Trim Carpenter To Trim Contractor, Pros And Cons ? - General Discussion - Contractor Talk

Trim Carpenter To Trim Contractor, Pros And Cons ?

 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 05-14-2012, 09:57 AM   #1
Greg The Carpenter
 
GregThCarpenter's Avatar
 
Trade: Trim carpenter, cabinetmaker, woodworker
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Clemson,SC
Posts: 56
Rewards Points: 75

Trim Carpenter To Trim Contractor, Pros And Cons ?


I am looking for advise on the pros and cons of transitioning from a trim carpenter to a trim contractor?
GregThCarpenter is offline  

Warning: The topics covered on this site include activities in which there exists the potential for serious injury or death. ContractorTalk.com DOES NOT guarantee the accuracy or completeness of any information contained on this site. Always use proper safety precaution and reference reliable outside sources before attempting any construction or remodeling task!

   

Advertisement

 

Old 05-14-2012, 10:10 AM   #2
Pro
 
slowsol's Avatar
 
Trade: Estimator / Preconstruction Manager
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Toledo, OH
Posts: 2,572
Rewards Points: 2,248

Re: Trim Carpenter To Trim Contractor, Pros And Cons ?


What's the difference?

Advertisement

__________________
-John
slowsol is offline  
Old 05-14-2012, 10:19 AM   #3
Greg The Carpenter
 
GregThCarpenter's Avatar
 
Trade: Trim carpenter, cabinetmaker, woodworker
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Clemson,SC
Posts: 56
Rewards Points: 75

Re: Trim Carpenter To Trim Contractor, Pros And Cons ?


Quote:
Originally Posted by slowsol View Post
What's the difference?
Estimating, bidding, hiring employees, paying workers comp on employees, paying taxes on employees, paying for employees mistakes, to name a few.
GregThCarpenter is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 05-14-2012, 11:59 AM   #4
Pro
 
slowsol's Avatar
 
Trade: Estimator / Preconstruction Manager
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Toledo, OH
Posts: 2,572
Rewards Points: 2,248

Re: Trim Carpenter To Trim Contractor, Pros And Cons ?


I see. I assumed you were already a business owner that called himself a carpenter.
__________________
-John
slowsol is offline  
Old 05-14-2012, 12:09 PM   #5
Average Joe
 
Heritage's Avatar
 
Trade: Design/Build
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Toronto
Posts: 1,209
Rewards Points: 524

Re: Trim Carpenter To Trim Contractor, Pros And Cons ?


Trim carpenter PROS:
-Get paid for hrs worked.

Trim carpenter CONS:
-Cap value on the value of your hourly output as determined by your employer(s)

Trim contractor PROS:
-The sky is the limit

Trim contractor CONS:
-Your sanity is on the line.

Going from employee to employer requires an entire re-evaluation of your principles, standards, discipline, vision, outlook and a whole new set of interests, not to mention associations.

You want to change your career? First change your life. If you fail to do this, you will always be a trim carpenter.

EXAMPLE: A trim carpenter looks at a house and sees the wood details and he immediately associates everything that went into "trimming" that particular house.

A trim contractor looks at a house...if you pay him his $75 "consulting fee"
__________________
Toronto General Contractor
The foundation stones for a balanced success are honesty, character, integrity, faith, love and loyalty.
-Zig Ziglar
Heritage is offline  
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Heritage For This Useful Post:
BC Carpenter (05-14-2012), SC sawdaddy (05-14-2012)
Old 05-14-2012, 02:36 PM   #6
Thom
 
thom's Avatar
 
Trade: General Contractor/Homebuilder
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Albuquerque NM
Posts: 4,137
Rewards Points: 4,748

Re: Trim Carpenter To Trim Contractor, Pros And Cons ?


Before, it looks like:
More Money
More Time
More Headaches

After, it looks like this
More Money
More Time
More Headaches
__________________
Patriotism is being loyal to your country all the time and your government when it deserves it. Mark Twain
thom is offline  
The Following 9 Users Say Thank You to thom For This Useful Post:
BC Carpenter (05-14-2012), Dan_Watson (05-14-2012), greg24k (05-14-2012), I Mester (05-14-2012), loneframer (05-14-2012), Railman (05-15-2012), SC sawdaddy (05-14-2012), Tom Struble (05-14-2012), Willie T (05-14-2012)
Old 05-14-2012, 04:39 PM   #7
Pro
 
Oconomowoc's Avatar
 
Trade: construction
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 4,895
Rewards Points: 2,000

Re: Trim Carpenter To Trim Contractor, Pros And Cons ?


