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Am I Asking For Too Much? (Not So Much A Pricing Question...)

 
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Old 06-15-2020, 03:26 PM   #1
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Am I Asking For Too Much? (Not So Much A Pricing Question...)


My girlfriend owns a small cottage a state over from here. It's older, cottage framed etc etc. It needs a roof, and she's asked my advice. I can't do it for two reasons-1) I'm not licensed there, 2) I've got torn rotator cuffs in both shoulders.
Roof is 12 square, 5" pitch, single story

So, I'm a little old school- I advise

Tearing the old shingles (2 layers)off

Inspect the original sheathing, repair as necessary

Sheath over the original sheathing with 1/2" OSB-( we'll get to the why in a minute). I want the OSB nailed down to the 2x8 rafters with 8d galvanized, but will settle for commons, ends of sheets to be screwed down to existing sheathing with 1-1/2" weather resistant screws

Then, course of ice and water, then remainder of roof to be covered in #30 lb felt, then GAF Timberlines or equivalent
Install shingle over ridge vent
Done

As to the why- As said, a cottage, framed with re-used barn materials. Rafters are 20" on center- the why behind screwing the ends of the OSB down
The original sheathing is random width, square edge 1x, butted up tight, sound everywhere I could reach in the attic, but still, full of nail holes- thus the reason for the OSB sheath over.I figured to run the OSB flush to the rakes,prime the edge and apply a PVC moulding.

And, the first roofer she talked to told her I was crazy, and theres no way that any roofer would do what I asked. Also wanted way too much money, which p***ed me off no end

So, what do you guys think? am I asking for too much?
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Old 06-15-2020, 05:12 PM   #2
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Re: Am I Asking For Too Much? (Not So Much A Pricing Question...)


Let's see what part is odd.

Strip 2 layers - code required a lot of places.

Deck over with 1/2" OSB - done all the time on skip sheathed roofs. Probably not that often in New England.

Screw sheathing edges- never seen that on a roof. That's a productivity killer.

I&W shield - 2 rows required by code here

30 lb felt - most have switched to synthetic.

You say 5" pitch, I'm assuming that 5" in 12".

In a case like yours, I'm assuming you sheathing concern us about nail withdrawal. Sheathing for that us typically 3/8" ply or 7/16" OSB. 20" span is not too much for the typical board decking I see around here.

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Old 06-15-2020, 05:12 PM   #3
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Re: Am I Asking For Too Much? (Not So Much A Pricing Question...)


Nothing really jumps out at me as being unreasonable.

Sheathing over boards is pretty common, both on buildings, like you have, and when switching from skip sheathing to solid.

30# felt can tend to telegraph wrinkles a little more than 15#, but a competent roofer should be able to deal with it.

Screwing the edges, is my opinion, not critical, but if it's what you want, it shouldn't be a problem to do it that way.

Call another roofer.
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Old 06-15-2020, 05:21 PM   #4
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Re: Am I Asking For Too Much? (Not So Much A Pricing Question...)


Sounds like you have provided some specs to get a quality job.

Screwing the edges of the osb is no big deal.

Like 7delta said. Call another roofer.
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Old 06-15-2020, 06:35 PM   #5
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Re: Am I Asking For Too Much? (Not So Much A Pricing Question...)


The only thing I see slightly out of the ordinary is screwing off the edges of the new sheathing. But on such a small roof, what's the big deal to have a $15 an hour helper spend a couple of hours driving screws? Only gonna make the thing stronger.


Find another roofer. You got yourself a lazy one not smart enough to just simply charge the right price to do the job the way you want it.
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Old 06-24-2020, 07:53 AM   #6
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Re: Am I Asking For Too Much? (Not So Much A Pricing Question...)


Is the structure sound as is? Decking over the old deck is fine, but the existing rafters @ 20" centers creates a PITA and a potentially large waste factor if looking to break butt ends on rafter centers. That's not a big deal, but it costs more. Stripping hundreds of roofs followed by sheathing over skipped decking with often odd spaced rafters, we weren't concerned with breaking the plywood (or OSB) on rafters. The sheathing is being provided primarily as a nailing deck. It will add structural support and is nailed through rafters, but that was not the reason for the deck over. Consider if that is part of the cost and if it is worth it.



As far as the rest of the job you are at the mercy of the local contracting community just like every other retail customer, except you hopefully know how to check someone's references a little better. A competent contractor with very good references probably knows what they are doing. They should entertain your specifications or be convincing enough to steer you in another direction.
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Old 06-24-2020, 08:11 AM   #7
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Re: Am I Asking For Too Much? (Not So Much A Pricing Question...)


Specs sound reasonable

Too bad its 20” instead 19.2” spacing but it isn’t that hard to trim a stack of osb
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Old 06-24-2020, 02:55 PM   #8
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Re: Am I Asking For Too Much? (Not So Much A Pricing Question...)


I'd use 10ds instead of 8ds because you're going over 1x in addition to the 1/2" OSB. Also a tidbit regarding roof sheathing. In areas that get tornadoes and hurricanes it's been well established that using ring shank nails is very effective at preventing the sheathing from blowing off..........
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Old 06-25-2020, 09:44 AM   #9
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Re: Am I Asking For Too Much? (Not So Much A Pricing Question...)


I would jump on this job in a heartbeat if I lived anywhere near you. Nothing at all unreasonable about what you are looking for. You might get some debate about screws versus ring-shanks for sheathing edges, but being only a 12SQ roof, I would give the customer exactly what they asked for. (If it were 120SQ I might try to talk you into using ring-shanks just for productivity sake.)
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Old 06-25-2020, 09:51 PM   #10
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Re: Am I Asking For Too Much? (Not So Much A Pricing Question...)


ring shanks for the OSB. I think they would be less likely to split the wood underneath-screws tend to do that and it's MUCH faster.
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Old 06-25-2020, 11:11 PM   #11
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Re: Am I Asking For Too Much? (Not So Much A Pricing Question...)


