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36' LVL Ceiling Beam - Is It Possible?

 
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Old 05-14-2020, 05:26 PM   #21
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Re: 36' LVL Ceiling Beam - Is It Possible?


The place where I get my steel will usually do the calcs for the beam. Don't bother with the lumber yard. A beam that length, without intermediate support is gonna be steel.
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Old 05-14-2020, 09:16 PM   #22
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Re: 36' LVL Ceiling Beam - Is It Possible?


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Originally Posted by Warren View Post
The place where I get my steel will usually do the calcs for the beam. Don't bother with the lumber yard. A beam that length, without intermediate support is gonna be steel.
Around here the steel shop will not make you a beam unless you have an engineer's or architects stamped plan.
I designed a beam a while back did all the calculations and did my own drawings and engineer on staff in the metal shop checked and said its the right calculations the beam will work, but in order to make and release that beam, I have to bring a stamped drawing.
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Old 05-14-2020, 11:49 PM   #23
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Re: 36' LVL Ceiling Beam - Is It Possible?


Well he is in Kentucky,,, I heard they don't do a lot of permits there
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Old 05-15-2020, 07:35 AM   #24
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Re: 36' LVL Ceiling Beam - Is It Possible?


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Well he is in Kentucky,,, I heard they don't do a lot of permits there
Sounds like a little town in NJ, I did a kitchen remodeling, construction was going on all over the place and it seems I'm the only one who wanted to get a permit
Took me almost a week to catch someone in the office and the lady actually blew the dust off the permit jacket before she handed it to me.
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Old 05-15-2020, 09:19 AM   #25
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Re: 36' LVL Ceiling Beam - Is It Possible?


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Well he is in Kentucky,,, I heard they don't do a lot of permits there
I have absolutely no idea what you're talking about...

Last edited by aar0nhurst; 05-15-2020 at 09:19 AM. Reason: wording
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Old 05-15-2020, 04:44 PM   #26
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Re: 36' LVL Ceiling Beam - Is It Possible?


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I have absolutely no idea what you're talking about...
A permit is something your AHJ may give you in exchange for money. It lets you build and get inspected at various stages of the build.
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Old 05-15-2020, 08:53 PM   #27
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Re: 36' LVL Ceiling Beam - Is It Possible?


So get this, I called the few (4) steel places in my area and none provide residential steel work nor could offer an engineer to help me. I called the largest steel company and told the lady answering phones, "I know you don't do residential but at least let me talk to one of your guys and hopefully they can refer me to someone." Guess what...nothing. Well, she did give me a number to a company 2 hours away but that won't work. (not that desperate yet)

I called "the" lumber yard (1) and had to leave a message for the manager because no one in the office knew how to engineer a beam, wood or steel. He's yet to call me back.

Then I was like, duh, just call the county. The guy was nice but couldn't help me out. Acted like he'd never seen a residential plan that included a steel beam. When I asked him about submitting my own plans, he literally told me that he doesn't need an engineer's approval on plans. He just reviews them and unless they have incorrect codes, approves them. SMH

I'll keep trying next week but I thought I'd share my fun filled day. Updates to come when I have them.
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Old 05-15-2020, 10:07 PM   #28
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Re: 36' LVL Ceiling Beam - Is It Possible?


your lack of understanding what is involved in engineering this beam is getting in your way.

with what you have involved no lumber yard or steel company will want to deal with you.

you need a stamped plan from an acceptable engineer to proceed.

as many have stated there is WAY more going on than a simple span detail.

steel fabricators want stamped engineers drawings before they will talk to you...

otherwise they just figure you are a dumb azz home owner/diyer that don't know your azz from a hole in the ground...

you will NOT get any magic internet answers...
until you get this and go to an engineer you will not progress in your project...
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Old 05-15-2020, 10:14 PM   #29
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Re: 36' LVL Ceiling Beam - Is It Possible?


It's Kentucky They just eye ball and wing it ober dar.
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Old 05-16-2020, 12:02 AM   #30
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Re: 36' LVL Ceiling Beam - Is It Possible?


Quote:
Originally Posted by griz View Post
your lack of understanding what is involved in engineering this beam is getting in your way.
So you're saying I should stay ignorant? I'll ask until I'm satisfied. Or until people stop answering. Knowledge isn't the key, understanding is.

Quote:
Originally Posted by griz View Post
you will NOT get any magic internet answers...
until you get this and go to an engineer you will not progress in your project...
What exactly do you think I am trying to do? I asked for advice here, and the advice was to get an engineer. I've said repeatedly that I'm getting an engineer. I'll say it again. I'm getting an engineer. Apparently, in BFK(entucky) no one engineers anything except moonshine.

I have:
4:12 pitch roof
Stick Frame (rafters)
15psf roof live load (snow) - per 2018 Kentucky Building Code
10psf roof dead load
20psf ceiling live load
10psf ceiling dead
27' House width (eave to eave)
12.5' to middle wall

Roof live load (snow): 15psf x 13.5 = 202.5
Roof dead load: 10psf x 13.5 = 135
Ceiling live load: 20psf x 6.25 = 125
Ceiling dead load: 10psf x 6.25 = 62.5
Total load = 525 pounds per lineal foot

Now tell me what engineer would turn me away with that information in hand?

I truly am grateful for everyone who's offered advice because you don't owe me your time. But griz...you can worry bout your own self.
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Old 05-16-2020, 12:03 AM   #31
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Re: 36' LVL Ceiling Beam - Is It Possible?


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Originally Posted by hdavis View Post
A permit is something your AHJ may give you in exchange for money. It lets you build and get inspected at various stages of the build.
Ohhhh, I think I heard about those things when I went to the big city one time.
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Old 05-16-2020, 12:30 AM   #32
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Re: 36' LVL Ceiling Beam - Is It Possible?