Its really an entirely different animal in my opinion. It can sometimes take years to adjust because the lifestyle is drastically different.

My brother-in-law made the transition from trim carpenter to business owner and its been a tough road for him. He seems to be doing well but he doesn't fish, hunt or relax anywhere near what he use to. Of course, after a number of years now he is tainted by business ownership like the rest of us. Once you go down that road is very hard, if not impossible, to go back to being an employee.

I think it's different for everybody. Sometimes you just have to get your feet wet and find out. Just make sure you stockpile some cash and have a plan beofre making the jump.
Oconomowoc is offline  
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Oconomowoc For This Useful Post:
Snobnd (05-14-2012), Tom Struble (05-14-2012)
Old 05-14-2012, 06:00 PM   #8
Pro
 
dom-mas's Avatar
 
Trade: masonry
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Ontario Canada
Posts: 8,133
Rewards Points: 626

Re: Trim Carpenter To Trim Contractor, Pros And Cons ?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Oconomowoc View Post
. Just make sure you stockpile some cash and have a plan beofre making the jump.

I wish I'd heard that a while ago. I went into business for myself because I didn't like the quality of work that the people I was working for were doing. Basic hand tools my grandfathers scaffold and I was in business. Now almost a decade later I'm finally learning how to run a business and not just be self employed. I'm still a small business but I kind of like it that way.
__________________
New & restoration masonry construction
www.dominionmasonry.ca
dom-mas is offline  
Old 05-14-2012, 06:06 PM   #9
Pro
 
katoman's Avatar
 
Trade: carpenter
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Kirkfield,Ontario, Canada
Posts: 6,102
Rewards Points: 2,000

Re: Trim Carpenter To Trim Contractor, Pros And Cons ?


It's not as bad or as hard as some make out. Keep in mind the OP is not looking to become a General Contractor, just a trim contractor.

So you only have one trade to take care of. Yes, you will become a business man and you need to learn that part of it.

If you are looking at trimming subdivision homes you won't make any money. If you can get and do high end work then you can make some money.

Best of luck
katoman is offline  
Old 05-14-2012, 06:09 PM   #10
Pro
 
dom-mas's Avatar
 
Trade: masonry
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Ontario Canada
Posts: 8,133
Rewards Points: 626

Re: Trim Carpenter To Trim Contractor, Pros And Cons ?


One piece of wisdom I heard that stuck with me was "when you work for someone else you work for one a$$hole, when you work for yourself, you work for all the a$$holes"
__________________
New & restoration masonry construction
www.dominionmasonry.ca
dom-mas is offline  
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to dom-mas For This Useful Post:
Big Shoe (05-16-2012), loneframer (05-14-2012)
Old 05-14-2012, 06:20 PM   #11
Pro
 
katoman's Avatar
 
Trade: carpenter
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Kirkfield,Ontario, Canada
Posts: 6,102
Rewards Points: 2,000

Re: Trim Carpenter To Trim Contractor, Pros And Cons ?


Quote:
Originally Posted by dom-mas View Post
One piece of wisdom I heard that stuck with me was "when you work for someone else you work for one a$$hole, when you work for yourself, you work for all the a$$holes"
Although I find this humorous, my advice to the OP is to avoid the a$$holes. Just don't work for them. There are lots of good GC's and builders out there.

Save yourself the grief. If your gut says run, RUN.
katoman is offline  
Old 05-14-2012, 06:20 PM   #12
Pro
 
Tom Struble's Avatar
 
Trade: siding
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: west milford n.j.
Posts: 17,271
Rewards Points: 20

Re: Trim Carpenter To Trim Contractor, Pros And Cons ?


i was siding a house today on the wall i'm working on has a oil tank fill and vent going out the foundation and up the wall about 2',the fill pipe had a rusty coffee can for a lid and was tight against the wall,no room to get siding behind it

i look to my right and see a gas meter so i ask the H.O. she said they don't use oil and the tank is empty,so using my awesome brain i decide to turn the pipes down far enough to get my siding through without having to cut anything,i was going to tell them to get a plumber to cap the pipe

started raining so i left,i was just ready to start dinner when i get a call the tanks leaking,i rush back to the job and sure enough a steady stream is pouring outthe bottom was rusted and just from messing with the pipe it must have vibrated some rust loose

instead of putting a pan or a bucket under the leak she jambs fiberglass insulation under it....

what was the question again...
__________________
Tom

Last edited by Tom Struble; 05-17-2012 at 06:57 PM.
Tom Struble is offline  
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Tom Struble For This Useful Post:
mikeswoods (05-16-2012), Oconomowoc (05-14-2012)
Old 05-14-2012, 06:40 PM   #13
Pro
 
dom-mas's Avatar
 
Trade: masonry
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Ontario Canada
Posts: 8,133
Rewards Points: 626

Re: Trim Carpenter To Trim Contractor, Pros And Cons ?


