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New Walls

 
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Old 01-11-2019, 12:55 PM   #1
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New Walls


Hi everyone,


I'm helping my brother re-frame his second story interior walls. I typically don't frame walls in existing structures so I wanted to get some opinions/options.

From what I've checked out, non of the interior walls are load bearing, it's a truss roof 24 oc. The walls are actually 1 5/8 x 1 5/8 steel studs.

He lives in a semi-detach so he shares one wall with his neighbor.
The house was built in 74 and I believe the builder probably chose such a small stud size to save a buck given that there was no concern with load bearing.

we will be changing out the subfloor as well, the floor is 5/8 T&G Ply but actually measures at 1/2. the subfloors really weak the deflection between floor joists is really weak, sheeting over it isn't an option.

Most walls fall perpendicular to the joists only two walls need blocking. joists are 16 OC

Regarding the new wall framing, because there is no room to box frame the walls and lift them in place,

1) does it make sense to stick frame the walls one piece at a time?

2) Should I keep a double top plate or would single plate be sufficient

3) Out of plumb exterior walls, should I keep the wall end plumb, or follow the irregularity at the wall end?

4) attach the top and bottom plates, and toenail each stud inbetween, 2x4 wall nailing schedule 2 nails per side top and bottom?

any suggestions would be great.
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Old 01-11-2019, 02:01 PM   #2
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Re: New Walls


Since you are new here, and I know nothing about you, and you are asking some pretty basic questions, I will ask you something.

What type of Contractor are you? You say you don't frame interior walls, so what kind of work DO you do?

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Old 01-11-2019, 02:47 PM   #3
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Re: New Walls


Hi there, thanks for the reply

I'm part owner of Hardscape/Fence and shed company. the walls that we build are stood up, not framed by toe nailing. Although Iv'e built partition walls in the past, it's typically one wall not a whole redo of a second floor interior framing

Sure I'd agree it's basic questions, but like I mentioned I don't frame more than a partition wall in an already built structure, and this is for my younger brother, I'd rather not be blamed for the rest of my life that I steered him down a bad direction and wasted unnecessary time.

My plan of action was to remove the existing steel stud walls, remove the bad subfloor, resheet the floor. and start at my longest interior wall. as far as the two exterior walls being out of plumb, I was just going to follow the irregularity so that drywall has something to anchor to properly.

I was going to double top plate the walls, even though it's non load bearing to provide overlapping at corners. I just wanted to see if this was necessary.

I was just hoping to get some further insight form anyone who has either been in a situation where most if not all walls in a house are being reframed and what short-cuts, or best practices get the job done right.

Thanks.
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Old 01-11-2019, 03:00 PM   #4
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Re: New Walls


Thanks for responding.

With the exterior walls being out of plumb, your end stud will be out of plumb as well.

Yes, it should follow the wall. This means that top and bottom plates will be different lengths. This is the best way to tackle this.

Single top plates are fine for interior non-bearing walls, however, the easiest solution in your case would be to attach the topmost top plate to the ceiling, frame your wall on the deck with one top plate, (if you have room), and stand the wall right beside your already attached top plate. Then using the framing sledge slide your wall over and under your top most top plate.

On the other hand, if there is no room to frame on the deck, there is nothing wrong with stick framing each stud in one at a time. Sometimes, it's the only way to get it done.

If you install a thicker subfloor, your wall height will change. You might have to trim all your studs down a little. Gang cut them if you can.
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Old 01-11-2019, 03:30 PM   #5
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Re: New Walls


Definitely hadn't thought about installing the second top plate first and stand the wall to it. That's exactly why this was worth putting out there. Now if the ceiling truss and the floor joists are not in parallel, is it ok to shim the connection at the top to snug it up?

Also, would you suggest going about this one wall at a time, or getting all the topmost plates laid out and installed and standing to them after?
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Old 01-11-2019, 06:42 PM   #6
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Re: New Walls


I would add only one small thing to what Seven said.
Do not nail the top plate to the bottom of the truss chords.
Use truss plates so that the trusses can move up and down as attic air gets more moist or drier.

Andy.
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Old 01-11-2019, 07:14 PM   #7
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Re: New Walls


Quote:
Originally Posted by ScipioAfricanus View Post
I would add only one small thing to what Seven said.
Do not nail the top plate to the bottom of the truss chords.
Use truss plates so that the trusses can move up and down as attic air gets more moist or drier.

Andy.


Missed the truss part.

That's what I get for taking breaks from plans and submittals to play on CT.
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Old 01-11-2019, 07:53 PM   #8
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Re: New Walls


I did a bunch of research on Truss/ Interior wall connection in the last 4 hours,

I didn't know anything about Truss Uplift, and drywall cracks etc...

So starting over, if attaching the top plate to the ceiling, it's best to use STC Roof Truss Clips not nails, to allow for movement between truss/interior wall plate? will this pose any potential issue other than just making this job a little more tedious?

Is there any other fastening method that works if the clips are not used? Would, say, nailing straight up achieve a similar result by allowing the truss to slide up and down the nail connections during movement? Or would this cause squeaks eventually?
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Old 01-11-2019, 08:24 PM   #9
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Re: New Walls


Quote:
Originally Posted by Grit View Post
I did a bunch of research on Truss/ Interior wall connection in the last 4 hours,

I didn't know anything about Truss Uplift, and drywall cracks etc...

So starting over, if attaching the top plate to the ceiling, it's best to use STC Roof Truss Clips not nails, to allow for movement between truss/interior wall plate? will this pose any potential issue other than just making this job a little more tedious?

Is there any other fastening method that works if the clips are not used? Would, say, nailing straight up achieve a similar result by allowing the truss to slide up and down the nail connections during movement? Or would this cause squeaks eventually?
Truss Clips are required by Code where I'm at. I'd get called every time if I nailed them.
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Old 01-11-2019, 08:26 PM   #10
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Re: New Walls


I'd go up above and "toe-screw" the top plate in with 3" deck screws, just to hold it in place.

After the wall is up, you can pull them, and install the clips.
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Old 01-12-2019, 06:39 AM   #11
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Re: New Walls


I'm assuming that you are not removing the drywall from the ceiling, in which case truss clips sounds like a PITA. I would think that you could drill a hole in the plate, then lag them tight to the ceiling with a lag that is smaller in diameter than the hole that you drilled and a fender washer. Install your studs, and then back the lag out at least a half of an inch.
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Old 01-12-2019, 08:24 AM   #12
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Re: New Walls


Drywall in the Main bedroom was to be removed as its painted over popcorn. Typically, I'd just 1/4 over it, but in this case removing it completely makes more sense I think. As far as access to the Truss cords from the other bedrooms (total of 3 bedrooms, 1 bathroom) removing drywall isn't an issue.

Is there some reason why these Truss clips cannot be attached from the ceiling side if open? from what Iv'e seen, the clip is attached by two nails on the top plate, and by one nail to the truss cord that rests in a channel.

I was thinking, frame the walls out leaving a 1/2" discrepancy in height (sunfloor - truss chords), stand the wall up, mark off truss clip locations, attach truss clips to the top plate, stand wall up again and attach to bottom chord? I'd have to move the insulation up just slightly to make room for clip installation on truss chord.

Does this sound doable, or waste of time?

Thanks

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