What wind and seismic category are you in?

This kind of engineering is not difficult, getting a PE or SE license is really GD hard though.

Andy.
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Old 05-16-2020, 12:41 AM   #33
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Re: 36' LVL Ceiling Beam - Is It Possible?


Quote:
Originally Posted by aar0nhurst View Post
So you're saying I should stay ignorant? I'll ask until I'm satisfied. Or until people stop answering. Knowledge isn't the key, understanding is.



What exactly do you think I am trying to do? I asked for advice here, and the advice was to get an engineer. I've said repeatedly that I'm getting an engineer. I'll say it again. I'm getting an engineer. Apparently, in BFK(entucky) no one engineers anything except moonshine.

I have:
4:12 pitch roof
Stick Frame (rafters)
15psf roof live load (snow) - per 2018 Kentucky Building Code
10psf roof dead load
20psf ceiling live load
10psf ceiling dead
27' House width (eave to eave)
12.5' to middle wall

Roof live load (snow): 15psf x 13.5 = 202.5
Roof dead load: 10psf x 13.5 = 135
Ceiling live load: 20psf x 6.25 = 125
Ceiling dead load: 10psf x 6.25 = 62.5
Total load = 525 pounds per lineal foot

Now tell me what engineer would turn me away with that information in hand?

I truly am grateful for everyone who's offered advice because you don't owe me your time. But griz...you can worry bout your own self.
Well then, get on the phone or on the net and locate one, get a price and go from there. They'll likely want a set of plans with a couple of sections. Once you have the stamped plans then go find a fabricator, depending on where you are in the country they might have to be certified for any welding done.

Like Warren said it's going to be steel at that span so in addition to the beam you want to have the engineer call out how you're going to transition from the beam to the columns and on down to the footings, have them provide the details and pertinent information.
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Old 05-16-2020, 06:45 AM   #34
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Re: 36' LVL Ceiling Beam - Is It Possible?


Quote:
Originally Posted by aar0nhurst View Post
So you're saying I should stay ignorant? I'll ask until I'm satisfied. Or until people stop answering. Knowledge isn't the key, understanding is.



What exactly do you think I am trying to do? I asked for advice here, and the advice was to get an engineer. I've said repeatedly that I'm getting an engineer. I'll say it again. I'm getting an engineer. Apparently, in BFK(entucky) no one engineers anything except moonshine.

I have:
4:12 pitch roof
Stick Frame (rafters)
15psf roof live load (snow) - per 2018 Kentucky Building Code
10psf roof dead load
20psf ceiling live load
10psf ceiling dead
27' House width (eave to eave)
12.5' to middle wall

Roof live load (snow): 15psf x 13.5 = 202.5
Roof dead load: 10psf x 13.5 = 135
Ceiling live load: 20psf x 6.25 = 125
Ceiling dead load: 10psf x 6.25 = 62.5
Total load = 525 pounds per lineal foot

Now tell me what engineer would turn me away with that information in hand?

I truly am grateful for everyone who's offered advice because you don't owe me your time. But griz...you can worry bout your own self.
You missing a beam load.

That said, there is a rule of thumb when you calculate the steel I-beam size... you take the total span in inches divide that by 20 so in your case 36x12/20= 21.6".... Now the depth of the beam is usually 1/3 to 1/2 of that so lets take the lower number 21.6 X .33= 7.128 so you will need a
22x7.5 I-Beam the weight of that beam will be in the neighborhood of 75-80 LB per foot 36 X 80=2,880 LB beam. Good luck with that one.
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Last edited by greg24k; 05-16-2020 at 07:18 AM.
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Old 05-16-2020, 06:52 AM   #35
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Re: 36' LVL Ceiling Beam - Is It Possible?


Stamped engineering using steel is the only way I would touch this.
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Old 05-16-2020, 08:02 AM   #36
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Re: 36' LVL Ceiling Beam - Is It Possible?


Thought I'd mention to the poster that in addition to structural engineers civil engineers can usually do calcs for structures, at least that's the case out here.
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Old 05-16-2020, 10:28 AM   #37
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Re: 36' LVL Ceiling Beam - Is It Possible?


Quote:
Originally Posted by aar0nhurst View Post
So you're saying I should stay ignorant? I'll ask until I'm satisfied. Or until people stop answering. Knowledge isn't the key, understanding is.
No. He stated very clearly that calling steel fab companies before you have engineering is ass-backwards, and that's why you haven't had any success.



Quote:
Originally Posted by aar0nhurst View Post

I truly am grateful for everyone who's offered advice because you don't owe me your time. But griz...you can worry bout your own self.

Telling someone who is taking their own personal time, and decades of experience, to help you to understand something that is obviously over your head, to mind their own business, is incredibly ungrateful.

I guess this why most of these threads get shut down right out of the gate. Apparently, the average HO is too proud to be educated.

Last edited by Seven-Delta-FortyOne; 05-16-2020 at 10:31 AM.
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Old 06-22-2020, 09:57 PM   #38
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Re: 36' LVL Ceiling Beam - Is It Possible?


If your opening up the whole 25x36 and taking down all interior walls this is basically a full gut. New electric, Hvac, flooring, etc. If that's the case, another option would be to just tear the whole roof off and redo it with 25' trusses. New ceiling could be flat, vaulted, storage or room in attic. could even change from hip to gable ends if you want. Truss company would engineer and there would be no new point loads, footings or machine rental.
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Old 06-28-2020, 08:28 AM   #39
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Re: 36' LVL Ceiling Beam - Is It Possible?


Engineer will spec it out and lumber yard can put it together and deliver to the site. Make sure to get the permit and have it inspected to cover your bottom. 36 is long and the beam alone will be a heavy sucker. You will need a crane and lots of strong people.

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