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Flooring Leveler

 
 
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Old 11-24-2013, 01:02 PM  
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Flooring Leveler


I'm preparing to do a small bathroom with marmoleum. The floor is completely out of whack and I need to use a good flooring leveler to help take out some of the voids. I want something with good adhesion and good smoothing characteristics. What would you consider to be one of the better products out on the market for me to use? This is only a small 10 by 10 bathroom so its not a really large job. The homeowner isn't that interested in it having to be perfectly level but I want it close because I don't want a call back if it starts to lift. the bathroom is located in the basement and is only for guests.
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Old 11-24-2013, 01:29 PM  
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Re: Flooring Leveler


What's the substrate?

I like SLC I use Mapie. If it is over wood I use the Mapie plastic lath. Make sure you prime the floor.

Tom

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Old 11-24-2013, 09:14 PM  
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Re: Flooring Leveler


CMP makes the best stuff you can get, but they're mostly all the same. Ardex K-15 is sort of the industry standard bearer.

Whatever you buy, just make sure you mix it the way they say and prime the floor first. If you don't prime, it won't work right. It can't because the floor takes too much water out of the mix as soon as you dump it out.
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Old 11-24-2013, 10:18 PM  
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Re: Flooring Leveler


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Originally Posted by tjbnwi View Post
What's the substrate?

I like SLC I use Mapie. If it is over wood I use the Mapie plastic lath. Make sure you prime the floor.

Tom
It going over concrete.
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Old 11-25-2013, 08:48 AM  
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Re: Flooring Leveler


test for moisture
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Old 11-25-2013, 09:43 AM  
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Re: Flooring Leveler


Also use cold, clean, mineral free (no well water) water to mix with.... Warm water will make it set up in the barrel. You also would do well to have a helper with you. You have to move quick and a two bag mix can awkward to maneuver in tight quarters alone.
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Old 11-25-2013, 09:44 AM  
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Re: Flooring Leveler


Properly primed the SLC will bond very well to the concrete. No lath needed.

BKM is correct, check for moisture, If it below grade make sure the product is rated for the application.

If height is not an issue look at Dri-Core.

Tom
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Old 11-26-2013, 12:57 AM  
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Re: Flooring Leveler


No moisture problems. Concrete is 50+ years old and dry. SLC it is.
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Old 11-26-2013, 02:53 AM  
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Re: Flooring Leveler


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No moisture problems. Concrete is 50+ years old and dry. SLC it is.
No guts no glory.

Ardex K15 is what I'd use all day every day.

By the way, I don't know what your level of expertise is on flooring materials, adhesives, underlayment, concrete slabs in a BASEMENT and the moisture issues our industry suffers. I don't want to insult your intelligence or belabor the obvious but basement slabs WILL have moisture issues unless there are very effective barriers underneath the concrete and up around the walls of the basement.

You need to test the slab for moisture.

I don't care if it's 1050 years old. In fact the older the slab the more unlikely it is that the slab was DESIGNED for a resilient floor. Who the hell was putting linoleum in their basement 50 years ago? Asphalt-asbestos tiles yes. Linoleum NO. Wonder why?-----tolerance for MOISTURE!

And did you know that self leveling products are an even WORSE idea than linoleum where there are moisture concerns. Yeah, that's a real bad idea. But good luck anyways.

Usually it's all OK. As flooring guys we get called and have to go look at ALL the failures so we get a very warped perspective. I'm aware of that but I want to let you know what could go wrong and WHY.

I assume that's kind of the things we all come here for-------not DOOM AND GLOOM-----just fair warning, right?

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Old 11-26-2013, 12:56 PM  
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Re: Flooring Leveler


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No guts no glory.

Ardex K15 is what I'd use all day every day.

By the way, I don't know what your level of expertise is on flooring materials, adhesives, underlayment, concrete slabs in a BASEMENT and the moisture issues our industry suffers. I don't want to insult your intelligence or belabor the obvious but basement slabs WILL have moisture issues unless there are very effective barriers underneath the concrete and up around the walls of the basement.

You need to test the slab for moisture.

I don't care if it's 1050 years old. In fact the older the slab the more unlikely it is that the slab was DESIGNED for a resilient floor. Who the hell was putting linoleum in their basement 50 years ago? Asphalt-asbestos tiles yes. Linoleum NO. Wonder why?-----tolerance for MOISTURE!

And did you know that self leveling products are an even WORSE idea than linoleum where there are moisture concerns. Yeah, that's a real bad idea. But good luck anyways.

Usually it's all OK. As flooring guys we get called and have to go look at ALL the failures so we get a very warped perspective. I'm aware of that but I want to let you know what could go wrong and WHY.

