How To Pay And Time Manage Trade Contractors? - Business - Contractor Talk
View Poll Results: How do you pay trade contractors, for most projects?
Pay by Project 3 100.00%
Pay by Time and Materials 0 0%
Voters: 3. You may not vote on this poll

How To Pay And Time Manage Trade Contractors?

 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 02-07-2019, 04:43 PM   #1
Registered User
 
chicagogc2's Avatar
 
Trade: GC
Join Date: Feb 2019
Posts: 5
Rewards Points: 8

How To Pay And Time Manage Trade Contractors?


Hi,

I am relatively new to being a GC and wanted to get an idea about what technology others are using to pay and manage time for trade contractors?

Also, I also wanted to ask if most GC's pay trade contractors by project based or time/material based.
chicagogc2 is offline  

Warning: The topics covered on this site include activities in which there exists the potential for serious injury or death. ContractorTalk.com DOES NOT guarantee the accuracy or completeness of any information contained on this site. Always use proper safety precaution and reference reliable outside sources before attempting any construction or remodeling task!

   

Advertisement

 

Old 02-07-2019, 04:47 PM   #2
Registered User
 
chicagogc2's Avatar
 
Trade: GC
Join Date: Feb 2019
Posts: 5
Rewards Points: 8

Re: How To Pay And Time Manage Trade Contractors?


Hi,

I am relatively new to being a GC and wanted to get an idea about what technology others are using to pay and manage time for trade contractors?

Also, I also wanted to ask if most GC's pay trade contractors by project based or time/material based.

Advertisement

chicagogc2 is offline  
Old 02-07-2019, 06:33 PM   #3
Pro
 
jhark123's Avatar
 
Trade: Pro Cat Herder
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Enumclaw, WA
Posts: 2,499
Rewards Points: 1,692

Re: How To Pay And Time Manage Trade Contractors?


It's not an either/or to me. What trade knowledge/experience do you have? What are you building?
jhark123 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 02-07-2019, 08:01 PM   #4
Registered User
 
chicagogc2's Avatar
 
Trade: GC
Join Date: Feb 2019
Posts: 5
Rewards Points: 8

Re: How To Pay And Time Manage Trade Contractors?


Working on commercial office rehab and also residential rehab above 100k.

I tend to have hourly contractors and I’m not sure if I am costing myself more or less.
chicagogc2 is offline  
Old 02-07-2019, 08:02 PM   #5
Registered User
 
chicagogc2's Avatar
 
Trade: GC
Join Date: Feb 2019
Posts: 5
Rewards Points: 8

Re: How To Pay And Time Manage Trade Contractors?


When do you decide to use hourly versus project based?
chicagogc2 is offline  
Old 02-07-2019, 08:35 PM   #6
Capra aegagrus

 
Tinstaafl's Avatar
 
Trade: Remodeler
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Central Pennsylvania
Posts: 22,965
Rewards Points: 913

Re: How To Pay And Time Manage Trade Contractors?


If you're working 100K+ jobs, it's a little late to be asking strangers on the internet how to handle the finances.

Paying hourly or by the job is a judgement call. If you can trust the sub not to milk the hours, hourly is generally the fairest to both of you.

If instead you pay by the job, the sub is going to quote a CYA number that could be well in excess of what work is actually entailed.

There's no easy, one fits all answer to your question.
Tinstaafl is online now  
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Tinstaafl For This Useful Post:
Fouthgeneration (02-10-2019), griz (02-07-2019)
Old 02-07-2019, 11:38 PM   #7
Fire up the BBQ
 
griz's Avatar
 
Trade: GC
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: CA
Posts: 21,457
Rewards Points: 1,612

Re: How To Pay And Time Manage Trade Contractors?


i gave t&m jobs to guys i knew and trusted...

no deviation...

if it was a competitive bid job, i wanted hard numbers then held the guys feet to the fire to make sure he did everything in his section....
__________________
SOME JOBS JUST AREN'T WORTH DOING:
griz is offline  
Old 02-07-2019, 11:57 PM   #8
Pro
 
Xtrememtnbiker's Avatar
 
Trade: General Remodeling
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Virginia
Posts: 4,947
Rewards Points: 208

Re: How To Pay And Time Manage Trade Contractors?


We have recently started working for a GC who's primary work is higher end kitchen and baths. Everything has been T&M but I have also given them a quick ball park estimate just to see how it might turn out. It is always going to cost them less for T&M and it's just easier for everybody.

Our subs it depends on what's going on and the scope of it. Our mason and drywall guy are usually T&M, our floor guys and insulation guys are always a quote.

It depends on the scope of work and our relationship with the sub.
Xtrememtnbiker is offline  
Old 02-08-2019, 12:04 AM   #9
Pro
 
Stunt Carpenter's Avatar
 
Trade: Carpentry
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Airdrie
Posts: 1,384
Rewards Points: 1,526

Re: How To Pay And Time Manage Trade Contractors?


