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Portland, ME Residential

 
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Old 12-27-2009, 12:37 PM   #81
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Re: Portland, ME Residential


Hey Duke

Between you, Tim, Lone and a couple others...I see a visually based structural wood-framing text book in the works.
Great looking job.
Thanks for sharing.
I find myself drawn to each picture - weird huh?

take care

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Old 12-27-2009, 01:26 PM   #82
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Re: Portland, ME Residential


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Is that steel beams I see?
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Old 12-27-2009, 03:42 PM   #83
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Re: Portland, ME Residential


So, is it just me , or did you hang the plywood inside of the garage. Maybe i am just seeing it wrong in the picture.
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Old 12-27-2009, 04:23 PM   #84
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Re: Portland, ME Residential


Here in Nebraska the wall seperating the house and garage is considered an exterior wall and has to be sheathed. Most garages are not heated so....it kinda is outside.
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Old 12-27-2009, 04:34 PM   #85
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Re: Portland, ME Residential


Same here is WA most garage walls shared with the house are sheathed.
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Old 12-27-2009, 06:19 PM   #86
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Re: Portland, ME Residential


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Is that steel beams I see?
Yes, to clear span the garage. They do this often around here to keep the posts out of the garage.

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Originally Posted by FRAMERBEN View Post
So, is it just me , or did you hang the plywood inside of the garage. Maybe i am just seeing it wrong in the picture.
Plywood in garage, of course. I'm at least following the prescriptive method.
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Old 12-27-2009, 08:09 PM   #87
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Re: Portland, ME Residential


Everything is crisp..

I gave you sh!t a couple years ago about framing a whole house to a 1/16th....well, keep it up and the weather out, and I might believe you!

Nice Work!
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Old 12-27-2009, 08:36 PM   #88
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Re: Portland, ME Residential


Quote:
Originally Posted by wallmaxx View Post
Hey Duke

Between you, Tim, Lone and a couple others...I see a visually based structural wood-framing text book in the works.
That's what I was thinking. I have been quietly following the thread and am very impressed too. About page 2 I thought that this has the makings of a book.

Keep it coming Kent!
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Old 12-27-2009, 09:36 PM   #89
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Re: Portland, ME Residential


looking good. I wish we were as far as you. We have all our walls framed except for two garages. But were taking a week off for the holiday
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Old 12-29-2009, 06:58 AM   #90
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Re: Portland, ME Residential


i see that steel beam over the garage. whats the purpose for a steel beam in a residental home? strength to the structure?

my friends home has a steel beam and the house was built back in the 70s. i was curious what the reason for having one is.
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Old 12-29-2009, 09:23 AM   #91
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Re: Portland, ME Residential


We use steel beams in almost all garages around here that are for more than one car. I do wonder why those are on top of the wall and not dropped. I will wait for an update to see how you attach the joists.
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Old 12-29-2009, 10:30 AM   #92
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Re: Portland, ME Residential


on top of the wall and not dropped

"Dropped" would be a sin punishable by death, for this project. Everything is to be flush or raised, so that every ceiling everywhere, can be flat.

The owner or the architect must want the inside to look clean, sort of like CIA HQ in Langley.
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Old 12-29-2009, 07:02 PM   #93
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Re: Portland, ME Residential


Quote:
Originally Posted by WNYcarpenter View Post
Everything is crisp..

I gave you sh!t a couple years ago about framing a whole house to a 1/16th....well, keep it up and the weather out, and I might believe you!

Nice Work!
Sorry, I don't remember you giving me ****. I deserve it most of the time though

When I square my floor, 1/16" diagonal measurement over the whole house is my goal and I usually get at least within 1/8". It really makes it nice when things are perfectly square. Things work the way they're supposed to.

My floors I bring out the optical builders level and usually end up with an 1/8" to 1/4" level everywhere. My system of as close to square and level as possible, while a PITA in the beginning, makes my life easy when I am cutting rafters, beams, layout, plates.....it affects everything.

