Interesting Small Scale Hydro Electric System

 
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Old 02-11-2018, 02:45 PM   #1
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Interesting Small Scale Hydro Electric System


Check this out, pretty interesting...........

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Old 02-11-2018, 04:32 PM   #2
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Re: Interesting Small Scale Hydro Electric System


So many innovative ideas in the energy sector.

These, geothermal, local storage & microgrids, pocket neighborhoods.

And more.

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Old 02-11-2018, 04:47 PM   #3
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Re: Interesting Small Scale Hydro Electric System


Until the EPA gets involved...
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Old 02-11-2018, 05:00 PM   #4
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Re: Interesting Small Scale Hydro Electric System


Worst thing about that is you have to go through DOE permitting for constructing a power plant, plus DEP permitting for constructing by the water, and that may be denied.

And yes, you need a water discharge permit....
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Old 02-11-2018, 05:23 PM   #5
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Re: Interesting Small Scale Hydro Electric System


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Originally Posted by Tinstaafl View Post
Until the EPA gets involved...
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Originally Posted by hdavis View Post
Worst thing about that is you have to go through DOE permitting for constructing a power plant, plus DEP permitting for constructing by the water, and that may be denied.

And yes, you need a water discharge permit....
What's you guys point?
Did you think those things are a big secret?
Are you going to offer your engineering services?
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Old 02-11-2018, 05:36 PM   #6
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Re: Interesting Small Scale Hydro Electric System


What's your point? I can see your tail twitching.

The technology is great. The time and financial barriers to implementing it are not a secret to people like us, but not well known among the rank and file of civilians. For most, things like this seem like a wonderful idea until the deer in the headlights moment.
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Old 02-11-2018, 05:44 PM   #7
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Re: Interesting Small Scale Hydro Electric System


Quote:
Originally Posted by Tinstaafl View Post
What's your point? I can see your tail twitching.

The technology is great. The time and financial barriers to implementing it are not a secret to people like us, but not well known among the rank and file of civilians. For most, things like this seem like a wonderful idea until the deer in the headlights moment.
And this is not a rank and file group, now is it?

Got to be hard getting a campfire going around you two - every time somebody strikes a match you piss on it.




r
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Old 02-11-2018, 06:22 PM   #8
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Re: Interesting Small Scale Hydro Electric System


Oh yeh, and a mod could fix the title spelling on this thread. That would be a positive thing.
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Old 02-11-2018, 06:26 PM   #9
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Re: Interesting Small Scale Hydro Electric System


Microhydro is pretty popular in some countries. Chinese companies have been exporting theirs for a number of years. Microhydro in the US is way more expensive than putting up solar panels for your house.


The major design feature, as I see it, is it's fish friendly and requires no dam. Hydro dams in the US are being torn out to allow fish and eel migration.

The downside to the design is it never will harness the hydropower potential of a given stream, brook, or river.

If microhydro compliance wasn't a factor, I'd have one slready.
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Old 02-11-2018, 06:32 PM   #10
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Re: Interesting Small Scale Hydro Electric System


Cool concept...

That being the case, with only the potential of powering 60 homes according to the video, don't see how it's a practical alternative in the US... maybe in other less developed areas of the world that are working on it until they get mainstreamed...


Well, except maybe a water slide for fish...
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Old 02-11-2018, 06:46 PM   #11
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Re: Interesting Small Scale Hydro Electric System


I don't see a downside.

Anytime you can implement a long term, non disruptive, non environment impacting power source, I see that as good.

I'm biased. I grew up with small & large hydro plants.

It wasn't until I was well into my 30s that I understood the havoc dams play with fish and other aquatic denizens.
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Old 02-11-2018, 07:26 PM   #12
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Re: Interesting Small Scale Hydro Electric System


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I don't see a downside.

Anytime you can implement a long term, non disruptive
, non environment impacting power source, I see that as good.

I'm biased. I grew up with small & large hydro plants.

