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Old 05-19-2019, 05:26 PM   #21
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Re: 2x10 Span


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Originally Posted by Golden view View Post
a 12x12" footing is quite possibly less strong than the 45 year old reinforced slab. That's a tiny footing. It'll have a cold joint to the slab and it's on the same expansive soils.
You bring up some very good points. Cold joint is one I had not considered. If I do go against his report it is all on me.

He seem not at all concerned about putting the weight on the monopost because we can jack it up or down if the slab heaves. I calculated 1500 lb per sq ft for clay soil and 2000 lb oer sq ft for slab assuming not reinforced.

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Old 05-19-2019, 05:28 PM   #22
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Re: 2x10 Span


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Well you consulted an engineer and anything you do beyond his beliefs is extra safe so go for it. Its bugging you and it would me too, just 1 event is very costly
If I do cut into slab and it fails it is all on me. If he specs beam on slab he takes the liability.

Golden is right that may too small of a footer and may not be as strong as the 45 yr old slab.

My math is wrong, I only used 2 points of bearing the exterior wall and grade beam orginal to house, my beam breaks it into 1/3 which is 1,100 on each of my post.

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Old 05-19-2019, 06:00 PM   #23
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Re: 2x10 Span


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Old 05-19-2019, 06:02 PM   #24
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Re: 2x10 Span


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If I do cut into slab and it fails it is all on me. If he specs beam on slab he takes the liability.

Golden is right that may too small of a footer and may not be as strong as the 45 yr old slab.

My math is wrong, I only used 2 points of bearing the exterior wall and grade beam orginal to house, my beam breaks it into 1/3 which is 1,100 on each of my post.
Could do a steel plate on top of slab to spread out the load of the post or could find a way to beef up the existing joists so you don't have to worry about new bearing on the slab.
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Old 05-19-2019, 06:16 PM   #25
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Re: 2x10 Span


What is that skinny little room between the bathroom and the bedroom?

A closet of some kind?

Andy.
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Old 05-19-2019, 06:19 PM   #26
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Re: 2x10 Span


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Slab appears solid in all places. My big concern is our expansive soils very wet years it swells, droughts shrinks and can move a ton of weight.

To me it seems a no brainer to do it now versus after if tile cracks and then floor heat has to come up as well.

Half day now versus 1 week down the road.

The slab may hold fine, what if it doesn't.

Would you do it?
Slab seems fine, I'd go with the engineer. The other thing is if you take the post footers down deeper, they aren't going to move with the rest of the foundation or slab. Maybe only a small effect here, but why go through trouble to possibly cause another problem.
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Old 05-19-2019, 06:25 PM   #27
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Re: 2x10 Span


Well, you don't want the new post to possibly punch a hole through the thin slab so dig the footer 24" deep, 16" x 16" and dowel into the exissting slab so they will move (if it even would) as one.

The post does not have to bear in the center of the footer either.

How did you come up with 1/3rd anyway? That don't make sense.

Andy
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Old 05-19-2019, 06:25 PM   #28
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Re: 2x10 Span


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What is that skinny little room between the bathroom and the bedroom?

A closet of some kind?

Andy.
No the wall on left is the wall in basement which is offset about 3' from wall in bathroom on first floor, the wall just to right of it is the 1st floor bathroom wall. Make sense?
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Old 05-19-2019, 06:27 PM   #29
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Re: 2x10 Span


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Originally Posted by ScipioAfricanus View Post
Well, you don't want the new post to possibly punch a hole through the thin slab so dig the footer 24" deep, 16" x 16" and dowel into the exissting slab so they will move (if it even would) as one.

How did you come up with 1/3rd anyway? That don't make sense.

Andy
I figured that the original two points of bearing are the exterior wall and grade beam which are 17' apart and total load is 8200#. I add a new beam mid span cutting the load into 1/3 since we introduce a new point of bearing? No?
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Old 05-19-2019, 06:31 PM   #30
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Re: 2x10 Span


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I figured that the original two points of bearing are the exterior wall and grade beam which are 17' apart and total load is 8200#. I add a new beam mid span cutting the load into 1/3 since we introduce a new point of bearing? No?
You introduced two new points of bearing, one point on either end of the new beam.

Andy
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Old 05-19-2019, 06:35 PM   #31
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Re: 2x10 Span


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I figured that the original two points of bearing are the exterior wall and grade beam which are 17' apart and total load is 8200#. I add a new beam mid span cutting the load into 1/3 since we introduce a new point of bearing? No?
No. The beam will carry half the load of the original span, no matter where it is located within that span.
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Old 05-19-2019, 06:36 PM   #32
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Re: 2x10 Span


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You introduced two new points of bearing, one point on either end of the new beam.

Andy
Makes sense. thanks,
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Old 05-19-2019, 07:13 PM   #33
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Re: 2x10 Span


Did you bring these points up to the engineer in regards to the soil?. Ask him if he knows a geotech that can shed some light. They won't verify without soil samples by perhaps tell you if you are being over concerned
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Old 05-19-2019, 07:45 PM   #34
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Re: 2x10 Span


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Did you bring these points up to the engineer in regards to the soil?. Ask him if he knows a geotech that can shed some light. They won't verify without soil samples by perhaps tell you if you are being over concerned
Oh yeah we talked about the slab, soils and even looked in furnace room at slab itself.

At the end of the day he is a licensed PE and deals with alot of remodels and is very aware of our expansive soils. I think I sometime worry too much but worrying also keeps me from doing something costly down the line, I am sure you can relate.
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Old 05-19-2019, 07:48 PM   #35
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Re: 2x10 Span


That's a trait of a good contractor
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Old 05-19-2019, 07:50 PM   #36
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Re: 2x10 Span


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Could do a steel plate on top of slab to spread out the load of the post or could find a way to beef up the existing joists so you don't have to worry about new bearing on the slab.
Part of my plan included doing that to spread load and I will also block joists every 4ft.
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Old 05-19-2019, 07:54 PM   #37
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Re: 2x10 Span


The way these work in expansive soils us part of the prep us getting enough gravel in before the slab to help isolate the slab and foundation from the soil movements, plus having a good water control plan for the site and the building.

It isn't just excess water that can cause a problem. The area under the center if the slab may stay moist almost all the time, but go into a protracted drought, and it may dry out. Then you can get slab cracks.

Pipes breaking, gutters not being kept up, poor sprinkler design, there are just a lot of ways things can go wrong with expansive soils. If it's 45 years old and in good shape, it seems they did it right when it was put in.
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Old 05-24-2019, 12:22 PM   #38
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Re: 2x10 Span


Korbel out from each basement wall with a 4x 6-8" ledger board to shorten the clear span ~7", cover with Crown if needed

Quick and Dirty install ROUGH sawn 2 x 6-8" under every other/third floor joist with many 4" + screws, paint, stain, caulk, as floor timber joists. Floor must be lifted/deflected up during install for the T- flanges to develop max load.

Out side the "box" hang the midway beam From the roof -attic ceiling space and the New big iron that crosses from outside walls with some 3/4 -7/8th all thread rods hidden in walls...no posts to plant in basement...

Check code/engineer with 1.25 thick subflooring products? on top of joists.
As a plywood box beam with 5/8 ths to 1" thick plywood glued and screwed to BOTTOM of joists. most likely to work IMHO

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