Quote:
Originally Posted by katoman View Post
Although I find this humorous, my advice to the OP is to avoid the a$$holes. Just don't work for them. There are lots of good GC's and builders out there.

Save yourself the grief. If your gut says run, RUN.
I've generally been pretty lucky. Most of the people I've worked for have been great, but then I've had a couple great bosses. My real point is 2 fold. You shouldn't become self employed because you don't want to work for someone else. You always work for someone else unless you know how to print money legally. And when working for yourself you have to deal with many different folks. After working for one guy for a while you learn their idoicinrcacies (sp?) When you're self employed you often deal with new people on a daily basis and need to be able to make them trust you, calm their fears/worries, learn and understand their personal preferences/tastes, etc...

Basically don't become self employed just because you don't like working for someone else. That can and usually is a part of it but if it's the only reason (not saying the OP ever mentioned this but he did want advice) it's not advisable.
__________________
New & restoration masonry construction
www.dominionmasonry.ca
dom-mas is offline  
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to dom-mas For This Useful Post:
katoman (05-14-2012), loneframer (05-14-2012)
Old 05-14-2012, 06:44 PM   #14
KemoSabe
 
loneframer's Avatar
 
Trade: residential framing/siding/general carpentry
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Vineland, New Jersey
Posts: 14,233
Rewards Points: 12,218

Re: Trim Carpenter To Trim Contractor, Pros And Cons ?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Struble View Post
i was siding a house today on the wall i'm working on has a oil tank fill and vent going out the foundation and up the wall about 2',the fill pipe had a rusty coffee can for a lid and was tight against the wall,no room to get siding behind it

i look to my right and see a gas meter so i ask the H.O. she said they don't use oil and the tank is empty,so using my awesome brain i decide to turn the pipes down far enough to get my siding through without having to cut anything,i was going to tell them to get a plumber to cap the pipe

started raining so i left,i was just ready to start dinner when i get a call the tanks leaking,i rush back to the job and sure enough a steady stream is pouring outthe bottom was rusted and just from messing with the pipe it must have vibrated some rust loose

instead of putting a pan or a bucket under the leak she jambs fiberglass insulation under it....

what was the question again...
Moral of this story? Hide the pipe in a downspout and don't touch it.
__________________
__________________________________




"Walking the fine line between production and perfection"




__________________________________
loneframer is offline  
Old 05-14-2012, 06:48 PM   #15
KemoSabe
 
loneframer's Avatar
 
Trade: residential framing/siding/general carpentry
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Vineland, New Jersey
Posts: 14,233
Rewards Points: 12,218

Re: Trim Carpenter To Trim Contractor, Pros And Cons ?


For the OP. If you love doing your job, forget going into business, unless you're willing to work two jobs.

Otherwise, you will be best suited to put down the belt, and hire manpower to produce the work, while you produce the jobs.

I don't know about the rest of the guys here, but with all the cutthroat hacks in the trades these days, pride of ownership has been beaten down to something that more closely resembles primal survival instincts.
__________________
__________________________________




"Walking the fine line between production and perfection"




__________________________________
loneframer is offline  
Old 05-14-2012, 06:48 PM   #16
Pro
 
Oconomowoc's Avatar
 
Trade: construction
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 4,895
Rewards Points: 2,000

Re: Trim Carpenter To Trim Contractor, Pros And Cons ?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Struble
i was siding a house today on the wall i'm working on has a oil tank fill and vent going out the foundation and up the wall about 2',the fill pipe had a rusty coffee can for a lid and was tight against the wall,no room to get siding behind it

i look to my right and see a gas meter so i ask the H.O. she said they don't use oil and the tank is empty,so using my awesome brain i decide to turn the pipes down far enough to get my siding through without having to cut anything,i was going to tell them to get a plumber to cap the pipe

started raining so i left,i was just ready to start dinner when i get a call the tanks leaking,i rush back to the job and sure enough a steady stream is pouring outthe bottom was rusted and just from messing with the pipe it must have vibrated some rust loose

instead of putting a pan or a bucket under the leak she jambs fiberglass insulation under it....