It wasn't until I was well into my 30s that I understood the havoc dams play with fish and other aquatic denizens.
I like the concept but there are definite downsides at generating electric for only 60 homes per unit... all you need to do is look at the infrastructure issues with bridges...
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Old 02-11-2018, 09:50 PM   #13
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Re: Interesting Small Scale Hydro Electric System


With all of the environmental laws as well as rabid environmentalists (as in zealots) to have to deal with , any new technology, as well as many existing technologies, most new stuff will take place outside of the U.S..
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Old 02-11-2018, 10:55 PM   #14
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Re: Interesting Small Scale Hydro Electric System


The article says dams are mostly built to help local communities. That is not entirely true. Around here they help regulate the flow, silt, and direction of the Mississippi River, and provide locks for boats to move through a deep enough channel.
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Old 03-19-2018, 01:53 AM   #15
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Re: Interesting Small Scale Hydro Electric System


The Spanish-Indian missions in Texas had very similar low head vertical shaft water mills to grind corn etc....~1600-1800s? the mission buildings were just barely post-stone age, but the hydro impressed my 12 year old self....

For the upper middle class and up, I think pumped water storage in hilly terrain is a no brainer, wind and solar and possibly micro-hydro to fill an uphill storage pond, the bigger and higher = more run time between running the back Genny, issues with frozen pipes in most climes.... Super dangerous ice on air in lowered reservoir ponds as attractive nuisance to trespassers/kids.
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Old 03-19-2018, 07:18 AM   #16
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Re: Interesting Small Scale Hydro Electric System


They say it'll power 60 homes and then tell you it's 15KW. That's like one or two homes in the US.
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Old 03-19-2018, 10:02 AM   #17
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Re: Interesting Small Scale Hydro Electric System


15kw is the size of a whole house back up generator. Electric dryer, water heater, stove take a fair amount of peak supply.

In fairness, 15kw was a small scale demonstration.

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Old 03-20-2018, 07:46 AM   #18
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Re: Interesting Small Scale Hydro Electric System


At Leo G: My home bill says ~1.3 KiloWatts 24-7-365, a little higher in the summer time, No kidds, But Gas heat, cooking and Hot water.....

But one does need some extra for starting and running electric motors, like a 7.5 h.p. air compressor 1 phase takes some serious start up Ampacity.

If you got water year around, don't/can't you grow something to burn for heat and hot Water?
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Old 03-20-2018, 08:58 AM   #19
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Re: Interesting Small Scale Hydro Electric System


Quote:
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They say it'll power 60 homes and then tell you it's 15KW. That's like one or two homes in the US.
15KW is $1300 a month. So maybe 10 homes in the US?
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Old 03-20-2018, 11:40 AM   #20
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Re: Interesting Small Scale Hydro Electric System


At 0.12 $ a KiloWatt hour, a 60 KWatt hydro at 50% load year around ~8600 hours grosses only 30,960.00$ a year. Split 60 ways is ~43.00$ pre grid costs..

If the plant lasts 15 years, will half the income cover the concrete and dirt, and generator costs? will ~230,000.00 $ buy a 100 hp generator and the turbine, housing, controls, and concrete flumes for the micro-turbine? In a flood/ice "proof" installation?

Where this is needed is out side where the infrastructure for the concrete exists.....everything would have to be imported...helicopters don't haul much redi-Mix concrete, ask the US Army and former Soviet Army post Afghanistan campaigns.

Theoretical Hydro dam Horse Power = cubic feet / second of water X Head(water fall height) / 8.8

Thus 100 H.P (~60KWatt) = 44' Cubed of water a second x 20 foot head over 8.8, for 31.536 million seconds, a year, =1.388 Billion cubic feet a year water flow needed...

At 25% of annual rainfall in 32" a year area = 8" x an acre foot = 2/3' an acre foot of runoff for every acre of water shed upstream...= 29040 ft cubed, 1.388 billion over 29040 ft cubed =~48,000 acres of water shed needed or about 75 square miles watershed per install, less then 1 home per square mile...... less than five here in my home county....population ~30000 deplorable....

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