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Joining A Union

 
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Old 03-01-2012, 01:08 AM   #281
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Re: Joining A Union


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Originally Posted by KillerToiletSpider View Post
Every non union contractor on these forums wants to see the end of union labor,
Nope, not at all. What we want is this:


Open competition for ALL construction projects funded with public funds.

No rigged bidding i.e. Project Labor Agreements on public projects funded with public funds


It's that simple
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Old 03-01-2012, 01:28 AM   #282
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Re: Joining A Union


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Originally Posted by Brickie View Post
Nope, not at all. What we want is this:


Open competition for ALL construction projects funded with public funds.

No rigged bidding i.e. Project Labor Agreements on public projects funded with public funds


It's that simple
Thanks a lot for that post B. you hit it dead on.
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I hate when a profitable job becomes a charitable write off.
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Old 03-01-2012, 02:08 AM   #283
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Old 03-01-2012, 02:14 AM   #284
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Re: Joining A Union


Here in BC I have worked both union and non union and now self employed. I have seen large projects that are non union go over budget huge anounts. One main player here in town built are new convention center well they budget was just something they used as a guide. I believe the building was almost double the budget. But they keep getting awarded projects do to there donations to political offices.

We have had a fair wage policy in the past for government work. It was brought in by our NDP government( labour supported). The fair wage rules forced non union to pay more for labour and the unions were payed less. This ended up eroding the unions. When the economy picked up unions were still tied to a low $ per hour collective agreement. Where the overall rates were going up.

Union companies here compete openly with non union many times on the same site. A union general may have non union subs. And a union is able to supply a larger amount of skilled workers than non union. I have been on sites where they have had to hire from the paper and craigslist etc. Well you end up with the bottom of the barrel.

The companies I worked for union have found nitches mainly in the industrial and civil area. Do to the type of work you do not have the compition as it is some what specialized.
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Old 03-01-2012, 07:34 AM   #285
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Re: Joining A Union


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Originally Posted by KillerToiletSpider View Post
Every non union contractor on these forums wants to see the end of union labor, it will eliminate the high end of the pay scale and allow them to pay half that and tell their employees they are being paid top dollar, because there will be nothing to compare it too.

I would also be willing to bet that as their labor expenses go down their prices will not, but their profit margins will go up.
Is this a bad thing?
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Old 03-01-2012, 09:29 AM   #286
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Re: Joining A Union


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Originally Posted by iDAHOchris
Is this a bad thing?
I think the problem most people have with unions is that they have rigged the system in their favor through political corruption. They need those high union wages so that they can confiscate union dues from their members and bribe more politicians. How else could they afford to donate hundreds of millions of dollars every election cycle to their favorite democrat?

http://www.opensecrets.org/orgs/list.php
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Old 03-01-2012, 12:54 PM   #287
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Re: Joining A Union


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Originally Posted by falcon1 View Post
I think the problem most people have with unions is that they have rigged the system in their favor through political corruption. They need those high union wages so that they can confiscate union dues from their members and bribe more politicians. How else could they afford to donate hundreds of millions of dollars every election cycle to their favorite democrat?

http://www.opensecrets.org/orgs/list.php
Think out of the box!! Think of the other side of the coin!!!

You don't think big Business has rigged the system in their favor thru political corruption and don't bribe politicians ???? They donate alot more than Unions & they have along with the dark side party, worked hard at it to convince people like you and others that Unions are no good , so more of their big boys can line their pockets some more, off the backs of the working people without nobody to fight for them!
!!

The union scale has set your scale indirectly some time ago when they could negotiate in good faith. That changed with replacement workers brought on from the Dark side politicians that were supported by big business.

There is no fair negotiating anymore, because of this- and the anti-union propaganda they put out there to get the followers on board.

Do you think Big Companies would, out of the goodness of their hearts,would pay their employees a good wage & benifits??? It is going by the wayside because there are so many "followers" that believe the opposite!
Please, Think out of the Box!!!

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Old 03-01-2012, 05:12 PM   #288
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Re: Joining A Union


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Originally Posted by iDAHOchris View Post
Is this a bad thing?

Yes, hard working skilled people should be paid decently for their efforts.