Quote:
Originally Posted by Carpenter Mark View Post
My girlfriend owns a small cottage a state over from here. It's older, cottage framed etc etc. It needs a roof, and she's asked my advice. I can't do it for two reasons-1) I'm not licensed there, 2) I've got torn rotator cuffs in both shoulders.

Roof is 12 square, 5" pitch, single story



So, I'm a little old school- I advise



Tearing the old shingles (2 layers)off



Inspect the original sheathing, repair as necessary



Sheath over the original sheathing with 1/2" OSB-( we'll get to the why in a minute). I want the OSB nailed down to the 2x8 rafters with 8d galvanized, but will settle for commons, ends of sheets to be screwed down to existing sheathing with 1-1/2" weather resistant screws



Then, course of ice and water, then remainder of roof to be covered in #30 lb felt, then GAF Timberlines or equivalent

Install shingle over ridge vent

Done



As to the why- As said, a cottage, framed with re-used barn materials. Rafters are 20" on center- the why behind screwing the ends of the OSB down

The original sheathing is random width, square edge 1x, butted up tight, sound everywhere I could reach in the attic, but still, full of nail holes- thus the reason for the OSB sheath over.I figured to run the OSB flush to the rakes,prime the edge and apply a PVC moulding.



And, the first roofer she talked to told her I was crazy, and theres no way that any roofer would do what I asked. Also wanted way too much money, which p***ed me off no end



So, what do you guys think? am I asking for too much?
Nobody is going to screw down the edges of your sheets. Nailed to rafters with ring shanks and on the edges is sufficient

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Old 06-25-2020, 11:50 PM   #12
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Re: Am I Asking For Too Much? (Not So Much A Pricing Question...)


Quote:
Originally Posted by A&E Exteriors View Post
Nobody is going to screw down the edges of your sheets. Nailed to rafters with ring shanks and on the edges is sufficient

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they WILL screw them down if i spec it that way...
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Old 06-26-2020, 04:46 AM   #13
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Re: Am I Asking For Too Much? (Not So Much A Pricing Question...)


I don't think you're asking too much, as long as you are willing to pay for what you want. Don't expect to pay for a "blow and go" roof, with your specs.

I'm not near there, but if that's what the customer wants, as long as it's not wrong, I'll do it. And charge for it.

I'll bet it's been 20 years since I used 30# felt. Synthetic took over a long time ago.

If you insisted on GAF shingles, I would add a disclaimer to my contract. They've had some issues and, in my opinion, they don't stand behind their product.
I've seen 3 roofs with GAF shingles. Because they sell them at HD, some contractors use them.
So, 3 roofs, about 8 years old. All of them had huge sheets of shingles coming up. When I say sheets, I'm talking about 8' x 8' sections. The shingles just weren't sealing down, after 8 years. They were fine, at the time of install.
I was there, when a customer was on the phone with GAF. They told him it was a 30 year warranty on the shingle and 5 year warranty on the sealant. Just because the shingle was laying on the ground (blown off) doesn't mean the shingle is bad. "There is nothing wrong with the shingle, it's a sealant failure." Only 5 year warranty on the sealant.
Out of 3 customers only one got anything. He has a 40 square roof. They sent him 20 square of shingles and a check for $12,000. Who knows how much he spent on his lawyer, to get it.
The other 2, got nothing.

Long post for, find another roofer.
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Old 06-26-2020, 05:36 AM   #14
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Re: Am I Asking For Too Much? (Not So Much A Pricing Question...)


Marry the Girl and then you could be joint owner of the house. Get shoulder surgery and then to the roof yourself.
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Old 06-26-2020, 10:59 AM   #15
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Re: Am I Asking For Too Much? (Not So Much A Pricing Question...)


Quote:
Originally Posted by griz View Post
they WILL screw them down if i spec it that way...
You wouldn't pay what I would charge you to do it... This is absolutely 100% an asinine request

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Old 06-26-2020, 11:01 AM   #16
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Re: Am I Asking For Too Much? (Not So Much A Pricing Question...)


GAF sucks donkey richard

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Last edited by A&E Exteriors; 06-26-2020 at 11:04 AM.
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Old 06-26-2020, 11:03 AM   #17
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Re: Am I Asking For Too Much? (Not So Much A Pricing Question...)


All this for a 12sq cottage?

What kind of Mico managing @$$hole are you anyway.

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Old 06-26-2020, 11:03 AM   #18
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Re: Am I Asking For Too Much? (Not So Much A Pricing Question...)


And, the first roofer she talked to told her I was crazy, and theres no way that any roofer would do what I asked. Also wanted way too much money, which p***ed me off no end

Did you guys miss the part where he complained about the price? Custom work requires an upcharge that many are unwilling to pay. You can't ask for extra's while refusing to pay for the basics.
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Old 06-26-2020, 12:27 PM   #19
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Re: Am I Asking For Too Much? (Not So Much A Pricing Question...)


Quote:
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And, the first roofer she talked to told her I was crazy, and theres no way that any roofer would do what I asked. Also wanted way too much money, which p***ed me off no end

Did you guys miss the part where he complained about the price? Custom work requires an upcharge that many are unwilling to pay. You can't ask for extra's while refusing to pay for the basics.
He hit her with the "I don't want this little POS job" price

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Old 06-26-2020, 07:42 PM   #20
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Re: Am I Asking For Too Much? (Not So Much A Pricing Question...)


I think the head will pull through the osb long before a ring shank will pull out. Even before a coated smooth nail for that matter, maybe/maybe not 5/8” but 1/2 and 7/16 for sure.

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