Everyone's system works for them. Mine works for me. I tell everyone who works for me that it's my system on my job and the next guy they work for, they better listen to that guy and do what they want, not say "well Kent did it this way".

Quote:
Originally Posted by XteriorCreation View Post
i see that steel beam over the garage. whats the purpose for a steel beam in a residental home? strength to the structure?

my friends home has a steel beam and the house was built back in the 70s. i was curious what the reason for having one is.
The steel beam is to span the distance of the garage so you don't have any posts in the middle of your garage. When I lived in Seattle, we always had a PT 6x6 in the garage holding up usually a glulam. I can't ever recall putting in steel until I moved back here. It's usually only the garage.

Quote:
Originally Posted by knucklehead View Post
We use steel beams in almost all garages around here that are for more than one car. I do wonder why those are on top of the wall and not dropped. I will wait for an update to see how you attach the joists.
Well, I wondered that myself. All of the beams are flush per designer. I saw your post today at break time and double checked my plans just in case, before I let the guys do this....



The beam gets padded out with (4) 2x12's that fit inside the web. It comes predrilled. It's still a PITA. It took a long time to pad these out. The steel is a W12x26.

Quote:
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on top of the wall and not dropped

"Dropped" would be a sin punishable by death, for this project. Everything is to be flush or raised, so that every ceiling everywhere, can be flat.

The owner or the architect must want the inside to look clean, sort of like CIA HQ in Langley.
I like this look also, but at the same time, this can and may cause problems. Electrical may not be too big of a problem, but if there is ductwork, which there is on this home, it could cause some problems with finding room for the runs. Plumbing, I don't know enough yet, but I'm trying to keep FJ's out of the way of toilets and showers. How to get a 4" waste pipe down to the basement......don't know. Beams everywhere.
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Old 12-29-2009, 07:18 PM   #94
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Re: Portland, ME Residential


Framerman, that web packing detail is exactly how we do most flush beams around here. Issues that we have incurred were
1. nails through the doubles touching the steel and rubbing. It's amazing how a very small amount of movement will make such a racket.
2. The lumber shrinking slightly in thickness, leaving a small margin of "play" in the through bolt, also causing annoying "chirps".
3. Bumps in the sub-floor above if there is no margin between the top of steel and bottom of subfloor, caused by joist shrinkage. We try to allow at least 1/2" "float" above the steel to allow for lumber shrinkage, unless there is a bearing wall above. Point loads are typically let through the subfloor for direct bearing on the steel.
4. Finally, errant nailing through the subfloor into the steel flange. The nails typically shank off sideways and become an annoying squeek later.


I'm sure you're aware of these issues already, but thought it might be helpful to others following the thread.
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Last edited by loneframer; 12-29-2009 at 07:22 PM.
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Old 12-29-2009, 07:25 PM   #95
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Re: Portland, ME Residential


The lumber truck came Thursday. After the steel I-beams were set, I went inside and heard this big crash



Here is the lifting of one of many beams. I put this up myself. A few years back I had a similar size beam we were putting up and I was helping this kid put it up. He struggled with it, adrenaline pumped through him and he hauled it off the other end of the wall. 18 stitches on my face, broke my nose, fractured my eye socket.

Lift one end up on the wall. Half the weight. Once up, tack it to the top plate so it can hinge as you put up the other end.



I'm tall enough I can reach the top of the 8' ladder. I know you short guys can't, I'm sorry for you being short.



Walk up the ladder, put the beam on your shoulder of choice and move it 6". The bottom of the beam should lay at least halfway on the top of the plate. Rolling something like this is easy, but also, you need caution. Roll it too far and off it goes, into the basement, and you look like a fool. Tack it down when done so it doesn't roll over on you. Piece of cake.



Another beam perpendicular into it.



We got rained out soon after, and then this happened. While it doesn't look like a whole bunch of snow, it was wet, and slushy. Now it's frozen to the floor. About 1/2" to 3/4" of ice.