Once you have a relationship with a trade they sometimes will give you a price sheet for certain tasks that you do often. This way you know exactly what they are going to charge you without having the quote everything.

I have a price sheet for my plumber and electrican. My drywall guy is a minimum charge for small projects and then a sqft price after that. Nice to be able to bid with hard numbers.
Stunt Carpenter is online now  
Old 02-08-2019, 01:21 AM   #10
Pro
 
TheConstruct's Avatar
 
Trade: Carpentry
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: Kamloops BC
Posts: 445
Rewards Points: 816

Re: How To Pay And Time Manage Trade Contractors?


I do both subcontract work for builders and occasionally hire subs for my own jobs. I prefer T&M in both cases.
TheConstruct is offline  
Old 02-08-2019, 04:51 PM   #11
Pro
 
Fishindude's Avatar
 
Trade: Industrial
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Indiana
Posts: 357
Rewards Points: 756

Re: How To Pay And Time Manage Trade Contractors?


Get a quote for them prior to starting the work. Pay them when complete or monthly based upon what percentage of the work is complete to date.

Only give a sub a T&M deal if you client is okay with paying T&M for them. Some subs are great but when they work T&M you wind up paying for their time on cell phone, etc., and jobs drag out longer.
Fishindude is offline  
Old 02-09-2019, 08:32 AM   #12
Pro
 
woodspike's Avatar
 
Trade: remodeling
Join Date: Dec 2018
Location: miami
Posts: 165
Rewards Points: 428

Re: How To Pay And Time Manage Trade Contractors?


really matters ( to me) if that sub is actually the guy on the job ,doing the work , or at least being there all the time
if he`s doing T&M , and he doesn`t always have the same guy/s on each job , or he has new guys , those guys could slack , or take longer than needed.they have no loyalty to you
only way i do a t&m is if the guy gave us an aprox. outside cost ( not to exceed )

also it helps if you really know your trade , and what these subs are actually doing ,so you can come onto the site and realize if things are dragging or not.

also it helps if you really know your trade , and what these subs are actually doing ,so you can come onto the site and realize if things are dragging or not.

thats not a typo , i just wanted to repeat that.

also , i do`t agree someone is going to give a totally absurd "CYA" over the top cost
thats why you get 2 or 3 bids
sorry even if i know a sub well , i still now and again check his prices against others . just to keep them honest , and also just to keep me from knowing i`m not making a fool of myself.

i`m in miami , i do tend to not trust as much
nature of the beast
woodspike is offline  
The Following User Says Thank You to woodspike For This Useful Post:
MarkJames (02-09-2019)
Old 02-09-2019, 08:51 AM   #13
Capra aegagrus

 
Tinstaafl's Avatar
 
Trade: Remodeler
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Central Pennsylvania
Posts: 22,965
Rewards Points: 913

Re: How To Pay And Time Manage Trade Contractors?


Quote:
Originally Posted by woodspike View Post
also , i do`t agree someone is going to give a totally absurd "CYA" over the top cost
thats why you get 2 or 3 bids
Didn't mean to imply the CYA would necessarily be absurd. But if you consistently give firm bids based on precisely how long you think a job will take and exactly what the material costs will be, you're a heckuva lot better at this game than I.
Tinstaafl is online now  
Old 02-09-2019, 09:14 AM   #14
Registered User
 
Platesurfer's Avatar
 
Trade: Carpenter
Join Date: Feb 2019
Posts: 8
Rewards Points: 16

Re: How To Pay And Time Manage Trade Contractors?


Around here its almost all by the job or sq ft. Thats just how the more experienced subs seem to operate.

Sent from my LG-H812 using Tapatalk
Platesurfer is offline  
Old 02-09-2019, 11:22 AM   #15
Pro
 
cwatbay's Avatar
 
Trade: Electrical Contractor
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: San Carlos, California
Posts: 1,377
Rewards Points: 2,406

Re: How To Pay And Time Manage Trade Contractors?


Maybe because we just work commercial (98%). But I would say all the major trades like: electrical, HVAC, plumbing, Grading, Foundations, etc are all bids. No T and M.

