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Old 03-01-2015, 09:34 PM   #1
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Legalese Help


Going over an agreement that was sent to me. Pretty much cool with most things, but this raised an eyebrow:

WORK PRODUCT OWNERSHIP. Any copyrightable works, ideas, discoveries,
inventions, patents, products, or other information (collectively the "Work Product") developed in whole or in part by Easy in connection with the Services will be the exclusive property of Potential Customer. Upon request, Easy will execute all documents necessary to confirm or perfect the exclusive ownership of Potential Customer to the Work Product.


Is this normal? Am I being a baby for wanting this out of the agreement?
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Old 03-01-2015, 09:45 PM   #2
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Re: Legalese Help


Sounds like they don't want you to profit from pictures, plans, designs etc, that can/may evolve from the job.

Clients didn't bring up that you'll need some concrete boots when the job is over did they?...

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Old 03-01-2015, 09:48 PM   #3
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Re: Legalese Help


No, not yet. hah

I assumed that was what it was for, but I feel like if I were a good lawyer I could make a case that if I begin to develop a patent on a kneepad innovation while tiling their floor that the patent belongs to them.
I suppose I'm being paranoid and overly dramatic, but I ****ing hate lawyers and feeling like people are subtly taking advantage of me.
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Old 03-01-2015, 09:52 PM   #4
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Re: Legalese Help


Quote:
Originally Posted by Easy Gibson View Post
Going over an agreement that was sent to me. Pretty much cool with most things, but this raised an eyebrow:

WORK PRODUCT OWNERSHIP. Any copyrightable works, ideas, discoveries,
inventions, patents, products, or other information (collectively the "Work Product") developed in whole or in part by Easy in connection with the Services will be the exclusive property of Potential Customer. Upon request, Easy will execute all documents necessary to confirm or perfect the exclusive ownership of Potential Customer to the Work Product.


Is this normal? Am I being a baby for wanting this out of the agreement?


Interesting... well what are you building? I had a similar situation with a designer. Kept giving me chit about taking picts of process of the job. She kept saying that I could not publish them blah blah blah. wanted me to sign an agreement. I told her to pound sand contract was signed and my is my work until your paid in full. Stormed off like a 12year old.
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Old 03-01-2015, 09:59 PM   #5
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Re: Legalese Help


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Originally Posted by CITY DECKS INC View Post
Interesting... well what are you building? I had a similar situation with a designer. Kept giving me chit about taking picts of process of the job. She kept saying that I could not publish them blah blah blah. wanted me to sign an agreement. I told her to pound sand contract was signed and my is my work until your paid in full. Stormed off like a 12year old.
It's a commercial job in my town. I can't say much about it right now since nothing is set it stone yet and selfishly I really really want this one to come to life.
I feel like the lawyer may have just had this in his contract template.
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Old 03-02-2015, 12:32 AM   #6
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Re: Legalese Help


You're probably right about it being a general template, but so what? If they fund your development of a left-handed quark fueled widget, they're entitled to the rights on it.

If you already have one in your hip pocket and just slap it on the job, that clause gives them nothing.
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Old 03-02-2015, 01:17 AM   #7
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Re: Legalese Help


With no context, other than you want the job .... so it must be kind of cool

If it's not copy paste....

Sounds like they are trying to protect their "designs". Making sure you won't/can't legally directly copy the "design" for your benefit outside the scope of the contract.

You should get clarification on how you may display the images. Normally just referencing the designer and copy right type language is enough. The biggest benefit, of a cool job, is the pics showing off your work, imho.
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Old 03-02-2015, 08:16 AM   #8
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Re: Legalese Help


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Originally Posted by Tinstaafl View Post
You're probably right about it being a general template, but so what? If they fund your development of a left-handed quark fueled widget, they're entitled to the rights on it.

If you already have one in your hip pocket and just slap it on the job, that clause gives them nothing.
Maybe I'm still reading too much into this, but I'm honestly curious now if this would supposedly cover any though I hold in my head while I'm painting the place.

You'd be amazed and horrified if you knew where my mind went over the course of even one coat of primer. Give me a full commercial job and I'll likely park my mental rover on Mars, take a few core samples, and fly back to Earth before lunch. If I finalize the plans for my Unobtainium-Powered Thrust Sprocket in my head while I'm painting their wall are you telling me that they are entitled to the rights to it?
I always assumed my brain was my own property and that even if my body is contracted to perform work that I still get to keep the vault safe from vultures.