That is a slippery slope, next it would be standard for an employer to have 10-12 hour days regularly with no paid overtime. Right back to the industrial revolution days. Hey why not hire 12 year olds and have them work for peanuts.

If you want people who will work for peanuts, you will not end up with the type of people you really want working for you.

Some people choose to operate based on bottom line price of what they will pay their employees, the thing is though (and they may not realize it) their customers are those that choose their contractor for bottom line price. Bottom feeders all the way down the chain.

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Old 03-01-2012, 06:07 PM   #289
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Re: Joining A Union


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Originally Posted by TheItalian204 View Post
You truely believe what you say or you just saying this just because?

No offence but this is one of most ridiculous statements I have heard in a while.

If us wanting unions disbanded had to do with amount of money we pay to our emloyees then everyone would be hiring illegals for cheapest labor.

Thats not what non-union contractors are concerned about.
So, Italian, how many of your employees are you paying $50-60hr with vacation, pension, health benefits.

In fact all the union bashers on here should be paying the same rate to their employees as the unions are paying.
If you want an end to unions then pay your employees what union members make and you will have plenty of non-union workers working for you.
If you aren't willing to pay union wages then you are part of the problem in this country right now with downward wage pressures.
I've said it before and I'll keep saying it, it is in the best interest of any business to have a customer base that is making a descent salary. If they have no money to spend, guess what, they won't be giving you any business and the more people that don't give you business the less money you make.
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Old 03-01-2012, 06:13 PM   #290
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Re: Joining A Union


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Originally Posted by Brickie View Post
Yes, as was the case here:

The Big Dig was the most expensive highway project in the U.S. and was plagued by escalating costs, scheduling overruns, leaks, design flaws, charges of poor execution and use of substandard materials, criminal arrests,[2][3] and even four deaths.[4] The project was scheduled to be completed in 1998[5] at an estimated cost of $2.8 billion (in 1982 dollars, US$6.0 billion adjusted for inflation as of 2006).[6] The project was not completed, however, until December 2007, at a cost of over $14.6 billion ($8.08 billion in 1982 dollars)[6]as of 2006.[7] The Boston Globe estimated that the project will ultimately cost $22 billion, including interest, and that it will not be paid off until 2038.[8]


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Dig
What's that got to do with anything?
Sure if you had workers making $7.00 an hr it would have been cheaper. How much of the overun was material costs.
My sister lives right in the middle of the dig and plenty of unforeseen things come up when you bury your highway system, especially when you have to keep out the ocean. Minor details like that.
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Old 03-01-2012, 06:20 PM   #291
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Re: Joining A Union


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Originally Posted by TimNJ View Post
So, Italian, how many of your employees are you paying $50-60hr with vacation, pension, health benefits.

.
How many of my emlpoyees make 50/60$ hr?

None

How many of my emloyees deserve 50/60$ hr you think?

None.

You have to realise one thing(as union supporter) that most of non-union companies do not possess the great backroom deals with work pouring out of arse like union does.

Hence,we can pay only that much.As I mentined before if I pay all the benefits and etc+upper side of union wages I will run myself out of market.

I dont want to give this a political note,but ever considered why North American economy is in ****ter? Maybe its because of unions willing to pay 60k to people without high-school diploma to put plastic bumper together?

I seen enough of how unions operate(Including Italy),I am not hating on guys who are union,I am hating on system.

Union wage here is 34+bennies for journeyman.

I pay 27-34.(27 and up).
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I hate when a profitable job becomes a charitable write off.
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Old 03-01-2012, 06:23 PM   #292
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Re: Joining A Union


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What's that got to do with anything?
Sure if you had workers making $7.00 an hr it would have been cheaper. How much of the overun was material costs.
My sister lives right in the middle of the dig and plenty of unforeseen things come up when you bury your highway system, especially when you have to keep out the ocean. Minor details like that.
When union was building airport here,estimated 1.5 million dollars all in...then they came to goverment and said:

"hey we screwed up,we need 4.8 million more"

How do you underestimate by 2.5x is still mind-boggling to me.
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I hate when a profitable job becomes a charitable write off.
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Old 03-01-2012, 06:30 PM   #293
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Re: Joining A Union


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When union was building airport here,estimated 1.5 million dollars all in...then they came to goverment and said:

"hey we screwed up,we need 4.8 million more"

How do you underestimate by 2.5x is still mind-boggling to me.
That's what happens when you take "low bidder".
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Old 03-01-2012, 06:32 PM   #294
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Re: Joining A Union


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That's what happens when you take "low bidder".
Thats right...what if that low bidder is union?

