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Remodeling Brothers Kitchen - Permit?

 
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Old 05-04-2018, 06:33 PM   #1
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Remodeling Brothers Kitchen - Permit?


Hey everyone, long time lurker here but haven't posted much.

A little background - 26 year old carpenter in Connecticut, 3 years in the trade. I am a carpenter with little to no experience with how the business aspect of projects works, so I'm looking for a little advice. My brother asked me to remodel his kitchen with/for him, excited at the prospect of renewing his dilapidated kitchen, I said yes. I've done a few built-ins for him in the past and everything turned out great. The layout will be mostly staying the same besides taking out one non-load bearing wall, adding 6 can lights and two outlets (bringing in an electrician), and changing his electric range out for a propane cooktop (also bringing in a plumber). We must pull a permit to install the propane and gas lines, but weren't originally planning to pull a permit for the entire kitchen remodel. Any advice on what to do? Should we bite the bullet and pull a permit for the entire job? Should we try to work around it somehow?

As I said before, I have never had to pull a permit before so I don't know how these things normally work. I understand if it was an actual contracted job instead of working with my brother, permits would be pulled no question. And yes, I do expect to be chastised for asking
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Old 05-04-2018, 06:52 PM   #2
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Re: Remodeling Brothers Kitchen - Permit?


Tough for us to say, particularly since you didn't mention what town the job is in.

Typically, permit requirements are set by the local authorities. In my area, the only thing about that job that would trigger the need for a permit is that you're going to be making structural alterations.

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Old 05-04-2018, 07:02 PM   #3
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Re: Remodeling Brothers Kitchen - Permit?


Most likely want to pull a permit. If you start changing stuff around and the plumbing inspector comes in and notices it he's going to red tag the job. That can get spendy quick. Just call the local building department push the button for permitting wait an hour and a half and get an answer if you need it.

Or just go down there with a basic plan and have your brother pull a HO permit.
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Old 05-04-2018, 10:12 PM   #4
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Re: Remodeling Brothers Kitchen - Permit?


Assuming CT is similar to NJ, you would need a permit for both the framing and the electric. At that point you're probably also going to need a building permit, but check with the local department. They usually don't bite!
Your brother can pull the permit since he is the HO. It would be a good learning experience for you.
If you're just doing a fixture swap on the plumbing, ie fridge, stove, and sink are all staying in the same location and utilizing the existing supply/drain lines, you shouldn't need plumbing, but if you're adding a double sink or something and changing the stack then you will need plumbing as well.

Do it legal. Like I said, it's a nice learning experience playing with house(your brother's!) money.
Good luck with the project and ask more questions here when you run across issues.
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Old 05-04-2018, 10:53 PM   #5
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Re: Remodeling Brothers Kitchen - Permit?


As much as some don't like pulling permits it is best in the long run. If you get on the bad side of the inspector for not having one, and plan on doing more work as a contractor in the future ,well he can be real cranky for a long time.
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Old 05-05-2018, 12:07 AM   #6
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Re: Remodeling Brothers Kitchen - Permit?


Where I work that would require a permit. Changing the floor plan would trigger it just by itself. Add in the rest of the work, and now you're into a remodel that requires safety aspects to be brought up to remodel code. Usually just smokes and electric, but it can be more.
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Old 05-05-2018, 07:21 AM   #7
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Re: Remodeling Brothers Kitchen - Permit?


If you doing everything legit without cutting corners get a permit and sleep good at night.

In your case is easy, tell your brother to apply for the permit and he can say he is doing the work himself if your area allows that.
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Old 05-05-2018, 11:12 AM   #8
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Re: Remodeling Brothers Kitchen - Permit?


you said it yourself..."don't have much experience in the business end"
....well, here's a chance for you to learn some business 101
The reality is that permits are a part of the process. whether or not future clients want to pull them does not negate the fact that this process is knowledge that you need to have. Dont just pull the permits... go down there with an inquisitive mind and get you head around the entire process. Knowledge is $$$$$$$$$
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Old 05-05-2018, 12:56 PM   #9
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Re: Remodeling Brothers Kitchen - Permit?


I have seen some load bearing walls referred to as non load bearing by some people, a municipal wont take your word for it.

Around here if its just a cabinet swap ---then no permit. Permit for plumbing and electrical yes. Open up drywall/plaster for plumbing or electric then building kicks in for insulation.

Dont forget these guys work in the same office for the same boss. I have many towns where the building inspector is also a plumbing or electric inspector so he does double duty. The plumbing or electrical inspector may call the office on their own. Its best to tell them what your doing under "minor work" MAYBE they say just Plumbing and electric.
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Old 05-05-2018, 03:26 PM   #10
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Re: Remodeling Brothers Kitchen - Permit?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Easy Gibson View Post
Assuming CT is similar to NJ, you would need a permit for both the framing and the electric. At that point you're probably also going to need a building permit, but check with the local department. They usually don't bite!
Your brother can pull the permit since he is the HO. It would be a good learning experience for you.
If you're just doing a fixture swap on the plumbing, ie fridge, stove, and sink are all staying in the same location and utilizing the existing supply/drain lines, you shouldn't need plumbing, but if you're adding a double sink or something and changing the stack then you will need plumbing as well.

Do it legal. Like I said, it's a nice learning experience playing with house(your brother's!) money.
Good luck with the project and ask more questions here when you run across issues.
Similar to here, but they ask that whoever is doing the work be named on the permit. I am currently adding a garage onto my house, and I pulled the permit in our company name.
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Old 05-05-2018, 04:10 PM   #11
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Re: Remodeling Brothers Kitchen - Permit?


in Cali you can do "owner builder"
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Old 05-05-2018, 09:49 PM   #12
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Re: Remodeling Brothers Kitchen - Permit?


Pull the permit. Better safe than sorry.
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Old 05-06-2018, 10:23 AM   #13
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Re: Remodeling Brothers Kitchen - Permit?


thanks for the info.
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Old 05-08-2018, 09:15 AM   #14
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Re: Remodeling Brothers Kitchen - Permit?


Thanks for the feedback everyone, I’m going to try and convince my brother to pull the permits. Typically on all the jobs I’m on, it’s the same inspector for each phase of construction. This is in Killingworth, CT by the way. I’m pretty sure if you are making any alterations besides cosmetic, permits are necessary.
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Old 10-28-2018, 06:14 PM   #15
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Re: Remodeling Brothers Kitchen - Permit?


Just finished up my brothers kitchen and thought i'd post some pictures to show you. We did end up pulling permits, for a learning experience and also to avoid setbacks with installing the propane. Miterfolded floating shelves out of 3/4" birch ply, cabinets are cliq-studios (decent quality, not fantastic though), and I built the island to fit the space

[IMG][/IMG]

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Old 10-28-2018, 06:35 PM   #16
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Re: Remodeling Brothers Kitchen - Permit?


Nice. Smart use of the corner cabinet. And when it comes time to sell the property, your brother will be able to disclose that it was done with permits...
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Old 10-28-2018, 06:44 PM   #17
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Re: Remodeling Brothers Kitchen - Permit?


For a moment there I was looking at the first two pics as if it was the finished product.
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Old 10-29-2018, 05:05 PM   #18
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Re: Remodeling Brothers Kitchen - Permit?


Very nice !
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Old 10-30-2018, 02:10 AM   #19
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Re: Remodeling Brothers Kitchen - Permit?


Is there a outlet on the island ?

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