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90 Year Old Poured Basement Walls Problem (pics)

14K views 32 replies 10 participants last post by  Fouthgeneration 
#1 · (Edited)
Hello all, great site.
I am in the process of starting a remodel on a two story farm house that was recorded in the county in 1924. The frame of the structure is very sound but the basement walls are concerning to me. They appear to be deteriorated from years of water infiltration. They do not appear to be bowed in any way and the sill is sitting square on the top of the wall. With that said the interior of the walls are very loose. I am able to dig fairly effortlessly into the walls with my pocket knife. My question is whether it is prudent or even possible to repair these walls, or would we be better off jacking the house up and repouring new? Pics are below. Thanks for any insight.

Also, forgot to mention that in various places along the top of the wall there have been newer concrete blocks added at some point. I assume to shore up the wall, but i don't know the history/story on that.
 
#4 ·
If you want to know if foundation structurally safe, you should consult with a local Engineer and have him evaluate structural integrity of your foundation.

With that said, the crumbling lose stuff you see could be built up layers of salt which separated the layer of paint (if it was painted) or this could be just the surface of the concrete itself, because in those days the concrete was mixes on site and it looked like sand with pebbles.
Use heavy duty steel brush and remove lose particles, wash down the walls with good quality concrete cleaner that will remove the excess salt deposits, let it dry and see what happens... and if the wall is sound you can simply repaint with waterproofing paint like drylock.

If you pick any place on the foundation wall, and you can pick a hole in it to the other-side with a pocket knife, defiantly contact an engineer.

Good luck
 
#5 ·
Thanks for the reply Greg. I had an engineer out to the site a week or so ago to inspect the walls but he left much to be desired. I thought he would do some type of testing on the walls but no such luck. What you are saying makes sense, but the problem is drying it out. That leads to another question. I'm fairly scared to dig down the outside of the foundation to put drainage in for fear of the wall or walls collapsing. Is that a valid concern? Part of me thinks that the walls would be ok if I could drain the perimeter properly and put some type of waterproofing on the outside. I just worry about causing a collapse while excavating down to get that done. Any thoughts?
 
#8 · (Edited)
To give you a cost comparison... From the estimates I have been given, to jack up the structure and pour new walls, waterproof outside with "bubble wrap", and install drainage is going to come to a little over 20k. This does not include excavating the old walls. Still working on how to even go about that. The house is located in Southern Indiana if some of you are familiar with pricing in certain areas.

Edit: Another detail I forgot to mention is that the walls don't appear to have reinforcement, which I'm sure most of you assumed given the age of the house but I wanted to mention this as well.
 
#12 ·
When you say dig away, do you mean start digging around the perimeter to install the drainage and waterproof? Are you saying that the 2 inches of product will reinforce the walls enough not to worry about collapse when excavating?
Who's going to build the forms? What kind of contractor gives you a quote for lifting a house and pouring new foundations without including the excavation? No mention of footings? Are you a contractor? That price and that description don't make any sense to me.
 
#15 ·
You need to know if they concrete is good or not. Keep calling people until you get someone with experience testing concrete.

Me personally I would just bash at it with a 5' wrecking bar, whatever its called, and if I felt like it was strong enough then it was strong enough.

But im not "an expert".
 
#17 ·
Hey Slick, I’ve got a few questions and concerns here.

First, what have you been contracted to do? Have you informed the homeowner about your concerns with the foundation? Is the home owner prepared to invest in whatever you were contracted to do and put a new $20k foundation under it?

Is the basement to be finished? Is the HO happy with the basement as it is? If there are no plans to finish the basement, have you looked into piers (either pins or helical)?

It seems to me that a 1924 farm house in Indiana (I’m originally from Indiana) isn’t really a novelty. I don’t think the Indiana Historic Society is too concerned about running out of them in the near future. Have you looked into scraping it and building a 2014 two story farm house on a 2014 foundation?
 
#20 ·
I'm the owner of the house. We farm and purchased the property with the house on it a few years back right before the previous owner passed away. He had updated the windows, put new vinyl siding on, updated the electrical and it has a new metal roof. The structure of the house is in very good shape. We have it stripped down to the studs with all of the old lat and plaster gone. It will be like a new house when finished. The way I figure the cost of framing a new house alone would out weigh the extra cost of paying to jack up this one. I would have to pour new walls whether building a new house, or repouring new under the existing structure.
 
#27 ·
Slick another point I must have missed is your referring that this post pertains to full basement. By the dimensions you have provided there must be structural piers or columns of some form or another? That are spanning those distances so maybe the current structural components are capable in conjunction to maintain integrity. An engineers consultation could save you a heap of money.
 
#32 ·
I should re prase. the airbags are for raising but the house still sits on cribbing and beams, but rather than raising and building one level of cribbing, then raising again and cribbing again etc..., the airbags go in, raise it up, cribs get built or beams are installed, then when foundation is done airbags are reused to raise off the cribbing and lower it into place
 
#33 ·
If the intention is to waterproof the existing walls, maybe after powerwashing clean and plastering the 'weathered' exterior, any lifting of the house would make it MORE likely for the original walls to "fall over". NO jacking needed or wanted. Only if part of the concrete wall had settled would jacking that area be needed.

Installation of a moisture barrier to stop the rotting of the Mud sill would also require a travelling lift. (the low strength concrete will always be wicking moisture from the Earth toward any dryer locations)sealing the two vertical faces will increase the amount of moisture at the remaining openings.

A prudent owner/ contractor could excavate one wall at a time to avoid any need for shoring.

If the legacy 28' ft square basement is 'hidden' behind porches and lean to additions, they of course might require underpinnng... now would be the time to convert any frost footinged addons to full depth basement.
 
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