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Need Advice On Pole Barn

 
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Old 08-24-2019, 02:49 AM   #1
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Need Advice On Pole Barn


Okay so I live in Meridian, MS and I have been working the last couple years doing construction mainly putting up pole barns and here recently I have started to do them for people on my own.. I have done 2 30x60x12 and I have a 40x80 to start on at the end of the week. I have no issues getting together a material list cost but my problem is when it comes to pricing the labor I have no idea how to start. any advice or help would be very much appreciated!!
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Old 08-24-2019, 06:12 AM   #2
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Re: Need Advice On Pole Barn


If you have been doing them for the past couple years you should know how long it takes to build one.
Now add on all the expenses of your business; insurance, tools, vehicles, etc. and you will be well on your way.

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Old 08-24-2019, 10:34 AM   #3
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Re: Need Advice On Pole Barn


break it down in to steps:

land clearing/grading

bore holes

set posts

infill

set trusses

roof framing

roof sheeting

siding

clean-up

etc, etc, etc....
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Old 08-24-2019, 11:22 PM   #4
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Re: Need Advice On Pole Barn


Griz hit the nail on the head. The best way to build big jobs is break it down into smaller ones. It's the same way you price one. Walk the whole job through your mind and write it down by each operation.


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Old 08-25-2019, 07:59 AM   #5
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Re: Need Advice On Pole Barn


Quote:
Originally Posted by Thekidd18 View Post
Okay so I live in Meridian, MS and I have been working the last couple years doing construction mainly putting up pole barns and here recently I have started to do them for people on my own.. I have done 2 30x40x12 and I have a 40x80 to start on at the end of the week. I have no issues getting together a material list cost but my problem is when it comes to pricing the labor I have no idea how to start. any advice or help would be very much appreciated!!
I will step out and tell you how it is done here in Oklahoma....but remember, that is here and you are there.

I don't build pole barns...because we do steel buildings and no wood, but the pricing is very similar. You have to have a base number to work from to generate a price.

So you say 30 x 40 x 12....so lets look at that one: 1200 total square feet. Around here, the crews would come and lay out the building, string lines and batterboards, and dig post holes for the poles....set them up and brace, and then pour. Quickcrete. A 3 0r 4 man crew and a few hours. Then a few days later, they show up and get after it. Frame in a day, and sheet it the following day. No manlifts, no telehandlers, no nothing. Trailer full of tools and 3 days. If you are legal here, your insurance expense might be $100 day for comp and GL, assuming 2 or 3 guys on the payroll....or more likely, you are paying your help cash and no GL. Pole bard builders here are the bottom of the pond.

Here in Oklahoma, $2 a sq/ft is a lot for a pole barn....including hanging the over door, or building a slider. So if you are paying your guys based on the skills needed to do the job, you may have $400 in wages for 3 days x 3 guys for $1,200, and you will make $1,200.

Now, you see why pricing questions are so tough? Maybe you have a few buddies that work for you for $10 an hour. Maybe you pay $20 an hour and are 100% legit. So $20 an hour for 30 hours (on the outside) plus workmens comp, plus GL, is more like an expense of $35 a man hour. So 60 man hours x $35 = $2,100 to pay, and you need to be paid, plus the expenses, so you need to at least double that. $4,200 / 1,200 sq/ft = $3.50 per sq/ft. And if you have any equipment that goes with you, or rented, then more.

And then, you have to get the jobs.....because there will be some clown out there thinking he is making money at $2 a sq/ft. No insurance, no comp, no legit employees, and a lot of risk....in and out crews, gone and never to be seen again. We deal with this here.

The good news is if you are working at the $3.50 threshold, then bigger buildings start getting to be profitable, and then there is concrete...and building the pads, and all the stuff that goes with it.

At least you won't have to compete against guys like me....because we can't drop our prices, even if we wanted to, to go build pole barns. I would not haul a telehandler and rough terrain scissor lift to a job site for $1,200. Our jobs are starting at $5 a sq/ft for erections, and only go up from there. My son just completed a 100 x 220 x 24 tall, did it in 25 working days, and the bid was $110,000. Numbers add up...but not at 30 x 60 prices.
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Old 08-26-2019, 02:35 PM   #6
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Re: Need Advice On Pole Barn


when I first bid pole barns many years ago I broke it down like how Griz has it. Each line has an a list of mats needed and time allotted (ie 2men/8hrs). Final tally at the bottom of the worksheet included a misc line, because I usually forgot something in the beginning, and added labor, because sometimes it doesn't go as planned.

