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Are We The Only Ones Worried About RRP?

 
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Old 10-07-2013, 05:06 PM   #61
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Re: Are We The Only Ones Worried About RRP?


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Originally Posted by rosethornva View Post
tenant's child ....elevated blood lead.....all moldings and trim and windows replaced.....local health department.....kid's lead levels kept going up....used crib
Too bad he did not hire a good consultant to help him. A good consultant will ask questions about other sources of lead, and test such items.
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Old 10-07-2013, 05:09 PM   #62
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Re: Are We The Only Ones Worried About RRP?


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...lead found in soil near America's highways and byways....But I am sure someone can come up with a "study" or "report" that dismisses or minimizes that source of exposure.
Just the opposite - there is plenty of information to show that lead from leaded gasoline is a real problem.
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Old 10-07-2013, 06:01 PM   #63
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Re: Are We The Only Ones Worried About RRP?


I turn down every Pre 78 job that comes across my desk. It honestly offends people when I tell them why I can't get involved in their project.

With that being said I've yet to see a RRP job in progress other than photo's online.
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Old 10-07-2013, 06:34 PM   #64
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Re: Are We The Only Ones Worried About RRP?


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Originally Posted by thesidingpro View Post
With that being said I've yet to see a RRP job in progress other than photo's online.
I've seen some. A lot of painters around here aren't certified, and don't follow the rules.
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Old 10-07-2013, 11:26 PM   #65
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Re: Are We The Only Ones Worried About RRP?


Yes.
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Old 10-07-2013, 11:38 PM   #66
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Re: Are We The Only Ones Worried About RRP?


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Originally Posted by thesidingpro View Post
I turn down every Pre 78 job that comes across my desk. It honestly offends people when I tell them why I can't get involved in their project.

With that being said I've yet to see a RRP job in progress other than photo's online.
I will determine the scope and either:

1) refuse the project

2) proceed if the scope does not require rrp

3) proceed after the client has hired an abatement company to test and remove any lead materials in the area of the project.
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Old 10-08-2013, 11:36 AM   #67
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Re: Are We The Only Ones Worried About RRP?


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Originally Posted by thesidingpro View Post
I turn down every Pre 78 job
Since you have such a hatred of money, kindly send all of what you have to me

Lead-based paint is rare in buildings built 1960 (even mid 1950s) to 1978 - half have none, the other half have very little. It is far from everywhere in older buildings. Instead, find a good consultant in your area, and either have the owner sign a contract with a clause which allows you to have the testing done, or have the owner hire them directly.

Most contractors love the phrase "change order" (see our web site for the yacht and dingy). If you include a sentence in your contract allowing you to have lead (and asbestos) testing done, whatever is found in materials which need to be disturbed then becomes a change order. No need to say anything about the testing, just as you do not say anything about getting building permits, adhering to the applicable codes, having insurance, and so forth - all routine things.

The cost for testing will be in the hundreds of dollars to around one thousand for a house (A&L), a few thousand for an apartment building, and a few tens of thousands for a high rise office.
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Old 10-08-2013, 02:52 PM   #68
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Re: Are We The Only Ones Worried About RRP?


Quote:
Originally Posted by FStephenMasek View Post
Since you have such a hatred of money, kindly send all of what you have to me

Lead-based paint is rare in buildings built 1960 (even mid 1950s) to 1978 - half have none, the other half have very little. It is far from everywhere in older buildings. Instead, find a good consultant in your area, and either have the owner sign a contract with a clause which allows you to have the testing done, or have the owner hire them directly.

Most contractors love the phrase "change order" (see our web site for the yacht and dingy). If you include a sentence in your contract allowing you to have lead (and asbestos) testing done, whatever is found in materials which need to be disturbed then becomes a change order. No need to say anything about the testing, just as you do not say anything about getting building permits, adhering to the applicable codes, having insurance, and so forth - all routine things.

The cost for testing will be in the hundreds of dollars to around one thousand for a house (A&L), a few thousand for an apartment building, and a few tens of thousands for a high rise office.
Never cost me that much.
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Old 10-08-2013, 09:20 PM   #69
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Re: Are We The Only Ones Worried About RRP?


Who ever fished now or when you were a kid and had to attach the lead sinker to the line? How did you cinch it to the line? Pliers with gloves and a mask standing on plastic?

Last edited by Roofcheck; 10-08-2013 at 09:23 PM.
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Old 10-08-2013, 09:59 PM   #70
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Re: Are We The Only Ones Worried About RRP?


Quote:
Originally Posted by FStephenMasek View Post
Since you have such a hatred of money, kindly send all of what you have to me

Lead-based paint is rare in buildings built 1960 (even mid 1950s) to 1978 - half have none, the other half have very little. It is far from everywhere in older buildings. Instead, find a good consultant in your area, and either have the owner sign a contract with a clause which allows you to have the testing done, or have the owner hire them directly.