Just one of the points I am trying to point out to you.

Trust me I am not hating on unions,I do want people who dont have ambition/desire to open their own companies make as much money as they can.

Truth is when you review unions,disadvantages and screws up they have are faaaaaaaaaar bigger than any advantages they may have.
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Quote:
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I hate when a profitable job becomes a charitable write off.
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Old 03-01-2012, 11:06 PM   #295
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Re: Joining A Union


Here unions build this subdivision from a farm field to a finished neighborhood. All infrastructure, streets, sidewalks homes from slab to turnkey all at a competitive market place price. Every year some of these models win awards in the parade of homes here on Oahu. The whole time every one is making a living wageGee I wonder how it's done You remember Gentry didn't he die in a boat?
http://www.gentryhawaii.com/
Oh by the way the lazy union guys build the light green one in 60 working days from the time they walk on the slab to turnkey
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Old 03-01-2012, 11:10 PM   #296
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Re: Joining A Union


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Here unions build this subdivision from a farm field to a finished neighborhood. All infrastructure, streets, sidewalks homes from slab to turnkey all at a competitive market place price. Every year some of these models win awards in the parade of homes here on Oahu. The whole time every one is making a living wageGee I wonder how it's done You remember Gentry didn't he die in a boat?
http://www.gentryhawaii.com/
Oh by the way the lazy union guys build the light green one in 60 working days from the time they walk on the slab to turnkey
Yeah. Farmers are building sub-divisions here
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Old 03-01-2012, 11:13 PM   #297
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Re: Joining A Union


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Here unions build this subdivision from a farm field to a finished neighborhood. All infrastructure, streets, sidewalks homes from slab to turnkey all at a competitive market place price. Every year some of these models win awards in the parade of homes here on Oahu. The whole time every one is making a living wageGee I wonder how it's done You remember Gentry didn't he die in a boat?
http://www.gentryhawaii.com/
Oh by the way the lazy union guys build the light green one in 60 working days from the time they walk on the slab to turnkey
I know at least 3 contractors in Winnipeg who build simlar homes,on regular basis,with non-union workers/subs who also win awards.

And I can assure you that they can get in and out in 45 days.
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I hate when a profitable job becomes a charitable write off.
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Old 03-01-2012, 11:18 PM   #298
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Re: Joining A Union


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Here unions build this subdivision from a farm field to a finished neighborhood. All infrastructure, streets, sidewalks homes from slab to turnkey all at a competitive market place price. Every year some of these models win awards in the parade of homes here on Oahu. The whole time every one is making a living wageGee I wonder how it's done You remember Gentry didn't he die in a boat?
http://www.gentryhawaii.com/
Oh by the way the lazy union guys build the light green one in 60 working days from the time they walk on the slab to turnkey
I always thought your state had no room to build, but from your posts I must have been misled.
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Old 03-01-2012, 11:40 PM   #299
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Re: Joining A Union


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Yeah. Farmers are building sub-divisions here
Where is here you have no location listed

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Originally Posted by TheItalian204 View Post
I know at least 3 contractors in Winnipeg who build simlar homes,on regular basis,with non-union workers/subs who also win awards.
My point was all the workers make a living wage, oh that's right you really don't know what that is. Thats when you have the best health ins. available, when you get 10,000 a year vacation pay and you have 5.00 per hour put into your 401K on top of your hourly pay
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And I can assure you that they can get in and out in 45 days.
You guess they can but really don't know, I do know! I know how many hours each step of those homes takes.
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Old 03-02-2012, 12:00 AM   #300
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Re: Joining A Union


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My point was all the workers make a living wage, oh that's right you really don't know what that is.
Sure i do. It's the latest scam all the lefty "Social Justice" goofs are pushing. It's all based on emotion with no basis in reality in the real world of business.

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