Final step was to add markup to the materials and write it up as a scope so the client understood what IS included and note things that are NOT included (that someone may anticipate is).
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Old 08-29-2019, 07:52 PM   #7
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Re: Need Advice On Pole Barn


Theres just too many variables.. Lots of good info here however.

One thing that helped me out when I started way back when, is that you need to treat your business as an employee... or a partner.. Even if your a one man show. Your business absolutely MUST be paid.

So if you want to make $20/hr you cant charge your customer $20/hr for your business to build them X. You must charge them atleast $40. Because its not just you doing the job, your business is there too. And in order to buy new trucks, advertise, and pay for all the business related crap, your business MUST get paid.
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Old 08-29-2019, 09:45 PM   #8
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Re: Need Advice On Pole Barn


Quote:
Originally Posted by Joasis View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thekidd18 View Post
Okay so I live in Meridian, MS and I have been working the last couple years doing construction mainly putting up pole barns and here recently I have started to do them for people on my own.. I have done 2 30x40x12 and I have a 40x80 to start on at the end of the week. I have no issues getting together a material list cost but my problem is when it comes to pricing the labor I have no idea how to start. any advice or help would be very much appreciated!!
I will step out and tell you how it is done here in Oklahoma....but remember, that is here and you are there.

I don't build pole barns...because we do steel buildings and no wood, but the pricing is very similar. You have to have a base number to work from to generate a price.

So you say 30 x 40 x 12....so lets look at that one: 1200 total square feet. Around here, the crews would come and lay out the building, string lines and batterboards, and dig post holes for the poles....set them up and brace, and then pour. Quickcrete. A 3 0r 4 man crew and a few hours. Then a few days later, they show up and get after it. Frame in a day, and sheet it the following day. No manlifts, no telehandlers, no nothing. Trailer full of tools and 3 days. If you are legal here, your insurance expense might be $100 day for comp and GL, assuming 2 or 3 guys on the payroll....or more likely, you are paying your help cash and no GL. Pole bard builders here are the bottom of the pond.

Here in Oklahoma, $2 a sq/ft is a lot for a pole barn....including hanging the over door, or building a slider. So if you are paying your guys based on the skills needed to do the job, you may have $400 in wages for 3 days x 3 guys for $1,200, and you will make $1,200.

Now, you see why pricing questions are so tough? Maybe you have a few buddies that work for you for $10 an hour. Maybe you pay $20 an hour and are 100% legit. So $20 an hour for 30 hours (on the outside) plus workmens comp, plus GL, is more like an expense of $35 a man hour. So 60 man hours x $35 = $2,100 to pay, and you need to be paid, plus the expenses, so you need to at least double that. $4,200 / 1,200 sq/ft = $3.50 per sq/ft. And if you have any equipment that goes with you, or rented, then more.

And then, you have to get the jobs.....because there will be some clown out there thinking he is making money at $2 a sq/ft. <img src="http://img.contractortalk.com/smilies/icon_rolleyes.gif" border="0" alt="" title="Roll Eyes" class="inlineimg" /> No insurance, no comp, no legit employees, and a lot of risk....in and out crews, gone and never to be seen again. We deal with this here.

The good news is if you are working at the $3.50 threshold, then bigger buildings start getting to be profitable, and then there is concrete...and building the pads, and all the stuff that goes with it.

At least you won't have to compete against guys like me....because we can't drop our prices, even if we wanted to, to go build pole barns. I would not haul a telehandler and rough terrain scissor lift to a job site for $1,200. Our jobs are starting at $5 a sq/ft for erections, and only go up from there. My son just completed a 100 x 220 x 24 tall, did it in 25 working days, and the bid was $110,000. Numbers add up...but not at 30 x 60 prices. <img src="http://img.contractortalk.com/smilies/thumbsup.gif" border="0" alt="" title="Thumbsup" class="inlineimg" />
Great post.

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