Most contractors love the phrase "change order" (see our web site for the yacht and dingy). If you include a sentence in your contract allowing you to have lead (and asbestos) testing done, whatever is found in materials which need to be disturbed then becomes a change order. No need to say anything about the testing, just as you do not say anything about getting building permits, adhering to the applicable codes, having insurance, and so forth - all routine things.

The cost for testing will be in the hundreds of dollars to around one thousand for a house (A&L), a few thousand for an apartment building, and a few tens of thousands for a high rise office.
I'm fortunate enough to have enough work that I don't need to extend my liability.

The risk to profit ratio doesn't make sense.
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Old 10-08-2013, 10:35 PM   #71
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Re: Are We The Only Ones Worried About RRP?


Meanwhile, Fukashima continues to spew spent rods of plutonium P-32 space modulators into the Pacific and everything is honky dory
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Old 10-09-2013, 12:00 PM   #72
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Re: Are We The Only Ones Worried About RRP?


Quote:
Originally Posted by FStephenMasek View Post

Lead-based paint is rare in buildings built 1960 (even mid 1950s) to 1978 - half have none, the other half have very little. It is far from everywhere in older buildings. Instead, find a good consultant in your area, and either have the owner sign a contract with a clause which allows you to have the testing done, or have the owner hire them directly.

Most contractors love the phrase "change order" (see our web site for the yacht and dingy). If you include a sentence in your contract allowing you to have lead (and asbestos) testing done, whatever is found in materials which need to be disturbed then becomes a change order. No need to say anything about the testing, just as you do not say anything about getting building permits, adhering to the applicable codes, having insurance, and so forth - all routine things.

The cost for testing will be in the hundreds of dollars to around one thousand for a house (A&L), a few thousand for an apartment building, and a few tens of thousands for a high rise office.
May I ask how are you typically seeing such a clause, as you've recommended, in contracts that allude to "testing" without mentioning the word/s: "test," or "testing"? Obviously, any costs, such as lead/asbestos testing, that can be attributed to a specific job should be covered in said contract and accounted for in pricing. I was simply curious to learn how you would recommend associating any proposed testing to be done with making the homeowner/client aware of such costs and/or procedures?

Fact is, I would like to include just such a clause in all my contracts.
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Old 10-09-2013, 10:22 PM   #73
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Re: Are We The Only Ones Worried About RRP?


Jeff, first the disclaimer that you may wish to have an attorney review your standard contract. Sometimes insurance companies also want tor review them. That said, here is an idea to get the ball rolling:

Contractor shall comply with all applicable laws and regulations including, but not limited to, building codes, Occupational Safety and Health Administration regulations, licensing requirements, Environmental protection Agency regulations, and permit requirements, and shall provide testing for asbestos and lead (paint and ceramic tile) by a properly licensed/certified independent consultant.

The owner's agreement to the entire contract then provide agreement for the testing.

Contractors do not put the cost of complying with building codes or other OSHA regulations as a line item in bids, so there is no reason for this to be a line item, just a sentence in the general boilerplate.

Of course, consultants charge something, so including the testing cost becomes more problematic as the size of the project decreases.

Building owners are not babies, and they should be aware of asbestos & lead issues, or obtain competent advice from the appropriate professionals.
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Old 10-09-2013, 10:36 PM   #74
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Re: Are We The Only Ones Worried About RRP?


Quote:
Originally Posted by FStephenMasek View Post

Contractors do not put the cost of complying with building codes or other OSHA regulations as a line item in bids, so there is no reason for this to be a line item, just a sentence in the general boilerplate.

Of course, consultants charge something, so including the testing cost becomes more problematic as the size of the project decreases.
.
The reason I suppose I'm having somewhat of an issue with this is simply due to the fact that if and when such a scenario comes to fruition, and testing must be done, this is, in my opinion, something a bit a-typical, which doesn't, once again in my mind, typically correlate with something stated in "boilerplate' fashion within a contract. Whether several hundreds of dollars, or several thousands of dollars proposed for such testing would indeed seem warranted as a line item, job specific cost.

It would, more or less, be more akin to having some a-typical point load in a remodel situation that needed a competent engineer to remedy, then sign off on it. Costs incurred would be somewhat similar to the justification for the toxicity consultant.

And thanks a bunch for your reply! Very helpful indeed.

Last edited by Jeff G; 10-09-2013 at 10:44 PM.
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Old 10-18-2013, 11:38 AM   #75
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Re: Are We The Only Ones Worried About RRP?


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Meanwhile, Fukashima continues to spew spent rods of plutonium P-32 space modulators into the Pacific and everything is honky dory
Thats explosive space modulator...rrr

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