trade: Construction
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Roanoke, VA
Posts: 16,392
Rewards Points: 2,394

Re: Milwaukee Owns Li In Cordless Tools?


This won't go anywhere. They just trolling like apple do. The problem is Apple have enough money to do it. Milwaukee not so much.

How on earth you even get a patent on something like that I will never know. Like some have said li-ion cells have been bulked together like that in everything from watches to submarines. How do they think they own the patent to put them into tool packs I never know. T
__________________
www.bcconstructionllc.com
BCConstruction is offline  
Old 11-04-2014, 06:36 PM   #11
Pro
 
Jswills76's Avatar
 
Trade: custom carpentry
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: linglestown pa
Posts: 577
Rewards Points: 836

Re: Milwaukee Owns Li In Cordless Tools?


Didn't Makita start using li in 04?
Jswills76 is offline  
Old 11-04-2014, 06:45 PM   #12
Pro
 
Rustbucket's Avatar
 
Trade: Remodel/Deck
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Jackson, MS
Posts: 1,861
Rewards Points: 1,748

Re: Milwaukee Owns Li In Cordless Tools?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Jswills76
Didn't Makita start using li in 04?
Milwaukee was first with the V18 line.
Rustbucket is offline  
Old 11-04-2014, 06:47 PM   #13
Ciaos mitigator
 
chris klee's Avatar
 
Trade: Carpentry
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Delaware
Posts: 1,943
Rewards Points: 1,290

Re: Milwaukee Owns Li In Cordless Tools?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Jswills76 View Post
Didn't Makita start using li in 04?
i thought they were the first ones to use it.
__________________
CK Carpentry
chris klee is offline  
Old 11-04-2014, 07:05 PM   #14
Pro
 
BCConstruction's Avatar
 
Trade: Construction
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Roanoke, VA
Posts: 16,392
Rewards Points: 2,394

Re: Milwaukee Owns Li In Cordless Tools?


I think it was a few months between the LXT line and when Milwaukee bought them out. But Milwaukee were first to use li-ion cells in tool battery packs. I would imagine both were in development at the same time but Milwaukee released them earlier. But both were 2005 as I bought mine in 2006 a few months after release shipped from the US to the UK.

If they even make 1cent from this it truly shows how flawed the patent system is. I'm gonna go patent li-po cells in tools packs that draw over 6amps then wait for the cash to roll in. I don't invent anything but where's my money bitches
__________________
www.bcconstructionllc.com
BCConstruction is offline  
Old 11-04-2014, 07:11 PM   #15
Pro
 
Rustbucket's Avatar
 
Trade: Remodel/Deck
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Jackson, MS
Posts: 1,861
Rewards Points: 1,748

Re: Milwaukee Owns Li In Cordless Tools?


Quote:
Originally Posted by BCConstruction
This won't go anywhere. They just trolling like apple do. The problem is Apple have enough money to do it. Milwaukee not so much. How on earth you even get a patent on something like that I will never know. Like some have said li-ion cells have been bulked together like that in everything from watches to submarines. How do they think they own the patent to put them into tool packs I never know. T
Unfortunately, this is exactly how the patent system works. There really are very few patents filed that are not just an arrangement of other existing components. Some are patented, in which case the patent filer would be responsible for licensing and paying royalties on those components.

Still, I think this lawsuit is a stretch. I guess it depends on how Milwaukee defined "tools" in their patent application. I would think that maybe NASA used Li-Ion up in space long before Milwaukee even knew what Li-Ion was. Also curious why it took a decade for them to file suit. Doesn't make much
Rustbucket is offline  
Old 11-04-2014, 08:19 PM   #16
Hack
 
asevereid's Avatar
 
Trade: Carpenter
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Kamloops, B.C.
Posts: 2,700
Rewards Points: 354

Re: Milwaukee Owns Li In Cordless Tools?


I've seen something similar to this happen before in the paintball industry.
The filer of the suit, "Smart Parts LLC" went after pretty much every company utilizing components in their markers and other hardware that they said violated their patent claims.
At first they won against the smaller companies; even going as far as driving some out of business. But when they came up against some of the larger companies the patent dispute became more clarified and a lot of the patent claims, under scrutiny, were found to be too ambiguous or even false. As a result, SP eventually filed a Ch.11, followed shortly after by Ch.7, and liquidated into history.

Essentially, SP had decided that all electro pneumatic markers were based on their original design, but they were only partial owners of the filed patent. The original designer was paid for his design by having half, or more than half, of the patent ownership. When other companies found this out, they were able to acquire this intellectual property and use it as leverage against SP.
To the best of my knowledge this design, or the general idea behind the design, is now an undisputed industry standard. But on that I may be wrong as I haven't been following the industry for the last 6 or 7 years.
__________________
How to figure your pricing:
http://goo.gl/Il8c2
L+M+O+P/ Pricing, Estimating, And Success
Charging tree fiddy per lineal BOB
asevereid is online now  
Old 11-04-2014, 08:57 PM   #17
Pro
 
Rustbucket's Avatar
 
Trade: Remodel/Deck
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Jackson, MS
Posts: 1,861
Rewards Points: 1,748

Re: Milwaukee Owns Li In Cordless Tools?


Patent trolling is an industry in itself. Companies buy patents that the owners can't afford to protect, and sue everybody in sight. Doesn't matter that they have no intention of ever producing anything with the patent. Their sole purpose is to win compensation through lawsuits. It's a disgusting industry! Not saying Milwaukee is doing this, as they clearly use their patent.

Advertisement

Rustbucket is offline  



Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Cordless tools. Which do you use or recommend rservices Tools & Equipment 30 11-13-2012 06:53 PM
Bostich Cordless Angled Finish Nailer ? MF Custom Tools & Equipment 19 09-14-2012 10:08 PM
Cordless oscillating multi tools: How long would battery life be? HighlanderNorth Tools & Equipment 4 12-18-2011 06:14 PM
New Milwaukee 18V cordless set for sale orson Contractor Swap 7 11-28-2008 06:27 PM
Milwaukee V28 Lithium Ion Cordless R&S Exteriors Tools & Equipment 3 08-11-2006 09:40 AM

Join Now... It's Fast and FREE!

I am a professional contractor
I am a DIY Homeowner
Drywall Talk is for
PROFESSIONAL CONTRACTORS ONLY!

At DrywallTalk.com we cater exlusivly to professional contractors who make their living as a contractor. Knowing that many homeowners and DIYers are looking for a community to call home, we've created www.DIYChatroom.com DIY Chatroom is full of helpful advices and perfect for DIY homeowners.

Redirecing in 10 seconds
No Thanks
terms of service

Already Have an Account?