The only time I rarely see T and M is when a contractor is hiring some off the books hacks for painting touch up, cleaning and a few minor jobs on the project. Usually these are cash only guys and the GC is trying to get by on the cheap. And, from what I have seen, these cash guys are always trying to pad their hours.
cwatbay is offline  
Old 02-09-2019, 12:12 PM   #16
Pro
 
B.Johnson's Avatar
 
Trade: Builder
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: SE Michigan
Posts: 1,290
Rewards Points: 2,254

Re: How To Pay And Time Manage Trade Contractors?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Tinstaafl View Post
Didn't mean to imply the CYA would necessarily be absurd. But if you consistently give firm bids based on precisely how long you think a job will take and exactly what the material costs will be, you're going to be out of business before long.
I really thought that this is where you were going.
__________________
Home Designer Series Software
B.Johnson is online now  
The Following User Says Thank You to B.Johnson For This Useful Post:
Tinstaafl (02-09-2019)
Old 02-09-2019, 02:22 PM   #17
Pro
 
Stunt Carpenter's Avatar
 
Trade: Carpentry
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Airdrie
Posts: 1,384
Rewards Points: 1,526

Re: How To Pay And Time Manage Trade Contractors?


Quote:
Originally Posted by woodspike View Post
really matters ( to me) if that sub is actually the guy on the job ,doing the work , or at least being there all the time

if he`s doing T&M , and he doesn`t always have the same guy/s on each job , or he has new guys , those guys could slack , or take longer than needed.they have no loyalty to you

only way i do a t&m is if the guy gave us an aprox. outside cost ( not to exceed )



also it helps if you really know your trade , and what these subs are actually doing ,so you can come onto the site and realize if things are dragging or not.



also it helps if you really know your trade , and what these subs are actually doing ,so you can come onto the site and realize if things are dragging or not.



thats not a typo , i just wanted to repeat that.



also , i do`t agree someone is going to give a totally absurd "CYA" over the top cost

thats why you get 2 or 3 bids

sorry even if i know a sub well , i still now and again check his prices against others . just to keep them honest , and also just to keep me from knowing i`m not making a fool of myself.



i`m in miami , i do tend to not trust as much

nature of the beast


It really matters to me also that my subs are actually the guy on site. I think it also matters to my customers. I usually mention it during the first meeting
Stunt Carpenter is online now  
Old 02-09-2019, 04:54 PM   #18
Geometrist

 
Warren's Avatar
 
Trade: framing/remodeling
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: NE Ohio
Posts: 10,015
Rewards Points: 251

Re: How To Pay And Time Manage Trade Contractors?


Most of the remodel jobs we do are T&M. This allows the job to start before all of the decisions are made. Lots of well off customers want to start quickly, and are not interested in making most of the decisions early in the job. T&M allows them flexibility with the build process, and allows the subs to provide the very best job without sweating every hour worked towards their bid number.
,
Early in my business, we only used T&M on "extras". These days, at least half of my work is done this way. We have even framed houses by the hour when they were started, but without completed plans.
__________________
I'd love to replace all the dumbness in this room but the budget is tight and the stupidity is plentiful!

Easy Gibson
Warren is online now  
The Following User Says Thank You to Warren For This Useful Post:
Xtrememtnbiker (02-09-2019)
Old 02-10-2019, 07:00 PM   #19
Registered User
 
chicagogc2's Avatar
 
Trade: GC
Join Date: Feb 2019
Posts: 5
Rewards Points: 8

Re: How To Pay And Time Manage Trade Contractors?


Great feedback from everyone!

For T & M tracking are there any good software suggestions that use SMS/Mobile app and are easy for any trade contractor to use?

I have had trouble getting my trade contractors to use basic time tracking software. I really wanted to see if there was something that was SMS driven for simplicity.
chicagogc2 is offline  
Old 02-10-2019, 10:46 PM   #20
Pro
 
Fouthgeneration's Avatar
 
Trade: Masonry
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Mid west
Posts: 2,191
Rewards Points: 7,831

Re: How To Pay And Time Manage Trade Contractors?


Installiing spy gear in space that is totally demoed is going to be tough...

Remember if YOU micro-mange the subs, YOU have to PAY their PAYROLL taxes.

WIth time and Material Subs you are only a hop and skip from being the straight up employer, with all the payroll and with holding mandates.....

It sounds to me you want BOTH sides of your biscuit buttered....

Trust, But verify......IF you can't be there, hire some one YOU TRUST to watch them work (elderly, disabled, pregnant, and or college student)

Are you paying a fair wage for night and evening shifts? overtime?

Is the job tougher then normal? Demo is dirty, noisy, and inconvenient, even to the neighbors, pretending it isn't is silly.

Advertisement

__________________
I might be an Idiot, but I know things that You don't: Please wait till after you get my know-how to insult me....
Fouthgeneration is offline  


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Join Now... It's Fast and FREE!

I am a professional contractor
I am a DIY Homeowner
Drywall Talk is for
PROFESSIONAL CONTRACTORS ONLY!

At DrywallTalk.com we cater exlusivly to professional contractors who make their living as a contractor. Knowing that many homeowners and DIYers are looking for a community to call home, we've created www.DIYChatroom.com DIY Chatroom is full of helpful advices and perfect for DIY homeowners.

Redirecing in 10 seconds
No Thanks
terms of service

Already Have an Account?