What To Do When The Owner Is Stuck On Stupid? - General Discussion - Contractor Talk

What To Do When The Owner Is Stuck On Stupid?

 
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Old 02-03-2020, 12:15 AM   #1
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What To Do When The Owner Is Stuck On Stupid?


What to do when the owner of a flip will not listen?

I am trying to help a friend who owns a house he and his partner have been trying to flip for over 2 years. Their budget is exhausted. Their loan is expiring and I hate to see them fall under, but I just can't get this guy to listen to reason and Im running out of patience.

A year ago he paid me for advice on how to handle failing/rotted eves & fascia. The wood was falling apart. Old termite damage. Bad maintenance issues and a leaking flat roof. I gave him a few options. He didn't follow anything I said and instead he chose to fill in gaps with Fix All and Quikrete then paint right over it.

I explained how wood expands and contracts ect. How this method was not going to work. So now he is right back to where he started. The first snow caused the wood to almost fall apart. Pieces of fixall and chumks of paint all over the ground. He came to me again and asked if I knew a worker who would sand and repair the problem. He was going to do the same thing again. He claims that the previous worker didn't do it right because he forgot to "primer" before painting.

You can stick a pencil through the wood. Thats how bad it is. I tried to explain again why patching and painting is silly when you can fix it the right way for the same amount of money and have a real finished solution. He acted like he was listening? Then I saw he had someone come and do the same thing again. I can't figure out what is wrong with this guy? Why he insists on doing what will not work?

He decided to remove the countertops in the kitchen and cast concrete for a more custom look. Has he ever done this type of work before? No. When I came over, he was pressing sea shells & plastic sea horses into the cement to try and get them deep enough to show on the top. He had plans of sprinkling colored dust on top with glue. He said the ocean look is in. I didn't even know what to say? So I left.

Now this guy is out front creating a patio with one foot square concrete patio stones. After he laid them all down in a square (unlevel - on dirt) he decided he wants to make a planter that goes all the way around the outside. He wants to use the same material and believes he can set the stones on their side and cement them together to create a bottomless box. He wants to color concrete and paint a layer on top of red stones to change them to tan.

I tried to explain the pro's and con's of his plans. I didn't want to hurt his feelings. It seems he asks me my opinions then doesn't like what he hears and becomes angry then proceeds his own way. I have never seen anyone this stubborn? He is not stupid or uneducated and claims to have years (as in 40+) of construction experience.

Anyone else run into people like this? He is his own problem.
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Old 02-03-2020, 12:30 AM   #2
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Re: What To Do When The Owner Is Stuck On Stupid?


you can lead a horse to water...

you can't fix stupid...

very difficult to rehabilitate a shyster...

sounds like he has 1 yr of experience 40 times...

quit wasting your time & breath w/this guy...

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Old 02-03-2020, 12:38 AM   #3
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Re: What To Do When The Owner Is Stuck On Stupid?


Once again flippers generally know 2 things

1. Cash closes quicker than a loan

2. An unemployed handyman is much cheaper than a professional painting contractor
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Old 02-03-2020, 01:25 AM   #4
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Re: What To Do When The Owner Is Stuck On Stupid?


I've learned long ago that the only time to get involved in someone else's flip is at the very start of the project, when you have a say in the planning. Six months in, or a year in, nope- just walk away. They dug themselves into a hole and now want you to bail them out.
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Old 02-03-2020, 03:28 AM   #5
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Re: What To Do When The Owner Is Stuck On Stupid?


Out of curiosity, which TV shows "inspire" them the most, especially in terms of shafting future buyers?
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Old 02-03-2020, 09:41 AM   #6
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Re: What To Do When The Owner Is Stuck On Stupid?


Quote:
Originally Posted by kndkcook View Post
I tried to explain the pro's and con's of his plans. I didn't want to hurt his feelings. It seems he asks me my opinions then doesn't like what he hears and becomes angry then proceeds his own way.
Simply put it to him...