This is towards the end of the day. You can see the beams I have going here and I still have more. It was fricken' cold today. About 10 to 15 with 20-30 mph winds, gusts to 50. Wind chill was -10F to -20F. Tomorrow is supposed to be even worse and New Yeas Day, a potential storm of the century, like 2' of snow. Wonderful.



If you're wondering about interior walls, you need to be patient. I could explain it, but you just won't believe it until I show you. Hang tight, a week or two and I'll explain.
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Old 12-29-2009, 07:30 PM   #96
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Re: Portland, ME Residential


Quote:
Originally Posted by loneframer View Post
Framerman, that web packing detail is exactly how we do most flush beams around here. Issues that we have incurred were
1. nails through the doubles touching the steel and rubbing. It's amazing how a very small amount of movement will make such a racket.
2. The lumber shrinking slightly in thickness, leaving a small margin of "play" in the through bolt, also causing annoying "chirps".
3. Bumps in the sub-floor above if there is no margin between the top of steel and bottom of subfloor, caused by joist shrinkage. We try to allow at least 1/2" "float" above the steel to allow for lumber shrinkage, unless there is a bearing wall above. Point loads are typically let through the subfloor for direct bearing on the steel.
4. Finally, errant nailing through the subfloor into the steel flange. The nails typically shank off sideways and become an annoying squeek later.


I'm sure you're aware of these issues already, but thought it might be helpful to others following the thread.
I believe the steel was 12-1/4" or 12-3/8" tall, so we dropped it one plate and have somewhere around 1/4" to 1/2" above the top of the beam. I needed reminding on the other things you said. I have to talk with the guys tomorrow about that. I have this feeling.....
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Old 12-29-2009, 07:46 PM   #97
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Re: Portland, ME Residential


Quote:
Originally Posted by framerman View Post
I believe the steel was 12-1/4" or 12-3/8" tall, so we dropped it one plate and have somewhere around 1/4" to 1/2" above the top of the beam. I needed reminding on the other things you said. I have to talk with the guys tomorrow about that. I have this feeling.....
I've had that feeling too. I finally gave up on nailing the "sandwich" entirely. instead I use a half-a-case of subfloor adhesive and rely on only the bolts and glue. As for the sub-floor, I always mark out the steel location while setting sheets with a lumber crayon, chalk or even marking paint. We used to do many double plywood floors and always managed to nail a few in the red zone somehow. They're a pain to locate if they're in the first layer.
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Old 12-29-2009, 08:28 PM   #98
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Re: Portland, ME Residential


You seem to do things the same as we do here in Northern Illinois. I do have a couple questions. When you cut your cripple studs that go next to your king studs at the window openings, how do you get them tight? Do you measure each header seperately to account for lumber sizing differences? I only ask because we used to nail the header flush with the top of the king stud and after the whole wall was framed, we would go back and indivually measure, cut and install all the cripple studs. Just wondering if there is a better way. I'm always trying to learn.
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Old 12-29-2009, 08:32 PM   #99
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Re: Portland, ME Residential


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You seem to do things the same as we do here in Northern Illinois. I do have a couple questions. When you cut your cripple studs that go next to your king studs at the window openings, how do you get them tight? Do you measure each header seperately to account for lumber sizing differences? I only ask because we used to nail the header flush with the top of the king stud and after the whole wall was framed, we would go back and indivually measure, cut and install all the cripple studs. Just wondering if there is a better way. I'm always trying to learn.
Header flush with top of king stud/top plate. If there's a gap, I use my own custom made shims from a jig I made for my table saw. I essentially make hem/fir shims. Cedar really shouldn't be used in bearing situations.
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Old 12-29-2009, 08:33 PM   #100
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Re: Portland, ME Residential


It will be alot easier to clean out all that weather without the inside walls in the way. I would prop something under that long header temporarily just to keep the sag out of it. Just sayin.

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