I assume that's kind of the things we all come here for-------not DOOM AND GLOOM-----just fair warning, right?
I'll let you go ahead and rain on my parade.going with the Ardex and I'll let it set for about 4-5 days before I go and put the flooring down. It's just what I'm told to do. It's the boss's job and its not my name on the door just my name in front of the home owner.
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Old 11-26-2013, 12:58 PM  
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Re: Flooring Leveler


Thank you everyone for your input it's been much appreciated.
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Old 11-26-2013, 09:20 PM  
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Re: Flooring Leveler


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Originally Posted by Hardly Working View Post
I'll let you go ahead and rain on my parade.going with the Ardex and I'll let it set for about 4-5 days before I go and put the flooring down. It's just what I'm told to do. It's the boss's job and its not my name on the door just my name in front of the home owner.
I work on the same terms. I don't call the shots. I dodge bullets. We take those kinds of risks all the time. Nothing wrong with them so long as all parties are up front.

When things don't work out MY BOSS suffers the financial side affects. I just have to face the repair work and unhappy customers.

I rain on parades all day every day professionally. It's what I do.

But seriously, it'll probably be OK.
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Old 11-28-2013, 06:59 AM  
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Re: Flooring Leveler


LATICRETE NXT might just be another great choice, considering you can go up to 3 inches .. it has to be really good.. I've used it, not disappointed..
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Old 11-28-2013, 08:16 AM  
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Re: Flooring Leveler


Push come to shove, put down Ditra over the SLC. It will mitigate the moisture vapor issue.

Tom
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Old 11-28-2013, 10:35 AM  
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Re: Flooring Leveler


Yeah. If money is no object. What a pain in the ass. Ditra and then back fill all of it?(creating two global cold joints)

There are plenty of products out there that can be surface applied and hold down over twenty pounds. I think Durabond D-250 holds down 14 all by itself with one coat. Over twenty pounds with two coats.
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Old 11-28-2013, 10:50 AM  
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Re: Flooring Leveler


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Yeah. If money is no object. What a pain in the ass. Ditra and then back fill all of it?(creating two global cold joints)

There are plenty of products out there that can be surface applied and hold down over twenty pounds. I think Durabond D-250 holds down 14 all by itself with one coat. Over twenty pounds with two coats.
I have to agree here. Ditra is a good product and there are times when it's perfect for the situation but there are plenty of times it makes no sense.
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Old 11-28-2013, 09:55 PM  
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Re: Flooring Leveler


Quote:
Originally Posted by ccoffer View Post
Yeah. If money is no object. What a pain in the ass. Ditra and then back fill all of it?(creating two global cold joints)

There are plenty of products out there that can be surface applied and hold down over twenty pounds. I think Durabond D-250 holds down 14 all by itself with one coat. Over twenty pounds with two coats.
The floor needs to be leveled no matter what. Mortar down the Ditra, pour the SLC on the Ditra if you really want to block the moisture. Set the tile on the SLC. At my cost, about $75.00 in additional material.

I just looked, the D-250 would cost me about 3 times what the Ditra would.

Tom

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Old 11-29-2013, 09:32 AM  
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Re: Flooring Leveler


That could only be true if the Ditra was stolen. Even getting it direct from their Pennsylvania plant, Ditra costs well over a dollar a foot, and you still have to buy thinset to put it down with and you have to dump God only knows how much stuff on the floor to back fill it.

I think you need to buy a better calculator. Yours is broken.

BTW: This is about a 10x10 bathroom. But hey, you can always buy a bucket of watered down latex from Forbo for $500(!!??) hehe

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Old 11-29-2013, 04:17 PM  
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Re: Flooring Leveler


If you can't get the Ditra for .75 a square foot you need to find a new supplier. You can order it on Amazon for $1.22 a square foot. At $122.00 for the Ditra it is still less expensive than the D-250. Reread my post it states "material", either product will take some labor. Add $7.00 for the bad of mortar.

According to the OP the SLC is getting poured no matter what. That cost is a wash. You would actually use less self leveling compound. The ribs of the Ditra take a space that the SLC will not have to fill. My calculator works very well, I can tell you over the 100 square feet there is 225 cubic inches of space that the ribs on standard Ditra will take. That is a space the SLC does not need to fill.

Tom



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Old 12-04-2013, 08:52 PM  
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Re: Flooring Leveler


If you can't get the Ditra for .75 a square foot you need to find a new supplier.

If you're getting Ditra for 75 cents, you're buying it at a pawn shop. What does your pawn shop charge for Hardi? 3 dollars a sheet?

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