what was the question again...
It seems like every so often. I have these same moments where you do something with good intentions and it just backfires. And usually on the way to the house I'm like "what the heck was I thinking".
Oconomowoc is offline  
The Following User Says Thank You to Oconomowoc For This Useful Post:
Tom Struble (05-14-2012)
Old 05-14-2012, 06:49 PM   #17
Pro
 
Tom Struble's Avatar
 
Trade: siding
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: west milford n.j.
Posts: 17,271
Rewards Points: 20

Re: Trim Carpenter To Trim Contractor, Pros And Cons ?


never again
__________________
Tom
Tom Struble is offline  
Old 05-14-2012, 06:52 PM   #18
Pro
 
Oconomowoc's Avatar
 
Trade: construction
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 4,895
Rewards Points: 2,000

Re: Trim Carpenter To Trim Contractor, Pros And Cons ?


Quote:
Originally Posted by loneframer
For the OP. If you love doing your job, forget going into business, unless you're willing to work two jobs.

Otherwise, you will be best suited to put down the belt, and hire manpower to produce the work, while you produce the jobs.

I don't know about the rest of the guys here, but with all the cutthroat hacks in the trades these days, pride of ownership has been beaten down to something that more closely resembles primal survival instincts.
Lots of good things can be said for just carrying a lunch box and punching a time clock. I can remember how nice it was when 3:00 came and I went from "plumbing mode" to "do what I want mode" in seconds. Not so with a business. I'll never go back but but working for a company does have advantages.
Oconomowoc is offline  
Old 05-14-2012, 07:00 PM   #19
Pro
 
dom-mas's Avatar
 
Trade: masonry
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Ontario Canada
Posts: 8,133
Rewards Points: 626

Re: Trim Carpenter To Trim Contractor, Pros And Cons ?


A friends brother was a GC for 15 or so years. One day he had enough and got a job in a factory. LOVES it. Mindless work, he has a buddy sitting beside him and they talk about hockey all day while their hands do what they've done 10 000 times before. Everyday at 9:00 he gets a break, everyday at 12:00 he eats lunch, 2:30 another break goes home at 4:00. Work weekends? Sure I could use the overtime and a bit of extra money, or no thanks I'm going camping with the kids. Makes 1/2 of what he used to and couldn't be happier.
__________________
New & restoration masonry construction
www.dominionmasonry.ca
dom-mas is offline  
The Following User Says Thank You to dom-mas For This Useful Post:
Willie T (05-14-2012)
Old 05-14-2012, 07:06 PM   #20
Greg The Carpenter
 
GregThCarpenter's Avatar
 
Trade: Trim carpenter, cabinetmaker, woodworker
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Clemson,SC
Posts: 56
Rewards Points: 75

Re: Trim Carpenter To Trim Contractor, Pros And Cons ?


A little back ground,
I am a one man show trim carpenter, I have had my own business for five years, I'm licensed and insured.

Most of my business comes from builders and trim contractors. I do small trim jobs, built ins and sub myself out by the hour.
I currently have the opportunity to bid a substantial trim job for a builder whom I have done work for as a sub of a sub.

The job would require more insurance, more tools and equipment, hiring help, floating payroll, and more.

I am not sure if it is worth the investment risk or the headaches.

Advertisement

GregThCarpenter is offline  


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Rebar tie guns pros and cons. KB construction Concrete & Paving 3 04-09-2011 10:34 AM
What is the pros and cons of applying AGT or Marble Stone as exterior wall finishes? kwanht Masonry 1 03-31-2010 01:00 AM
Cork flooring in a Bathroom? Pros & Cons bretth0214 Flooring 86 03-10-2010 08:32 PM
Pros and Cons of insulating interior walls cooks General Discussion 8 02-11-2010 12:04 PM

Join Now... It's Fast and FREE!

I am a professional contractor
I am a DIY Homeowner
Drywall Talk is for
PROFESSIONAL CONTRACTORS ONLY!

At DrywallTalk.com we cater exlusivly to professional contractors who make their living as a contractor. Knowing that many homeowners and DIYers are looking for a community to call home, we've created www.DIYChatroom.com DIY Chatroom is full of helpful advices and perfect for DIY homeowners.

Redirecing in 10 seconds
No Thanks
terms of service

Already Have an Account?