"Why are you going to continually waste my time asking for my advice and expertise if you're not going to heed it anyway? I've got better things to do..."



Then tell him to remember that time (including yours) is money and to bring a checkbook next time to compensate you for your time so it's not wasted, and if he balks, move on... if he has as much experience as he claims the point will be made...

Last edited by KAP; 02-03-2020 at 09:44 AM.
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Old 02-03-2020, 10:44 AM   #7
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Re: What To Do When The Owner Is Stuck On Stupid?


Reminds me of a fella my wife is friends with. Iíve dropped close friends for their gambling problems, drinking problems, strip club habits, drug problems, etc.

The one common thread with all of them is selfishness.

They are always the victim, their great plan doesnít work out because someone sabotaged them. If you arenít careful he will pull you in and drag you down. Anytime you open your mouth remember that when it goes wrong because he failed to do what you told him itís going to be your fault.

Your best option, your only option actually, is to cut this guy out of your life. Seriously, even a child knows not to put their hand in the fire twice.
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Old 02-03-2020, 10:46 AM   #8
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Re: What To Do When The Owner Is Stuck On Stupid?


Some people are askholes. They ask, then do whatever.

He's one. He also isn't a flipper, he just likes the idea of being a flipper.

You can't save people from themselves.
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Old 02-03-2020, 11:40 AM   #9
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Re: What To Do When The Owner Is Stuck On Stupid?


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Old 02-03-2020, 12:02 PM   #10
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Re: What To Do When The Owner Is Stuck On Stupid?


I don't understand why you're making his stupidity your problem, let him fail if he doesn't learn by failing then he never will. Once someone doesn't implement the advise they asked for I'm done.
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Old 02-03-2020, 12:35 PM   #11
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Re: What To Do When The Owner Is Stuck On Stupid?


I'd walk away happily.

Just imagine the poor guy who buys it. I wouldn't want anything in any way to have anything to do with that.

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Old 02-03-2020, 12:37 PM   #12
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Re: What To Do When The Owner Is Stuck On Stupid?


You spent more time typing up that post than I would have spent pondering asking the question.
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Old 02-03-2020, 01:39 PM   #13
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Re: What To Do When The Owner Is Stuck On Stupid?


If he doesn't listen to your advice, you might as well talk to the wall. Tell him your way or stop asking.

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Old 02-03-2020, 02:48 PM   #14
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Re: What To Do When The Owner Is Stuck On Stupid?


Quote:
Originally Posted by kndkcook View Post
What to do when the owner of a flip will not listen?
Stop talking and remove yourself from the situation.

Quote:
I am trying to help a friend who owns a house he and his partner have been trying to flip for over 2 years.
2 years is not a flip, that's a primary residence. Flips need to be done in 6 months or less.

Quote:
I can't figure out what is wrong with this guy?
Nothing you can fix.

Quote:
Why he insists on doing what will not work?
I have no clue, just be thankful you have no money invested in this deal.

Quote:
Anyone else run into people like this?
I do my best to avoid people like this.
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Old 02-03-2020, 07:56 PM   #15
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Re: What To Do When The Owner Is Stuck On Stupid?


This is a desperate man acting desperately.

Distance yourself from this situation as much as you can.

If this is really your friend, I don't even know what to do. If this is just a tertiary friend, probably downgrade them to acquaintance immediately, and maybe consider severing ties completely.
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Old 02-03-2020, 11:11 PM   #16
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Re: What To Do When The Owner Is Stuck On Stupid?


Quote:
Originally Posted by kndkcook View Post
What to do when the owner of a flip will not listen?

Anyone else run into people like this? He is his own problem.
I've thrown guys out of their own shops and homeowners off their own jobs. You need to do the same.
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Old 02-03-2020, 11:23 PM   #17
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Re: What To Do When The Owner Is Stuck On Stupid?


Don't cut him out entirely...we still need entries for the Wall of Shame thread!

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