Man, I hate lawyers.
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Old 03-02-2015, 10:56 AM   #9
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Re: Legalese Help


Sounds like they are really proud of their color schemes. Generally, music, art, design, etc is automatically copyrighted, but you might have to prove it if push came to shove, so maybe they're just trying to cover all the bases.
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Old 03-02-2015, 11:24 AM   #10
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Re: Legalese Help


You have seen the SOW, Is there anything in that says to you WOW thats friggin cool?, No details needed if yes is the answer then thats your answer.
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Old 03-02-2015, 11:34 AM   #11
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Re: Legalese Help


Quote:
Originally Posted by Easy Gibson View Post
If I finalize the plans for my Unobtainium-Powered Thrust Sprocket in my head while I'm painting their wall are you telling me that they are entitled to the rights to it?
Not at all. You're being paid to paint, and using none of their resources to develop the concept.

Just don't miss a spot.
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Old 03-02-2015, 02:14 PM   #12
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Re: Legalese Help


I have seen something like that used with rest/bar/diner jobs. A unique decorating design is part of their "brand" . they dont want anyone to copy it.

Think its normal legalese in that field
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Old 03-02-2015, 04:01 PM   #13
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Re: Legalese Help


Easy..... Not sure of the scope of your services, but that is standard boilerplate often used in all/many contractor/employee contracts.

If you think about it in perhaps a different scope of work that might or more likely result in a patenable innovation.... for instance a contract
programmer, who might likely develope proprietary code.... well, that's what he is being paid to do... yes the company should own the product of his work, that they are paying him to do.
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Old 03-02-2015, 04:05 PM   #14
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Re: Legalese Help


Quote:
Originally Posted by Easy Gibson View Post
No, not yet. hah

I assumed that was what it was for, but I feel like if I were a good lawyer I could make a case that if I begin to develop a patent on a kneepad innovation while tiling their floor that the patent belongs to them.
I suppose I'm being paranoid and overly dramatic, but I ****ing hate lawyers and feeling like people are subtly taking advantage of me.
They own all IP you come up with during that job. Even a new knee pad design. Any sketches, drawings, designs, material lists whatever - it's theirs.

Yes, you're a baby for wanting out of the agreement.

Last edited by hdavis; 03-02-2015 at 04:22 PM. Reason: Easy's being a baby...
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Old 03-02-2015, 08:18 PM   #15
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Re: Legalese Help


I've had the day to think about it and it still doesn't sit right.

I probably won't make a big stink over it, but if I can get what is apparently a boilerplate line item removed, I'll feel better about it.

I want that widget patent, dammit.
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Old 03-02-2015, 08:36 PM   #16
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Re: Legalese Help


Can't wait to check out your new quark-fueled knee pad widget. I wonder, will it have a bottle opener?
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Old 03-03-2015, 03:22 PM   #17
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Re: Legalese Help


I would die laughing if I saw a flooring guy groan, rise to his feet, then pop a beer on his kneepad. It seems so natural. hah
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Old 05-17-2015, 11:06 AM   #18
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Re: Legalese Help


Whatever happened with this, Easy?
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Old 05-17-2015, 11:49 AM   #19
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Re: Legalese Help


Still working on hammering out my exact scope of the project, which has been stalled out due to massive structural issues. Half the joists were rotted at the brick sockets and were really only being held up by habit and the 7 layers of flooring that had more or less created a floating platform. Wild stuff.

As far as the agreement went, I more or less said I didn't want to sign any agreement like this and that I'd prefer working off my contract like I always do. They haven't brought it up again. My hands on portion won't start until the fall it's looking like.
Scope should be building two bars, painting entire establishment, trimming entire establishment, mounting any fixtures/drink rails/etc. Really looking forward to it in the fall. Hard to beat a 100 yard commute in cold weather.
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Old 05-17-2015, 02:10 PM   #20
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Re: Legalese Help


Quote:
Originally Posted by Easy Gibson View Post
Still working on hammering out my exact scope of the project, which has been stalled out due to massive structural issues. Half the joists were rotted at the brick sockets and were really only being held up by habit and the 7 layers of flooring that had more or less created a floating platform. Wild stuff.

As far as the agreement went, I more or less said I didn't want to sign any agreement like this and that I'd prefer working off my contract like I always do. They haven't brought it up again. My hands on portion won't start until the fall it's looking like.
Scope should be building two bars, painting entire establishment, trimming entire establishment, mounting any fixtures/drink rails/etc. Really looking forward to it in the fall. Hard to beat a 100 yard commute in cold weather.
If they insist about the agreement say that you'll be careful to turn off your brain while on the job, to avoid tempting their attorneys. No creativity allowed on their job.

I'd love being able to walk to and from work.

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